Browse Forums Flooring & Floor Covering 1 Feb 26, 2011 11:28 pm Hi All, As some of you may have read in my build thread, we are having a few issues with our builder...Ill touch lightly on what has happened, I visited the build 2 weeks ago to find they had used WHITE grout instead of the DARK GREY we had selection..the story goes... 7th August 2010 - We attended Crosby tiles and selected tiles & grout for living/dining/kitchen/entry. We chose dark grey floor tiles, with matching dark grey grout (grout #64). This was all written up on the tile selection sheet and we signed it off and were happy to proceed. This selection sheet was then faxed off to builder. 9th August 2010 - We attended builders office to undertake pre start, signed documents and as far as we knew everything was fine. Turns out our pre start consultant wrote the wrong grout reference number on the 'Supply & Fix' document, that the builder sends to Crosby, acts as a purchase order as such. The issue is we signed this document, our fault for not paying attention to detail (she had written grout #49 but unless you know what the reference numbers mean, you wouldn't know its the wrong grout). Her fault for writing the wrong number - she used the grout number of the grout on display in their small office. That day we also signed our Contract - which states our tiles & grout are as per Crosby Tile Selection sheet # 459845 (the document with the CORRECT grout). The builder is refusing to change the grout to dark grey as they are saying that we signed the 'Supply & Fix' document, which is dated 9th Aug, whereas the Crosby Tiles Selection is dated 7th Aug..so they must taken the later dated document. But our argument is that the contract is also signed 9th Aug and that says as per Crosby tiles selection. My question is...do we have a leg to stand on in terms of building tribunal or fighting this out? I know most would think it shouldn't be this bigger deal, but I think we should be able to go somewhere, pick what we want and have it applied to our house, not get the wrong grout because the pre start consultant has written the wrong reference number down, plus there has been issues after issue for the whole build Honest opinions more than welcome, I just want to know what people think and what you might do if this was you. Thanks The road to success is always under construction House completed April 2011 - slowly making it a home... Re: Wrong grout colour used 2Feb 27, 2011 8:40 am I think it is worth talking to someone at the tribuneral or whatever the process is. I haven't read your build thread but I would be trying to sort something out. I do not know much about tiling etc but when they do the roof tiles they start off light cement?then put a darker stuff over it. Is there anything like that for colour tile grout? Or if they did a colour seal over the grout would that change the colour??? Group Perfect should be able to help you would pm him Craig I think from searching here myself. Hope you get it sorted and have a stress free life once you settle into your home! Re: Wrong grout colour used 3Feb 27, 2011 4:21 pm Human error. Simple as that. We all wish it didn't happen but it can. We could say there should have been a check and double check that it was done as per contract, but that doesn't help much. The solution is NOT to remove and change grout. Far too time consuming, costly and potentially problematic. Colour sealing not only resolves the problem, but gives you the added benefits that come with colour-sealing. Crosby's sell a colour sealer. I think the buiulder should cover the cost to colour-seal the grout. The stuff up arose from their staff changing the number. You unwittingly signed it off, but if tried in court, they wouldn't have a case. B2 Re: Wrong grout colour used 4Feb 27, 2011 4:39 pm Thank you, you are so correct in saying human error, on both parties! I just wanted to know if we were kicking up a stink for no reason or if we had a valid case. Will be interesting to see the next email I receive from builder, as since they have refused to take any blame or come to the party about changing the colour, we have told them we are going to the builders dispute tribunal and given them 2 days notice to come up with a solution before we proceed. I also think that if the rest of the build had been smooth sailing and our CCA had of been decent to deal with then we probably wouldn't be so concerned about this, but its just one thing after another and thought it was time to fight back. Thanks for your help.. The road to success is always under construction House completed April 2011 - slowly making it a home... Re: Wrong grout colour used 5Feb 27, 2011 4:56 pm Hey Zarli, I think asking them to supply and apply a grout sealer is the best option. Definitely put it in writing, and point out any other significant mistakes they've made previously as well, to add weight to your case. I was very very close to walking away from our builder during pre-construction, and a registered post complaint letter did open up the negotiations process (although it didn't end up being resolved completely in our favour) On the building disputes tribunal website there's a standard letter you can copy called a preliminary notice that will allow you to go the tribunal if they don't respond within 7 business days. here's a link: http://www.buildingdisputes.wa.gov.au/default.aspx?MenuID=136 Be aware though that when I enquired it took at least 6 weeks to get a hearing date, that's after you have tried to resolve things informally. Most of the time i think the customers just give up and want to move forward with their build, I know I did ~*~Moved in on the 16th April 2011~*~ Re: Wrong grout colour used 6Feb 28, 2011 2:33 pm Sorry to hear off your problem and I must admit this happens more than one may think. The builder should be liable IMO as your case would be that it is not a homeowners responsabilty to know the codes for grout colours thats for tradesman, it should have been written in plain english GREY grout, builders and tilers will say anything to get out of it. Take it to a tribunal you may find them helping you out before it gets that far. If they do not than let a judge decide not them. If all else fails we do offer DIY grout colour sealing kits which will be launched in 2 weeks, this way you can have a light or dark grey grout but the main purpose is your grout will be sealed, don`t worry about colour choices as we send you a colour chart before purcahse. I hope the building company helps you out with this or you may want to give them my details so I can explain to them the situation . I love talking to builders and tilers they have no hope Craig Re: Wrong grout colour used 7Feb 28, 2011 2:55 pm Zarli, I wouldn't be very happy at all, if the wrong color grout was used. I really feel sorry for you, you pick the dark color grout for a reason, we did. We are having some Charcoal tiles and using a dark grout as well, the main reason being the dirt that shows up in grout. I have had white grout before and spent so much time cleaning them, I vowed I would never have it again on a floor. If the sealer can color the grout, I would ask for that. How on earth could you be expected to know the grout code! and you really wouldn't be thinking, oh, we had better check the grout code to make sure it's right. Why can't people get things right in the first place, it can't be that hard can it? Re: Wrong grout colour used 8Feb 28, 2011 3:26 pm Thats my point exactly, how are we meant to know that grout #49 is white, and not grey...seriously! Well I got an email from construction manager this morning say they can not do anything and this highlights the need for us to pay attention to detail and check everything we are signing The whole experience has been so unprofessional and rude, I can not fathom how such a huge project builder can employ staff with these attitudes. I emailed him back advising the preliminary notice for the tribunal has been sent in the mail, and did not get a reply so far and highly doubt I will. Seems like they are being childish and stubborn, to them it is a drop in the ocean and to us it is a fairly big deal. For the sake of their reputation you would think they would do the right thing. All I can say is Bring It On! I can just imagine that they are all talking about me in the lunch room at the moment The road to success is always under construction House completed April 2011 - slowly making it a home... Re: Wrong grout colour used 9Feb 28, 2011 3:44 pm Yes I totally agree with you, they think we are all a bunch of push overs as once they have your money they simply turn there backs. You can garantee they will play the game but they also hate being taken through a tribunal or to court as this takes up there time and they may lose. At the end of the day they just want to see how far you are willing to go with it, I say go all the way as you do have rights and any normal judge will see your side of the story. In saying that sometimes no matter if we are right or wrong it all depends on the judge, if they do not like you than you may not win and their decision is final. I wish you the best of luck and would love to hear the outcome. Craig Re: Wrong grout colour used 10Feb 28, 2011 4:00 pm Good on you Zarli I would be doing the same thing for sure. You chose your colors for a reason and its obvious that you chose the dark grout at the beginning. They make a mistake and then you get the blame for it! I don't understand how these mistakes are made, it's all in black and white to start with. Best of luck, let us know how you go. Re: Wrong grout colour used 11Mar 04, 2011 4:32 pm deb17 Good on you Zarli I would be doing the same thing for sure. You chose your colors for a reason and its obvious that you chose the dark grout at the beginning. They make a mistake and then you get the blame for it! I don't understand how these mistakes are made, it's all in black and white to start with. Best of luck, let us know how you go. Thanks for your confiedence in me Well we sent the preliminary notice off to them (via registered post!) on Monday and they have not discussed it with us since...so looks like next Thursday we send off the complaint to the tribunal and wait for an outcome. Does the tribunal iteself just send us a letter saying what is going to happen, or do they try and come to some agreement between both parties? The road to success is always under construction House completed April 2011 - slowly making it a home... Re: Wrong grout colour used 12Mar 04, 2011 4:48 pm Normally they will send a letter to out line what may happen on the day. They will hear both sides of the complaint and try and work our a deal that satisfies each of you. If there is no agreement on the day than of to court you go. You will have to go and let a judge decide what is fare. In my experience with building companies they try and bully you at these meetings, to see if you have got what it takes to take it further. I personally would go all the way, it is better to let a Judge decide than these rogue tradesman, stand up and give it to them. I wish you the best of luck at the tribunal remember to stay calm and do not get to emotional I know it is hard but do your best. Craig Re: Wrong grout colour used 13Mar 04, 2011 7:36 pm Yes, stand up for your rights. I am sure the ruling will go your way, it's so unfair to have to go through all of this. Surely they will just do the right thing by you, how good at being silent are they when they don't want something. But if the shoe was on the other foot, you would never hear the end of it. I went to VCAT with my Daughter years ago it wasn't a building issue, but a rental problem, she was the tennant and she did very well. You have done nothing wrong. Re: Wrong grout colour used 14Mar 08, 2011 10:03 pm Good news Today whilst doing the PCI the construction supervisor called me to advise they have decided to change the grout colour (this was after we refused to sign the PCI paperwork ) No apology, although I did mention that the whole thing has been handled very unprofessionally and that we are very unhappy with the builder - his response was if we feel we should be apologised too, then 'sorry'. I didn't take that as an apology. I have the change in writting so should happen in the next few weeks before handover. Thanks everyone The road to success is always under construction House completed April 2011 - slowly making it a home... Re: Wrong grout colour used 15Mar 08, 2011 10:16 pm What a fabulous result Zarli! Congratulations! I have 1 particular 'fix' in writing on 2 separate pieces of paper, signed by 2 different people...and 12 months later they tell me it won't be fixed. We should never have signed the papers either... Best of luck! Henley - Wilshire Mk 3 ... I love my house!! Site start: 4th Feb 09 Handover: 10th Sep 09 Blog: http://stormygirlscastle.blogspot.com/ Build Thread: viewtopic.php?t=7166 Re: Wrong grout colour used 16Mar 08, 2011 10:25 pm Haha oh God, please don't say that! I think after the hard time I gave them today they won't be trying any tricks with us, I think they will be as happy to see the end of me as I am of them! The road to success is always under construction House completed April 2011 - slowly making it a home... Re: Wrong grout colour used 19Mar 09, 2011 8:08 am Great news. I do not like to rain of peoples perade, BUT make sure they DO NOT just skim coat you, which means applying another grout over the top of the exsiting grout this is what we call skim coating and it will not last and look terrible in 12 mths time and there is no fix for a skim coated grouted floor except to replace all the grout. If they do take out all off the exsiting grout which they should be doing at least 80 % off it, than make sure they do not damage the tiles edge as most use grinders and the heat and friction can cause micro chips along the edges. Sorry to giv e this news Zarli but thought I would give you a heads up. Craig Re: Wrong grout colour used 20Mar 09, 2011 5:25 pm I emailed construction manager asking what way they were going to change the colour, havent got a reply...but got a call from the tile company asking me what exactly I would like done. She has said if they were to remove the grout in their currently, it would not have a nice finish and there would be a possibility of damaging some of the tiles. She has suggested an epoxy colourant (??) that has a 15 year gaurntee and not only colours the grout but seals it too, does that sound right? 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