Browse Forums Building Standards; Getting It Right! Re: Patio slab same as house? 2Aug 03, 2018 7:00 am anonamoose Welcome to the forum, that looks like a nice deign and is a standard waffle slab, Cheap and potentially nasty, void former's are used to improve slab stiffness, thermal beaks will need to be engineered, Talk to an engineer about alternate details, but I suspect your builder won't be interested. BTW I would recommend you increase slab thickness, for tiled areas. hth Designer,Engineer (Civil,Const & Envir),Builder,Concrete & Masonry Contract.Struct Repairs Re: Patio slab same as house? 3Aug 03, 2018 8:35 am Thanks so much for replying StructuralBIMGuy, I've spoken to the local engineer who created the design and they have no experience with thermal breaks etc. for residential work. The builder is actually a relative although you are spot on with the interest level I've searched online for an alternate engineer although it's not clear to me what I'm looking for, is this a standard skillset? Re: Patio slab same as house? 4Aug 04, 2018 7:19 am It's not something that structural engineers would look at as architects generally champion insulation, thermal breaks, the built environment,etc here's the problem in a nut shell
Even tho I have the software and knowledge there are other more pressing problems to focus on. hth Designer,Engineer (Civil,Const & Envir),Builder,Concrete & Masonry Contract.Struct Repairs Re: Patio slab same as house? 5Aug 05, 2018 10:26 pm Thank you for your help StructuralBIMGuy, I guess we will go with whats been engineered. Maybe in 15 years or so when we build again things might be better. Will reply to this with our experience once we have lived in our new house a while. Might be of interest/help for someone. Thanks again StructuralBIMGuy! Re: Patio slab same as house? 6Aug 06, 2018 8:13 am You can trust your engineers to give you the best,most cost efficient solution, and if things ever change.."they will be all over it...." You might want to read this VBA is nothing more than a giant failure and there are many on this forum that would agree with this article Goodluck Designer,Engineer (Civil,Const & Envir),Builder,Concrete & Masonry Contract.Struct Repairs Re: Patio slab same as house? 7Aug 06, 2018 1:15 pm For thermal break in your scenario you would need to introduce thicker "double" edge beams around the edge of the internal slab (one edge beam will be holding the internal slab and another one - external) and place XPS/EPS insulation boards between them. Those beams will be located exactly where your currently have your articulation break. Re: Patio slab same as house? 8Aug 06, 2018 2:44 pm alexp79 For thermal break in your scenario you would need to introduce thicker "double" edge beams around the edge of the internal slab (one edge beam will be holding the internal slab and another one - external) and place XPS/EPS insulation boards between them. Those beams will be located exactly where your currently have your articulation break. And you have created a hinge joint , which is subject to movement/Rotation ? Designer,Engineer (Civil,Const & Envir),Builder,Concrete & Masonry Contract.Struct Repairs Re: Patio slab same as house? 9Aug 06, 2018 2:50 pm StructuralBIMGuy alexp79 For thermal break in your scenario you would need to introduce thicker "double" edge beams around the edge of the internal slab (one edge beam will be holding the internal slab and another one - external) and place XPS/EPS insulation boards between them. Those beams will be located exactly where your currently have your articulation break. And you have created a hinge joint , which is subject to movement/Rotation ? ... and I have created two independent/isolated slabs. How come movement/rotation properties will be different from the current implementation? Re: Patio slab same as house? 10Aug 06, 2018 2:58 pm That is a continuous Pod/Slab the 1c step downs are clearly hatched.hth Designer,Engineer (Civil,Const & Envir),Builder,Concrete & Masonry Contract.Struct Repairs Re: Patio slab same as house? 12Aug 06, 2018 3:15 pm Care to share the details ,Calculations/Simulations? Designer,Engineer (Civil,Const & Envir),Builder,Concrete & Masonry Contract.Struct Repairs Re: Patio slab same as house? 13Aug 06, 2018 3:24 pm I have similar set up for rafted slab with piers, so it is a little bit different story. But from what I see, the extra cost will be cost for two extra edge beams along the patio perimeter (concrete and reo mostly). Re: Patio slab same as house? 14Aug 06, 2018 3:36 pm You have the 2 drop beams separated by insulation & Tied Together? How do you propose to transfers Bending Moments & Stresses? Designer,Engineer (Civil,Const & Envir),Builder,Concrete & Masonry Contract.Struct Repairs Re: Patio slab same as house? 15Aug 06, 2018 3:56 pm StructuralBIMGuy You have the 2 drop beams separated by insulation & Tied Together? How do you propose to transfers Bending Moments & Stresses? I have a piered slab and piers are not tied together but are on the same footing and reinforced. Re: Patio slab same as house? 17Aug 06, 2018 6:16 pm Thanks for the details, You have a reinforced concrete Wall Tied into the footings Anonamoose unreinforced Brick walls on those footings will be subject to movement, rotation, tensile stresses and cracking and require Bond beams and reinforcement.your cracking will be hidden under the insulating material,,ingress of moisture will be an issue since you don't have a cavity Designer,Engineer (Civil,Const & Envir),Builder,Concrete & Masonry Contract.Struct Repairs Re: Patio slab same as house? 19Aug 06, 2018 6:33 pm i suggest you get a copy of AS3700 masonry codes hth Designer,Engineer (Civil,Const & Envir),Builder,Concrete & Masonry Contract.Struct Repairs Re: Patio slab same as house? 20Aug 12, 2018 8:14 am Hi Everyone, welcome to the conversation alexp79, Interesting conversations! Yes we have plain brick veneer with timber frame. I've discussed the dual slab idea with our builder and he estimates $10k plus engineering for the dual slab idea, does this sound accurate? I am concerned about movement of two relatively independent slabs although other alternatives such as paving may move as well. I never though it would be this hard Like ⋅ Add a comment ⋅ Pin to Ideaboard ⋅ Thanks for your help StructuralBIMGuy and alexp79, we really appreciate you guys taking the time to reply. Thanks for the insights, that makes perfect sense, and yeah, I will be leaning on the experience of the excavator operator entirely. 6 16048 Firstly the ableflex that has been installed needs (manufactures specification) a sealant cap over the top, preventing water draining down between the slab and the… 3 7718 If your patio is going to be 35 sqm then that's going to need Council Approval. The fact that they previously approved your 25sqm patio will be irelevant 1 5494 |