Browse Forums Building A New House Re: HIA building contract review by a building lawyer 4Jul 30, 2017 1:27 pm well i was thinking the same the HIA contract in many clauses neutral but in some cases it's biased towards the builder ,it can be easily noted when compared with the .consumer.vic.gov building contract. https://www.consumer.vic.gov.au/library ... -homes.doc Re: HIA building contract review by a building lawyer 5Jul 30, 2017 1:33 pm wongbruce alwayslearning Hi, whats your opinion on getting a legal advice on a HIA building contract review by a building lawyer. contract is with a small builder Location Tarneit,VIC. Can I be honest with you? As a lawyer I can say that the contract is in plain English and regardless your recourse is not via lawyers if something goes wrong, it would be with the relevant Fair Trading Department in each State. In addition the builder is suppose to go trough the contract with you and the contract conditions are usually non negotiable so you either accept the contract as is and sign or if you don't accept walk away. I think you could be wasting money to a lawyer for no reason whatsoever. Sure most lawyers would be happy to take your money and read it out to you essentially what is in the contract that you could do yourself but as a lawyer I'm honest with my clients and I'm being transparent about this. Also make sure you check the builders reviews, registration and insurance. That is what is important especially when dealing with a small builder. Kind Regards, Bruce "Building an Eden Brae Waldorf 50 in North Kellyville" Blog: http://waldorf50.blogspot.com.au A Mobile Solicitor at Wong & Horta Lawyers Website: http://www.whlawyers.com.au i spoke to a building lawyer and they said ,the fee is 350$ but it would be only verbal advise . Re: HIA building contract review by a building lawyer 6Jul 30, 2017 2:00 pm I disagree with all of the posts here and particularly the one by a lawyer that shows no understanding 1 Does not a building contract anso include drawings, who will review them? (lawyer can't) 2 What about special conditions? Who will check? 3 Small builder is more likely to negotiate because of lack of market power 4 How do you know builder has not double charged or pushed risks and costs on to the owner 5 What about items that are frequent hot spots in cost blow out por contract administration who will advise owner? 6 Who is going to be in the cloud for the owner? etc etc Expect to pay $600-650 for a pre contract review from Building Expert. Is it worth it? Its your most important inspection, once you sign you are stuck. Foremost Building Expert in Australia,assisting with building problems/disputes, building stage inspections,pre-contract review advice for peace of mind 200 blogs http://www.buildingexpert.net.au/blog Re: HIA building contract review by a building lawyer 7Jul 30, 2017 2:07 pm building-expert I disagree with all of the posts here and particularly the one by a lawyer that shows no understanding 1 Does not a building contract anso include drawings, who will review them? (lawyer can't) 2 What about special conditions? Who will check? 3 Small builder is more likely to negotiate because of lack of market power 4 How do you know builder has not double charged or pushed risks and costs on to the owner 5 What about items that are frequent hot spots in cost blow out por contract administration who will advise owner? 6 Who is going to be in the cloud for the owner? etc etc Expect to pay $600-650 for a pre contract review from Building Expert. Is it worth it? Its your most important inspection, once you sign you are stuck. We can all agree to disagree but I can tell you in NSW the HIA Contracts we don't generally get to see them as we deal with many home and land packages. Most builders in NSW will go through the building contract with their clients directly. The special conditions are not onerous and as one other person has posted they are quite neutral. It is important that all consumers abide by the contract and what needs to be done. Kind Regards, Bruce "Building an Eden Brae Waldorf 50 in North Kellyville" Blog: http://waldorf50.blogspot.com.au A Mobile Solicitor at Wong & Horta Lawyers Website: http://www.whlawyers.com.au Re: HIA building contract review by a building lawyer 8Jul 30, 2017 3:47 pm building-expert Expect to pay $600-650 for a pre contract review from Building Expert. Is it worth it? Its your most important inspection, once you sign you are stuck. OP asked about legal advice. Does advice from a building expert constitute legal advice? building-expert 1 Does not a building contract anso include drawings, who will review them? (lawyer can't) 2 What about special conditions? Who will check? 3 Small builder is more likely to negotiate because of lack of market power 4 How do you know builder has not double charged or pushed risks and costs on to the owner 5 What about items that are frequent hot spots in cost blow out por contract administration who will advise owner? 6 Who is going to be in the cloud for the owner? etc etc Our build is covered by a standard HIA contract, but cost plus rather than fixed price. Drawings were not included, so we added them; our schedules were not included, so we added them. It's a relatively straight forward contract and so long as you are willing to read it carefully, negotiate openly, and be concise in your descriptions of additions and deletions, I do not think you need external advice as both the client and builder can check these things in the spirit of progressing to a mutually satisfying outcome. If, from the perspective of a client, your builder does not want to cooperate in this process, you are not off to a good start and perhaps you should be considering another builder. Re: HIA building contract review by a building lawyer 9Jul 30, 2017 8:03 pm arcadelt OP asked about legal advice. Does advice from a building expert constitute legal advice? Our build is covered by a standard HIA contract, but cost plus rather than fixed price. Drawings were not included, so we added them; our schedules were not included, so we added them. It's a relatively straight forward contract and so long as you are willing to read it carefully, negotiate openly, and be concise in your descriptions of additions and deletions, I do not think you need external advice as both the client and builder can check these things in the spirit of progressing to a mutually satisfying outcome. If, from the perspective of a client, your builder does not want to cooperate in this process, you are not off to a good start and perhaps you should be considering another builder. i guess you are very bold as you are going with a cost plus contract Re: HIA building contract review by a building lawyer 10Jul 30, 2017 8:24 pm alwayslearning i guess you are very bold as you are going with a cost plus contract Well, it's a matter of perspective. I think anyone going with a fixed price contract is bold. But of course, banks prefer fixed price, even if it makes building more expensive for the client. Re: HIA building contract review by a building lawyer 11Jul 30, 2017 8:25 pm That's right ,i spoke to two different lenders they said they only accept fixed price no allowances either. Re: HIA building contract review by a building lawyer 12Aug 03, 2017 5:30 pm We have paid a deposit to guarantee a kitchen upgrade package. We had a Preliminary Tender (1) with plans drawn up and needed to make LOTS of changes (they put in things we did not request and omitted things we requested). The Formal Tender (2) came back (no new plans) but it still needed work. Next thing we know, the FINAL Contracts are sent to us and the Sales Consultant is pressuring us to sign. We said we won't because there are still so many inconsistencies and mistakes in the Tender (3). The HIA NSW part of the Contract is obviously the stock standard so we don't have a problem with that. Our problem is that our Sales Consultant just tells us to sign the Contracts and make amendments later. He says that the Contract is legally binding and we HAVE to sign. I understand that we have entered into a verbal contract to build with this builder but want the written plans and Tender correct before we actually sign. Any advice you can give me is appreciated! (first time I have posted!) HIA building contract review by a building lawyer 13Aug 03, 2017 6:38 pm Mum to 3Ms Our problem is that our Sales Consultant just tells us to sign the Contracts and make amendments later. He says that the Contract is legally binding and we HAVE to sign. I understand that we have entered into a verbal contract to build with this builder but want the written plans and Tender correct before we actually sign. Any advice you can give me is appreciated! (first time I have posted!) The very definition of a contract is the acceptance of an offer. If you don't want to accept it there is no contract - not verbal or otherwise. Do not sign anything until you are comfortable and happy, as that indicates your acceptance and initiates the contract. Furthermore, later amendments are liable to cost you in the form of variation of you have struck a fixed price agreement. If you are concerned with the high pressure treatment, I would dump this building company and probably report their behaviour to fair trading to boot. It might not feel like it, but there are lots of builders out there and it makes all the difference working with one who understands what you want and will work together with you to achieve that. But of course, no one works for free, and the saying "if you pay peanuts, you get monkeys" is just as true in the building industry as anywhere else. Edit: just noticed that you have already paid a deposit. Not sure why that happened before documentation was exchanged, so you'll want to check what the refund policy is if you choose not to go with them. Re: HIA building contract review by a building lawyer 14Aug 03, 2017 6:53 pm great advice from arcadelt, just to summarise: building contract must be in writing don't be bullied, they will do it right through the job If your gut feeling is telling you run, then run Foremost Building Expert in Australia,assisting with building problems/disputes, building stage inspections,pre-contract review advice for peace of mind 200 blogs http://www.buildingexpert.net.au/blog Re: HIA building contract review by a building lawyer 15Aug 03, 2017 7:41 pm Thank you so much. That is exactly what we thought. We have paid $2,400 which we are prepared to lose.... they have done plans for us BUT they are inaccurate and now ( 8 weeks later) we find out that the house won't actually fit how we want it to on the block! Although the Council allows 900mm to the boundary ( we allowed 1m) they are saying that because of the fall of the land, we have to have 1.25m. This now means the other side of the house is going to be too narrow for a decent clothesline. VERY concerned that although the SC says "It'll be fine, we'll just do amendments" those amendments could cost $250 each! Wondering if we should go over the SC head and speak to head office? It is a Project Home company we are building with, who also do own design builds (which ours is). Re: HIA building contract review by a building lawyer 16Aug 03, 2017 8:02 pm Golden rule is don't believe or rely on any verbal promises they are useless ,everything needs to be in writing .Seems very unethical SC as they are all ,my house plan has been bouncing between changes for the last 5 weeks luckily , i'm happy with my plan now ,my recommendation is find a small builder with good references . Re: HIA building contract review by a building lawyer 17Aug 03, 2017 8:03 pm Mum to 3Ms Thank you so much. That is exactly what we thought. We have paid $2,400 which we are prepared to lose.... they have done plans for us BUT they are inaccurate and now ( 8 weeks later) we find out that the house won't actually fit how we want it to on the block! Although the Council allows 900mm to the boundary ( we allowed 1m) they are saying that because of the fall of the land, we have to have 1.25m. This now means the other side of the house is going to be too narrow for a decent clothesline. VERY concerned that although the SC says "It'll be fine, we'll just do amendments" those amendments could cost $250 each! Wondering if we should go over the SC head and speak to head office? It is a Project Home company we are building with, who also do own design builds (which ours is). if you paid for the plans then they are yours ,you can take them to other builder Re: HIA building contract review by a building lawyer 19Nov 10, 2017 11:53 am alwayslearning Mum to 3Ms Thank you so much. That is exactly what we thought. We have paid $2,400 which we are prepared to lose.... they have done plans for us BUT they are inaccurate and now ( 8 weeks later) we find out that the house won't actually fit how we want it to on the block! Although the Council allows 900mm to the boundary ( we allowed 1m) they are saying that because of the fall of the land, we have to have 1.25m. This now means the other side of the house is going to be too narrow for a decent clothesline. VERY concerned that although the SC says "It'll be fine, we'll just do amendments" those amendments could cost $250 each! Wondering if we should go over the SC head and speak to head office? It is a Project Home company we are building with, who also do own design builds (which ours is). if you paid for the plans then they are yours ,you can take them to other builder That is not the case the plans belong to the builder..unless they release copyright. Designer,Engineer (Civil,Const & Envir),Builder,Concrete & Masonry Contract.Struct Repairs Re: HIA building contract review by a building lawyer 20Nov 10, 2017 9:24 pm StructuralBIMGuy alwayslearning Mum to 3Ms Thank you so much. That is exactly what we thought. We have paid $2,400 which we are prepared to lose.... they have done plans for us BUT they are inaccurate and now ( 8 weeks later) we find out that the house won't actually fit how we want it to on the block! Although the Council allows 900mm to the boundary ( we allowed 1m) they are saying that because of the fall of the land, we have to have 1.25m. This now means the other side of the house is going to be too narrow for a decent clothesline. VERY concerned that although the SC says "It'll be fine, we'll just do amendments" those amendments could cost $250 each! Wondering if we should go over the SC head and speak to head office? It is a Project Home company we are building with, who also do own design builds (which ours is). if you paid for the plans then they are yours ,you can take them to other builder That is not the case the plans belong to the builder..unless they release copyright. Yes, you are right. Although we drew the original plan, once the builder drew it properly, it apparently became the builders'. We persevered for 23 weeks to get the plans and Tender correct but to no avail. Fortunately, the Company did sign the copyright over to us and we have gone with another builder. You talk about deletions, are they variations or PS and PC adjustments? pleas list them 1 16568 Mofflepop, Are you building around Qld Manly? Building & Legal is a partnership between a construction guy and a construction Lawyer. Construction: we have… 9 25592 The worst thing you can do is sign a building contract without a pre contract review. Over the years many people have come to me with disputes where they just signed… 0 8351 |