Browse Forums Heating, Cooling & Insulation 1 Nov 07, 2011 5:47 pm ------------------------------------------------------- http://homeinkalina.blogspot.com Enjoying our new Concerto with Allworth Homes in Kalina, The Ponds Handover - 28/06/2011 Re: Ducted Air con zoning question 2Nov 07, 2011 5:52 pm The Harder You Try - the Luckier You Get ! Web site http://www.anewhouse.com.au Informative, Amusing, and Opinionated Blog - Over 600 posts on all aspects of building a new house. Re: Ducted Air con zoning question 4Nov 08, 2011 2:08 pm 'A bottle of wine contains more philosophy than all the books in the world.' Louis Pasteur Vegie garden: viewtopic.php?f=19&t=27637&start=0 My Backyard Adventure Re: Ducted Air con zoning question 9Nov 08, 2011 10:45 pm ESB We've just had an Actron ESP+ system installed and we've got it zoned: Main living/dining/kitchen/playroom (open plan) - Zone 1 - 5 vents Clinic - Zone 2 -2 vents Media -Zone 3- 1 vent Study - Zone 4 - 1 vent Main bedroom - Zone 5 -1 vent Beds 2, 3, 4 - Zone 6 - 1 vent each We don't have any constant zone, the system allows me to run only one room if I like without a 'rushing' of air through that vent ... so at night in summer I can run just the bedrooms without wasting energy having an unused zone on. Hey ESB, that sounds similar to what we're getting quotes on do you mind if I ask how much you were quoted?? Your in bundy aren't you?? Thanks in advance --------------------- Sent from my mobile device so please excuse my typing missed cakes. Bec Ducted Air con zoning question 10Nov 08, 2011 11:07 pm Can anyone confirm the Actron systems are actually more efficient at part load? The fact that they can lower capacity and fan speed is one thing (comfort and convenience), but does the end user actually save in running costs, particularly with the premium they are paying on the initial outlay. Keep in mind with any zoning all outlet air must recycle to the return air, if it travels through an area that is turned off then there is not much point turning that area off. Zones give options, but many get too caught up on having too many options. Ducted air takes up to hours to heat or cool, it is climate control not an on/off appliance. Most can zone a house in one to three zones and have plenty of flexibility and an efficiently designed and running system. Good example from the old days still works today as a good base, day (living) and night (beds). Ducted Air con zoning question 11Nov 09, 2011 6:10 am Our system has only just been installed, so can't compare electricity bills, but with all the research my DH completed he kept coming back to Actron and effiency was high on our list of musts. A good installer will set up the layout to achieve best results as well. Like you said with return air ... one supplier zoned ours as I listed above, but had one return air near the kitchen only. Not very efficient when running other ends of the house. Where as the supplier we went with designed the layout with three return air allowing each end of the house to be able to function well (we have a long house - if that makes sense). Edited: typo ... I really like my Actron but I don't lust over it ------------ Sent from my mobile device ... please excuse the typing missed cakes. ~ trying to build our dream home by the sea ~ Re: Ducted Air con zoning question 12Nov 09, 2011 1:20 pm ESB We don't have any constant zone, the system allows me to run only one room if I like What happens if you turn the A/C on, forgetting you have all zones closed? Seems like a disaster waiting to happen Arfur Re: Ducted Air con zoning question 13Nov 09, 2011 2:43 pm Uncle Arfur ESB We don't have any constant zone, the system allows me to run only one room if I like What happens if you turn the A/C on, forgetting you have all zones closed? Seems like a disaster waiting to happen If I read it right, it might not be able to close all the vents. Always needs one opened. That would be a programming thing which would be easy enough to do, or I may be wrong Ducted Air con zoning question 14Nov 10, 2011 6:18 pm Uncle Arfur ESB We don't have any constant zone, the system allows me to run only one room if I like What happens if you turn the A/C on, forgetting you have all zones closed? Seems like a disaster waiting to happen You can't turn them all off at once, the system is pretty smart and won't let you turn the last zone off. . --------------------- Sent from my mobile device so please excuse my typing missed cakes. ~ trying to build our dream home by the sea ~ Ducted Air con zoning question 15Nov 10, 2011 6:21 pm Sir Snagger Uncle Arfur ESB We don't have any constant zone, the system allows me to run only one room if I like What happens if you turn the A/C on, forgetting you have all zones closed? Seems like a disaster waiting to happen If I read it right, it might not be able to close all the vents. Always needs one opened. That would be a programming thing which would be easy enough to do, or I may be wrong Each zone is a labelled button, all I do is press the zones we want opened and a little red light goes on, if I want that zone off I press it again and the little red light goes off. As a default it won't let you turn off the last zone, so if I want to run only the master bedroom and only study is lit up, just press master bedroom first and then study to turn that one off. --------------------- Sent from my mobile device so please excuse my typing missed cakes. ~ trying to build our dream home by the sea ~ Re: Ducted Air con zoning question 16Nov 16, 2011 1:45 pm we were in the US for several years and they have no zones- just vents that you can open or close off- where as in our Aussie home we had 5 zones and was always worrying about the different rooms. Addicted to home design and new colour trends. So many good options- but so few rooms! Re: Ducted Air con zoning question 17Dec 01, 2011 8:42 pm We are about to start building a house. We will have ducted air conditioning. Looking at the traditional way ducted air conditioning is set out, it occurs to me that there are two weaknesses in terms of efficiency. One is the fact, that even though the various rooms and areas have ducts bringing the conditioned air into them, there is only one return vent, usually mounted in the ceiling of the second floor (in a 2 storey home). The weakness I see with this is, that if I want to have just one zone on, as for example at night when I would only want to condition the Master Bedroom ( and any other bedrooms that were occupied), then I can set the air conditioner to bring air into just those rooms (if, of course, it has a separate zones option on the control), however, that same air then has to travel through a section of the rest of the house to get back to the return vent and in doing so looses a tremendous amount of the heat (or in summer - cold) that it had. Why can’t certain rooms, for example the bedrooms and the Home Theatre, have not just a vent to admit the conditioned air but also a return vent to take the air DIRECTLY back to the main unit through insulated ducting and hence save an enormous loss of energy? The other weakness is that, under the existing system, in order for the air to get back to the one return vent, there has to be a space under the doors of the bedrooms and Home Theatre, which of course allows noise to pass through the house. If these rooms had a return vent then the doors could fit closer to the ground and help keep in any noise. By the way, before someone mentions it, I am aware that the main return vent in the ceiling contains the filter and that if you had separate return vents for certain rooms you would have to devise a way of making sure the air from them also passed through the filter. Perhaps this could be done by having the main return vent in a cupboard with a louvered door, whereby the general air would return through the door and the separate return vents from the individual rooms would come into the cupboard through its roof to then allow their air to pass through the filter in the main return vent. By having the main return vent in a cupboard you could also have it lower down and also much easier to reach for cleaning the filter. The cupboard would just look like a large broom closet. Also, of course, the air conditioning unit would have to have the ability to lower fan speeds etc when conditioning just one or two rooms. Has anyone ever tackled this problem? Has any domestic air conditioning company ever thought of doing what I have suggested? Am I going to be told it’s just too difficult or too expensive? Re: Ducted Air con zoning question 18Dec 02, 2011 8:28 am what you say above is correct to some level. However just because you run r/a pipes to each of the bedroom you will have better access to the air however you will also introduce additional loses and then the air cond actually works harder trying to move air around. These pipes will need to be long an thus the air in them will heat up from being in the roof cavity for too long. Basically in a domestic environment this is an over kill. Best to keep things simple and more reliable. You will also have trouble keeping the air outlet far away from the air in let. You will find that the bedrooms heat and cool very easily any way. Re: Ducted Air con zoning question 19Dec 03, 2011 9:38 pm B STAR what you say above is correct to some level. However just because you run r/a pipes to each of the bedroom you will have better access to the air however you will also introduce additional loses and then the air cond actually works harder trying to move air around. These pipes will need to be long an thus the air in them will heat up from being in the roof cavity for too long. Basically in a domestic environment this is an over kill. Best to keep things simple and more reliable. You will also have trouble keeping the air outlet far away from the air in let. You will find that the bedrooms heat and cool very easily any way. Your points are well taken and make sense. However, I still feel that there is a fault with the present system of air conditioning. For example, in our new home we plan to have the Home Theatre at the back of the house on the Ground Floor. When we are watching tv at night we could just have that zone on, but the conditioned air would still have to return via a large part of the ground floor, up the stair well and to the ceiling return vent in the First Floor ceiling, thereby losing a huge amount of its heat (winter) or cold (summer). Also this would necessitate a gap, small, but significant, under the Home Theatre door, to allow such an air return, thereby undoing a lot of the soundproofing qualities built into the Home Theatre. You said that the air would heat up from being in the roof cavity for too long. However, I envisaged the return air ducting to be insulated in the same way the other air conditioning ducting is. You also said that the air conditioning unit would have to work harder to pump air back through return ducts. A valid point. However, my point would be that in the present designs, where the air conditioned air has to return under the doors of bedrooms and Home Theatres, that this greatly restricts air flow and places extra load on the unit. Some may reply that all the doors should be open. This is hardly a solution, because the whole idea of a Home Theatre should be that you can close the door so as not to disturb others inside or outside the house. Similarly, it is hardly practical to tell all residents and guests of a home that they must keep their bedroom doors open all night so that the air conditioner can work properly. I still think intelligently designed return air vents may be worth considering. Re: Ducted Air con zoning question 20Dec 04, 2011 8:09 pm First of all what heating/cooling system are you considering??? I have a basic brivis system where you cant control the output power of the compressor. So on a system like this it is use less designing a system to work with only one room. Secondly the more duct work you have in the roof the less efficient the system the system is. Just because you insulated it doesn't mean it will not heat up. I guess in a big house (very big house) this will be worth looking into, or even double storey houses. It should be possible to do with most system with current technology I have already thought about this previously. All you need to do is wire two zone motors on each relay. One for the air outlet one for the intake. But it still a little more complex than this. 0 6658 Hi all, sorting out the ducted air con for a 350sqm double story house. Does this placement sound reasonable to you? Also, I plan to have 6 zones I think. Living room… 0 0 Hi all, sorting out the ducted air con for a 350sqm double story house. I think i plan to have 6 zones I think. Living room (mainly for entertainment so not used often),… 0 0 |