downlights setting fire to insulation in the roof

clath · Jul 23, 2007 10:48 pm

did anyone see the report on today tonight about the downlights setting roof insulation on fire. apparently this has caused a few house fires. they were talking about the spray in insulation that lands on top of the down light in the ceiling. smoke detectors dont go off. the only time you know of the problem is when your roof collapes or you hear crackling. fire brigade worrid about the problem.

Elizabeth · Jul 23, 2007 10:57 pm

Usually there are holes cut in the insulation to clear it from downlights for this very reason. Of course this means the insulation doesn't work very well! Another reason to steer clear of downlights!

mattwalker · Jul 23, 2007 11:15 pm

Sounds like a case of chicken little here:

The sky is falling, the sky is falling....oh no hang on its the roof on fire.

Did they do a comparison with hard wired smoke detectors catching fire? What about poorly installed wiring? Or those nasty tastics in the ceiling?

Hmmm....

shanem · Jul 24, 2007 12:03 am

We had the blow in insulation on a house a few years ago. Messy stuff.

The people who install it are supposed to place an opened top cardboard protector about 200mm square around the downlight to keep the insulation away .

It pays to check and see if its been done correctly before you pay.

Di · Jul 24, 2007 1:14 am

Hi everyone I missed the show on TV (busy packing, working etc.) we have blown in insulation and also have downlights, I will be asking my builder about this problem tomorrow to see what he says.
Love your answer Matt but I will ask just to make sure, and thank you for letting Perry know about the extra "." I just do not know how I created such a silly blog name or do I, late at night to tired and toooo many wines. (these days just one is toooo many)
Handover Thursday Yea!!!!

http://wwwdjsblogcom.blogspot.com/

commodorenut · Jul 24, 2007 8:16 am

Someone on here actually posted the idea of using cheap ceramic pots over the down lights in the ceiling.

I went & bought 8 of them for the kitchen (downlights fitted by previous owner) as they had simply removed about a 30cm x 30cm section of insulation from around each downlight hole, and piled it up adjacent to it.

I put the pots over the downlights (drainage hole makes a good restricted ventilation hole) and put all the insulation back. I don't know that it makes much difference (can't tell) but it stops the insulation from falling down the sides of the downlight fitting (gimbal type) on a windy day, which is enough benefit to make it worthwhile.

I can recall back in the 80s we had an insulation salesman at the door, and he had a 1c coin that he heated to red-hot with a propane torch. He put a wad of blow-in insulation in the palm of his hand, and sat the coin on it, with no ill-effects.

I thought the blow-in stuff was treated to minimise the fire risk? Surely downlights can't get as hot as the red-hot coin did?.

Maybe it's leaf litter & other debris in the roof space (particularly with no sarking) that is catching alight & providing the fuel source?

Cookiemonster · Jul 24, 2007 8:23 am

clath

did anyone see the report on today tonight

People actually watch that show!? :shock:

Touchingcloth · Jul 24, 2007 10:19 am

does anyone know if insulation is usually put between ground and upstairs in a 2 storey house?

thanks

mattwalker · Jul 24, 2007 10:32 am

Touchingcloth

does anyone know if insulation is usually put between ground and upstairs in a 2 storey house?

thanks

Not usually...No!

ahuang · Jul 24, 2007 2:18 pm

Details in this URL if you missed it (me too!):
http://au.todaytonight.yahoo.com/article/40149/none/downlights-warning

I think if you are building a new house with both downlight & insulation included, it will be the builder's responsibility to get it done properly.

You could have asked them to double check and triple check, but seriously, unless you get an inspector involved, how many of us would have the knowledge to tell whether if it's been installed correctly?

Will certainly put this information on my blog, and get a inspector to check my house!

Cookiemonster · Jul 24, 2007 2:25 pm

This might fit the bill..

http://www.neco.com.au/product.asp?pID=361&cID=115&c=243117

Might need one of these too for the transformer..

http://www.neco.com.au/product.asp?pID=360

ahuang · Jul 24, 2007 5:58 pm

Cookiemonster

This might fit the bill..

http://www.neco.com.au/product.asp?pID=361&cID=115&c=243117

Might need one of these too for the transformer..

http://www.neco.com.au/product.asp?pID=360

Thanks Mark for the info, added to my blog too.

Should get you another T-shirt for this...

Cookiemonster · Jul 24, 2007 6:26 pm

ahuang

Thanks Mark for the info, added to my blog too.

Should get you another T-shirt for this...

No probs.

Im a medium.

perryr · Jul 24, 2007 6:47 pm

The whole downlight danger thing isn't new, but it seems that the tabloid "current affairs" shows like to bring up and old topic from time to time.

If it helps someone, then I guess it's worthwhile.

There's an existing thread regarding the downlight guards:

http://forum.homeone.com.au/viewtopic.php?t=1828

The guards are expensive, and there are a couple of alternatives in the thread. The key thing I think is common sense. Keep stuff that burns away from hot things!

miagi · Jul 24, 2007 7:24 pm

Downlights should be installed by a licenced electrician, who by following the SAA wiring rules will be aware of the provision for installing a barrier or guard around downlights.
This is nothing new, but obviously not done on many occasions, whether by lazy or poorly trained electricians BUT more than likely by people who think that do it yourself is the only way to go.
I have heard that some of the blown in insulation can loose its fire retardation after many years. Apparently the type which is chemically treated to prevent catching on fire...I dont know whether this has merit or not.
Seeing as insurance companies will try and not have to pay out if they can get away with it, I would want to be sure I didn't install my own lights, or for that matter, wouldn't play MR ELECTRICIAN if I wasn't qualified to do so.
Remember fire investigators with the help of Supply Authority investigators know their job very well, and will be often able to figure out the cause of a fire.

epiphany · Jul 24, 2007 10:31 pm

mattwalker

Touchingcloth

does anyone know if insulation is usually put between ground and upstairs in a 2 storey house?

thanks

Not usually...No!

We had to put it in ourselves while they were building because they don't put it in between floors...our site supervisor told us when the gibbing was being done & that they wouldn't remove it if someone snuck in & installed additional insulation before then.

Lo & behold...someone snuck in & we now have a very well insulated media room & master bedroom

mattwalker · Jul 24, 2007 10:49 pm

Heres a new Tshirt for mark....

oh and matching undies:

Cookiemonster · Jul 24, 2007 10:59 pm

Awesome!

lrhodes1 · Jul 25, 2007 4:17 pm

There was more info about this on Carbon Cops last night, you can buy a snap together heatproof plastic cover for downlights that goes in the roof space which you can then place the insulation up against. :-)

Cookiemonster · Jul 25, 2007 4:21 pm

lrhodes1

There was more info about this on Carbon Cops last night, you can buy a snap together heatproof plastic cover for downlights that goes in the roof space which you can then place the insulation up against. :-)

Ummmm, yeah.. check page 1 of this thread. :wink: