Browse Forums Building A New House Re: A complex dispute involving the Architect and Builder 2Mar 19, 2018 6:37 am Designer,Engineer (Civil,Const & Envir),Builder,Concrete & Masonry Contract.Struct Repairs Re: A complex dispute involving the Architect and Builder 3Mar 19, 2018 6:41 am mehram Hello everyone, Am seeking some advise in what I think is a unique situation. Our endorsed Town Planning permit showed lightweight cladding foam. A change to the working drawings was requested to instead include 50mm Hebel-like cladding, so that the overall external wall would stay at 75mm. Rebates were requested. The architectural drawings show: 1. The plan shows 90 mm f5 pine timber frame wall, with a notation "All dimensions are to the outside face of the structure" Whereas most drawings with Brick veneer encompass the entire width of 240 mm (Brick-110, Airgap-40, PineFrame-90), my drawing only shows 90 mm 2. The section details however DO show a slab rebate, specifying that the external walls need to be rendered and finished to the manufacturers recommendation. 3. Engineering does not show a rebate (I am told that usually this should be denoted by a hyphenated dash all along the strip footings, but this is not the case) The effect of the above drawing has been that they have been endorsed, a building permit issued, site setout done in accordance with the working drawings, and the slab poured. Fortunately, as it was I who had requested the change orginally, I was acutely aware of the rebate and asked the builder about it on the day the slab was poured. Work has been suspended The builder had no idea, and was planning to affix the cladding to the frame, which would have increased the building envelope in contravention to the planning permit. We now have a situation, where everyone is pointing a finger at the others; while I'm forced to compromise, despite having paid everyone (except the builder for the slab stage). The builder seems to be a callous chap, & definitely has shifty work practices. We still have not reached a workable solution, while I continue to pay holding costs and interest. In the interim, the Building Surveyor has asked for an 'as-is' land-survey of the slab. Without attributing blame, and notwithstanding that I am everyone's client; could you make recommendations on how best to reach a positive outcome, on what appears to be a very messy situation. I would much rather keep this out of the courts, which can lead to a long, expensive and dissatisying process. Please help! I think I know what you are describing, but your explanation would be enhanced by some plans and photos. That said, no one gets of Scott free here, and given a desire to stay out of court or mediation (which serves no one well), compromise is the only solution: * You suggest that the architect is contradictory or at least inconsistent in the plans. * You state the engineer's plans do not show the required detail. * The builder seems to have proceeded based on what he thought was right, but should have questioned the inconsistency. * You requested the change, so had the greatest vested interest to check the chain of amendments to ensure accuracy from request to plan to implementation. * You say you only mentioned it to the builder when the slab was being poured, so it seems no discussion was had beforehand or at least during the formwork setout? * You do not mention the project manager at all, who also had a role to check the accuracy of the plans and bring it together on site. The easiest solution is to make a paper change to reflect the current situation. That is, see if the council can adjust their permit requirements (made up by humans so can be changed by humans). Then get the architect and engineer to change the plans to reflect. They should do this at their cost since they didn’t do it correctly in the first place. Build can then proceed. The harder solution is to make the site look like it does on the plans. If I understand your description correctly, the builder might be able cut the slab to incorporate the rebate. You can ask him to do this at his expense, but I think it would be fairer if you came to an arrangement to share costs. Build can then proceed. In my limited experience architectural and engineering plans are rarely perfect. No one can have an expectation of a perfect implementation if the plans that are the foundation for that are not perfect too. Your project manager has a responsibility, with the builder, to make sure that they are interpreted correctly or amended. As such, there will always be adjustments on site, and someone needs to make a decision as to whether they are in the build, back in the plans, or even further back in the expectation. Re: A complex dispute involving the Architect and Builder 4Mar 19, 2018 6:47 am Yes not a pretty position to be in. In essence having prepared your own drawings (are you talking about an architect or a draftsperson?) you are responsible for their adequacy. On the face of it the builder seems to be innocent party (its not builder's fault if drawings are inadequate) so I am not sure why the description "callous" and "shifty", is it builder's fault works are suspended? Brutally speaking, you have fallen into your own hole and the builder can choose to or not to help you, or to just charge you an arm and a leg whilst you are trying to crawl out. Many builders will be understanding to a point but not all, whilst the work is suspended their productive time is wasted and they have a business to run. Your best course of action is to get a very good building consultant to review your situation and map out what has to be done and do so very quickly ,as you say it is costing you. If you are in Vic I can help you. Foremost Building Expert in Australia,assisting with building problems/disputes, building stage inspections,pre-contract review advice for peace of mind 200 blogs http://www.buildingexpert.net.au/blog Re: A complex dispute involving the Architect and Builder 5Mar 19, 2018 7:10 am mehram Called it the way it is Incompetent or forgetful..the client always pays The designer is incompetent or forgetful for not checking the details against the plans and the builder is either incompetent or forgetful in not checking plans or an expert in squeezing clients for post contract variations based on mistakes. Technology was supposed to fix all that (Coordinate, data, drawings & Details) unfortunately not in your case Did you get a pretty Architectural rendering/model of how the house would look?..Pity you didn't get a rendering/model of the engineering /construction Details that everyone understood I seem to recollect a warning about a year ago here Anyone used masterwall before Designer,Engineer (Civil,Const & Envir),Builder,Concrete & Masonry Contract.Struct Repairs Re: A complex dispute involving the Architect and Builder 6Mar 20, 2018 6:55 am Yes a professional builder should check the plans for himself but builder is not underwriter for accuracy and adequacy of architectural and engineering drawings. Architects and engineers are paid handsomely for their work and should ensure their drawings are cross checked for accuracy and competency. There are other issues here. If an Architect was engaged for the drawings why was he/she not retained for contract supervision, inspections and administration. Had that been done then the present problem is unlikely to have been undetected until too late. My money is on the formula below that I have seen soo many times before Cheap draftie- competent inspections=present problems Foremost Building Expert in Australia,assisting with building problems/disputes, building stage inspections,pre-contract review advice for peace of mind 200 blogs http://www.buildingexpert.net.au/blog Re: A complex dispute involving the Architect and Builder 7Mar 20, 2018 7:49 am building-expert and StructuralBIMGuy, while I don't disagree with your assessments, doing a post-mortem is less important than providing suggestions on how the issue can be rectified or adjusted for to get the project back on track. Re: A complex dispute involving the Architect and Builder 8Mar 20, 2018 8:36 am I think I have done my bit in my first post "Your best course of action is to get a very good building consultant to review your situation and map out what has to be done and do so very quickly ,as you say it is costing you. If you are in Vic I can help you." And yes, post mortems are useful because they might just prevent someone else from blundering. Foremost Building Expert in Australia,assisting with building problems/disputes, building stage inspections,pre-contract review advice for peace of mind 200 blogs http://www.buildingexpert.net.au/blog Re: A complex dispute involving the Architect and Builder 9Mar 20, 2018 9:37 am “The builder seems to be a callous chap, & definitely has shifty work practices” I’d like clarification on this statement 🤔 This person is building your dream, a major emotional and financial commitment. Just wondering how much research you did on choosing a builder in the first place?? Re: A complex dispute involving the Architect and Builder 10Mar 20, 2018 10:23 am gillybean “The builder seems to be a callous chap, & definitely has shifty work practices” I’d like clarification on this statement 🤔 This person is building your dream, a major emotional and financial commitment. Just wondering how much research you did on choosing a builder in the first place?? Re: A complex dispute involving the Architect and Builder 11Mar 20, 2018 11:01 am mehram an engineer can recommend changes to the footing design if requested It depends on the geotech report and soil bearing capacity.. Should the builder hire the engineer to make changes in order to save money, I recommend you get an alternate engineers opinion.Unfortunately the MBA & HIA contracts (which you signed?) favours the builder with changes...now you will need to be vigilant, methodical and see if there is a problem in the future... your remedy will be through the courts (and for now let's hope not) Designer,Engineer (Civil,Const & Envir),Builder,Concrete & Masonry Contract.Struct Repairs Your build is relatively simple, I believe your job can be easily done by a good building designer, you really do not need to pay for the architect. Remember, architect's… 3 11252 yes it does, you've just not understood it. theres a difference. 4 5737 I've just had a look at the website. The company are just building broker's. There are plenty of similar companies that basically draw your plans (they own them so you… 8 11705 |