Browse Forums Building Standards; Getting It Right! Re: Water Leak issues 23Nov 13, 2016 4:15 pm Foremost Building Expert in Australia,assisting with building problems/disputes, building stage inspections,pre-contract review advice for peace of mind 200 blogs http://www.buildingexpert.net.au/blog Re: Water Leak issues 25Nov 13, 2016 8:25 pm Foremost Building Expert in Australia,assisting with building problems/disputes, building stage inspections,pre-contract review advice for peace of mind 200 blogs http://www.buildingexpert.net.au/blog Re: Water Leak issues 27Nov 24, 2016 7:45 pm Foremost Building Expert in Australia,assisting with building problems/disputes, building stage inspections,pre-contract review advice for peace of mind 200 blogs http://www.buildingexpert.net.au/blog Re: Water Leak issues 29Jan 06, 2017 1:31 am Voice_1 The house was complete, I purchased it directly from the owner builder. My conveyancer stated that I did not even need to undertake a prepurchase inspection as the 13b inspection report would cover in the event that any issue arose as it listed nil defects and nil works pending. That surveyor had already lost his license due to other law suits. That clarifies things a bit. You purchased OB dwelling, likely built by someone who is not a builder and consequently without effective technical supervision. You have relied on statutory mandatory inspections (as you should) but that was compromised by incompetent building surveyor. You have relied on 137B report (as you ought to) but that did not pick up all the issues). Who paid for 137B report? Not you. So it is not your independent inspection for your benefit. Full Stop. You relied on erroneous advice from conveyancer, that independent inspection is not required. As you can see the missing ingredients are: lack of skill and care by the builder. Lack of effective independent inspection and correction during build. Bottom line? NEVER BUY OB BUILT DWELLING (you take a risk it was built by someone with no knowledge of building and you loose much of the protection under building contract. If you do you have rocks in your head. Essentially it is like eating a complex dish prepared by someone who is not a cook. The risk of poor taste? The risk of food poisoning? You work it out. But if you have to, then get best inspection money can buy even then there is a risk of defects covered up (because there were no independent stage inspections during build) Obviously if we could pick up all defects at final inspection then there would be no need for stage inspections. AS CONSUMER YOU ARE NOT PROTECTED BY LEGISLATION BECAUSE IT IS INADEQUATE AND BECAUSE IT IS NOT ENFORCED YOU ARE ON YOUR OWN. You can either grow old waiting for government to protect you or get your own independent inspection. I know that does not help your current situation but may prevent someone else getting into the same situation. Foremost Building Expert in Australia,assisting with building problems/disputes, building stage inspections,pre-contract review advice for peace of mind 200 blogs http://www.buildingexpert.net.au/blog Re: Water Leak issues 30Jan 10, 2017 5:48 pm \"building_expert qebtel you can take any offence you like, I stand by my expertise, I have seen too many bad OB jobs to care to remember. And the same could be said for volume builder homes too if you were going to be balanced. \"building_expert You say "Whilst many OB's do lack management skills, all this means is their build takes longer and costs more than they anticipated. Whilst that regularly happens, it is not factor in the quality of the final build" I disagree!That exposes your complete lack of understanding what building is about or about anything else. Complete lack of understanding? I have have completed two OB's myself, and they were good builds and I have no trades quals. So sorry, you were dead wrong there. \"building_expert A major component of building is satisfactory level of knowledge and mastery of building science, methods, materials, and management or else we would not have degree and diploma courses in building. You dont need a lot of knowleddge to do a removal home, or a kit home. So wrong again there Im afraid. \"building_expert Below is what Building Commission required for registration of domestic builders: "Domestic Builder Registration The competencies herewith are specific to the registration category and class of building practitioner, for the purpose of registration with the Building Practitioners Board, under section 170 of the Building Act 1993. Business management - Knowledge of: • business planning• cash flow budgets• basic accounting principles• employment law• contractors law• communication practice • organisational skills• conflict resolution• problem solving• human resource management• occupational health and safety • insurances– professional practice– employees– domestic building contract• information technology• quality assurance systems • self-development principles.Ability to:• implement financial strategy• interpret accounting documents• use costing information • prepare income and expenditure projections• manage business taxes• monitor financial performance. Building technology Knowledge of:• Australian Standards• Building Code of Australia (BCA) 2005• local council requirements• general construction technology terms and methods• Victorian Building Commission’s Standards and Tolerances. Building work management (operational) Knowledge of and ability to:• administer a domestic building contract• establish a building site• apply scheduling methods• apply stock control principles• apply quality control to building works. Knowledge of:• principles and law of contract• building contracts and contract documents• contract administration• dispute resolution• insurances• tendering and estimating• quality concepts• time management. Building work management (supervision) Knowledge of:• insurance claims• tender preparation and documentation, estimating and preparation of a bill of quantities • occupational health and safety issues at the worksite and the workplace• hazard assessment and control• site induction program • site responsibilities of various personnel at a worksite• occupational health and safety principles and practices• roles of site managers and supervisors• establishment and ongoing site maintenance • scheduling• communication• purchasing and record flow. Legislation Knowledge of:• Building Act 1993• Building (Interim) Regulations 2005• Domestic Building Contracts Act 1995• Domestic Building Contracts and Tribunal (General) Regulations 1996 Mostly utterly irrelevant nonsense, you're trying to tell us conflict resolution , scheduling methods, safety principles ,etc have everything to do with a build quality? LOL utter rubbish, thats mostly all fluff that you of course would like to hold up and assume to be a a strict requirement because you have dutifully jumped through the hoops to get your qualification, and of course you make it out to be some holy grail that only those who have done a long course of indenture and paid their professional dues are entitled to. Well no, its musch like any course nowdays, about 1/6th of it is relevant, the other content is msotly useless to pad out the course so that the training industry can make money out of the whole process. University degreees are the same. This country will never be productive with all this rot going on. Its endemic now across the board, I mean now you need to do a course to be a builder labourer....lololol one of the dumbest jobs out there. I did fine when I was 16. \"building_expert OB can do all that without education really? the point is they can produce a good build without all that. So the answer is - yes. \"building_expert There are many competent OB's that have above and I have seen many good builds. I have also seen many good builds that are just dumb luck. And again, you've just admitted no great skill is required. Congratulations \"building_expert Majority are blind captains. If you are buying OB I wish you luck. And then not much different to many tradies whom you could also call blind captains. You have been reading these forum as long as I have and you know exactly what I am talking about, sub standard work is rife in the trade and a lot of the practitioners dont even know they are doing it wrong, , and you have complained about it more than anyone here. building_expert Regardless of anything above, building is essentially on site production system. How is unqualified OB going to to review, validate correct and approve with no technical knowledge (how is he going to read and understand plans?) Why should he if he is employing a carpenter to do the building? Those trades are registered and supposed to be indentured to the relevant standard. If you are talking about a OB swinging his own hammer, then sure what you say applies, but then he should not be doing that unless he knows what he is doing, but irrespective, the various inspections should be picking up faulty work along the way, that is their inherent purpose. building_expert The relevance here is that Voice_1's job was OB and a disaster. No, the relevance was that there was waterproofing issues, and they passed inspection. The OB himself, or the tradie he emplyed to do it could have been as sh0ddy as hell, , but the regulatory framework in place to do checks and balances at the inspection stages failed, and according to you, that is an OB problem. Wrong, its a regulatory problem Re: Water Leak issues 31Jan 10, 2017 6:00 pm building-expert Hi Voice_1 qebtel thinks I was condescending when I said you had bad luck but then look at this: 1 Buying from OB(unregistered builder) 2 Inadequate 137b report 3 Inadequate soil report and engineering design 4 Negligent building surveyor 5 Negligent plumber 6 Perhaps inadequate pre purchase report 7 Wrong advice from VCAT re timing of claims 8 Corrupt building commission Usually just one of the above could give you a splitting headache if all of the above is not bad luck then I don't know what bad luck is. 1. As I have already told you, the same checks and balances apply whether OB or registered builder, so it is irrelevant. 2. Not an OB fault. 3. Not an OB fault. 4. Not an OB fault. 5. Not an OB fault. 6. Not an OB fault. 7. Not an OB fault. 8. Not an OB fault. The fact remains that had all the people , indentured and approved, by Australia's first world regulatory system done their job properly, none of this would have happened. But according to you, its an OB problem because the OB doesnt have the hindsight of an experienced build manager who sees this palaver day in and day out. The point is he shouldnt need that hindsight, refer previous sentence. The fact is Voice_1's way of going about it all was a disaster. Spending 190K on a balcony leak, a bathroom that needed re doing, and leaking sub slab pipes? Something very wrong there. It was an existing house and so its condition was not appraised properly at purchase time. You are saying because it was OB he should have gotten an very expensive inspection regime happening by default, but as I said before, some of the garbage being produced by registered builders would warrant the same level of caution a a lot of the time.. If you make sure all taps inside and out are turned off, what does the water meter show if you leave it for a while. 2 21229 Hi all, I am hoping someone has some ideas as to what is causing my bathroom leak. The leaking appears to mainly happen when we turn the sink basins on. It takes a while… 0 5799 DIY, Home Maintenance & Repair Are you doing this with a building permit? Conversion of a non habitable room into a habitable room requires building permit. 3 19042 |