My builder made the wrong height door, what should I do next

lucyhuang · Jul 26, 2023 12:26 pm

Firstly , my architect put the wrong height, 2.4m instead of 2.7m, in his door schedule table although the drawing is correct. Then the build said he just looked at the schedule , instead of drawing , to order the door. So the door was made 300mm shorter.

This is the message from the architect: The builder should read all drawings, reports, schedules and specifications together. They can't say they looked at something and ignored others.
And I know for a fact that they can measure on pdf. Our drawings are to scale. They can't say because there is no measurement they don't know the height of the door.

This is the builder's reply: Regarding the below email... It is unlucky that schedule did not update and i understand that mistakes are made. When I do onsite window measures, I do not look at elevations. I look at the provided window / door schedule. That is what they are on the plans for.

Trying to put this back on the builder is very disappointing as it is a clear mistake made by your team to.
How can you expect a builder to pick up on things if its not picked up by yourselves?

Now I want my door to be 2.7m high, instead of 2.4m high. Builder refused to replace the door for me.

Can someone give me some ideas or suggestion about what should I do next? Thanks Like ⋅ Add a comment ⋅ Pin to Ideaboard ⋅

Like ⋅ Add a comment ⋅ Pin to Ideaboard ⋅

Pulse · Jul 26, 2023 1:31 pm

I’d just accept the 2400mm door, it is already huge and probably saved you some money. Mistakes happen, you can’t expect the builder to measure off the plan, the mistake is the architect’s. The builder might have picked up on it if the size indicated on the elevation.

if it is critical for you, maybe offer to split the cost of the new door. What size is the opening? does it suit the 2400 or 2700 door

alexp79 · Jul 26, 2023 1:42 pm

I think it will look okay with 2400 doors too (both of them), as it will align with the height of garage doors.
What about second door? D1.01 - was it done to spec?

strannik · Jul 26, 2023 3:16 pm

ask the builder if you can still do a variation to replace the door. you'll have to pay for it though. usually all the pretty pictures come with the caveats that builders don't look at them and they are for illustration purposes only.

chippy · Jul 26, 2023 11:32 pm

That's a hard one with regards responsibility.
It will definitely look better to be full height as drawn on the elevation. All the window heads will line up.
The garage opening is irrelevant as it's going to be hidden by the slatted feature.
The builder will have given the plans to the window company and they have probably just read the schedule without even looking at the plans, but someone while building and framing should have picked up that the heads on the elevation are all at the same height and a question should have been asked.
However the architect should have got it right. They get paid a lot and unfortunately never want to accept responsibility for things.
The framing should be able to be changed relatively easily it would be a question as to whether the door frame has already been made.
If it's already made then it's an expensive proposition to change it, however now will still be the cheapest time to change it if it's important. Maybe see if it can be split. Really the builder and architect should be splitting the cost as they both bear some responsibility.

chippy · Jul 26, 2023 11:52 pm

lucyhuang
Just out of interest is the front window the correct height? The picture of your build almost looks like the head of the window is lower than what the elevation shows.
The elevation looks like the heads should be right up to the porch/portico ceiling line whereas what is built looks proportionally lower.
Might be worth checking that the architect has got all the dimensions and schedules correct and the builder is getting it right.

Ashington Homes · Jul 27, 2023 4:42 am

lucyhuang

Firstly , my architect put the wrong height, 2.4m instead of 2.7m, in his door schedule table although the drawing is correct. Then the build said he just looked at the schedule , instead of drawing , to order the door. So the door was made 300mm shorter.

This is the message from the architect: The builder should read all drawings, reports, schedules and specifications together. They can't say they looked at something and ignored others.
And I know for a fact that they can measure on pdf. Our drawings are to scale. They can't say because there is no measurement they don't know the height of the door.

This is the builder's reply: Regarding the below email... It is unlucky that schedule did not update and i understand that mistakes are made. When I do onsite window measures, I do not look at elevations. I look at the provided window / door schedule. That is what they are on the plans for.

Trying to put this back on the builder is very disappointing as it is a clear mistake made by your team to.
How can you expect a builder to pick up on things if its not picked up by yourselves?

Now I want my door to be 2.7m high, instead of 2.4m high. Builder refused to replace the door for me.

Can someone give me some ideas or suggestion about what should I do next? Thanks Like ⋅ Add a comment ⋅ Pin to Ideaboard ⋅

Like ⋅ Add a comment ⋅ Pin to Ideaboard ⋅

Lucy,

For what it is worth I think your builder is in the wrong and they should fix the doors ( and windows).

The builder has a responsibility to read the plans and pick up any discrepancies, especially for such a fundamental element as the facade and not simply rely on a door schedule. It is so obvious looking at your facade elevation that the door is not 2400mm

Reframing it should be simple. The line I would be taking is that you have an approved set of drawings that are in the contract and you expect them to build to those drawings.

There is also normally and order of precedence in contracts which covers discrepancies in documents so read your contract and see if that helps.

Finally, I am with Chippy, looking at the plans v the photo you posted I think they have framed your windows incorrectly as well. Have a chat to them about that.

All the best

Simeon

lucyhuang · Jul 27, 2023 4:47 pm

Thanks for all of the above 's comments. Anybody who has legal experience or background can comments about the responsibilities for either the builder or architect?

Mirrmu83 · Jul 27, 2023 6:53 pm

who do you have contract with?

lucyhuang · Jul 27, 2023 9:05 pm

Mirrmu83

who do you have contract with?

Both.

strannik · Jul 28, 2023 10:23 am

lucyhuang

Thanks for all of the above 's comments. Anybody who has legal experience or background can comments about the responsibilities for either the builder or architect?

this would be where you get legal advice from a lawyer, as none of us saw the contracts you have signed

Ashington Homes · Jul 28, 2023 12:49 pm

lucyhuang

Thanks for all of the above 's comments. Anybody who has legal experience or background can comments about the responsibilities for either the builder or architect?

Lucy,

Not a lawyer but I have been building and developing for far too long so I have a pretty decent understanding of how these things work, but you should still get legal advice.

Essentially what you will find is that the plans form part of the contract and the builder has contracted with you to build your approved plans, not a modified version of them.

So who made the mistake on the schedule is irrelevant. The fact is that you have an approved facade that has to be built as approved. The builder just can't go and make changes as they see fit. In NSW there is no way a certifier will let you get away with that You have to build as per plan and your builder is ultimately responsible.

They should have been reading the drawings and picked up on the error.

Cheers

Simeon

lucyhuang · Jul 28, 2023 12:59 pm

Ashington Homes

lucyhuang

Thanks for all of the above 's comments. Anybody who has legal experience or background can comments about the responsibilities for either the builder or architect?

Lucy,

Not a lawyer but I have been building and developing for far too long so I have a pretty decent understanding of how these things work, but you should still get legal advice.

Essentially what you will find is that the plans form part of the contract and the builder has contracted with you to build your approved plans, not a modified version of them.

So who made the mistake on the schedule is irrelevant. The fact is that you have an approved facade that has to be built as approved. The builder just can't go and make changes as they see fit. In NSW there is no way a certifier will let you get away with that You have to build as per plan and your builder is ultimately responsible.

They should have been reading the drawings and picked up on the error.

Cheers

Simeon

Thanks, Simeon. Your replies are very helpful.

lucyhuang · Jul 28, 2023 1:00 pm

strannik

lucyhuang

Thanks for all of the above 's comments. Anybody who has legal experience or background can comments about the responsibilities for either the builder or architect?

this would be where you get legal advice from a lawyer, as none of us saw the contracts you have signed

The building contract is a standard HIA format contract.

ponzutwo · Jul 28, 2023 2:36 pm

lucyhuang

strannik

lucyhuang

Thanks for all of the above 's comments. Anybody who has legal experience or background can comments about the responsibilities for either the builder or architect?

this would be where you get legal advice from a lawyer, as none of us saw the contracts you have signed

The building contract is a standard HIA format contract.

except there will be a page fullof special conditions that are unique to teh builder burried in your contract. Take Simeons broad advice - that aspect should also be covered in your contract - ie what takes precedece - usually its the plans for things like openings, windos etc.. But considder legal advice if teh builder continues to try to fob you off.

SJT76 · Jul 28, 2023 4:15 pm

lucyhuang

strannik

lucyhuang

Thanks for all of the above 's comments. Anybody who has legal experience or background can comments about the responsibilities for either the builder or architect?

this would be where you get legal advice from a lawyer, as none of us saw the contracts you have signed

The building contract is a standard HIA format contract.

You need to start with reading it. My contract is the Master Builders Victoria contract, but it has a clause called "discrepancies and ambiguities". This sets out the order of precedence:
1. Special conditions
2. The contract and appendices
3. Specifications
4. Plans
5. Other documents

In my case, the Specifications includes an itemised listing of all doors/windows/cabinetry, etc. Since this takes precedence over the Plans (drawings), the builder would be entitled to rely on this listing if there was a difference.

Your contract is likely different, and you need to go through the definition of each capitalised word to understand exactly what it means.

If it were me, I would point out the clear drawings to the builder and ask them what options they can offer. If these options all cost money, I'd be hitting up the architect to pay it.

strannik · Jul 28, 2023 4:34 pm

lucyhuang

strannik

lucyhuang

Thanks for all of the above 's comments. Anybody who has legal experience or background can comments about the responsibilities for either the builder or architect?

this would be where you get legal advice from a lawyer, as none of us saw the contracts you have signed

The building contract is a standard HIA format contract.

i imagine you also have another contract with an architect? and yeah, whatever other's said about special conditions and appendices