Proper carpet laying

michelle... apologies, didn't read who wrote the message properly

kexkez: the response you got from the carpet shop guy is the same answer the sales people where i work at say also.

his response to spongy underlay is total and utter crap!

when he says he was an ex-carpet layer, keep in mind that he could be bullshitting you, and that i've known people who have tried to carpet lay, failed... and then claimed to be carpet layers... you really dont know if he's telling you the truth, or if he was actually any good in the first place. who knows, he could be...

in regards to what carpet you choose, that's up to you, try to stay above the mid-range carpets, feltex is usually a pretty safe brand to go for, do keep in mind that godfrey hirst now own feltex.

the only problem i have with what you've said is the power stretcher side of things... what you need to do is find out if a stretcher is something your carpet layer 'uses' NOT, something they 'can' use if you request it.
because even if they do use it, doesn't mean they know 'how' to use it! very important difference!

cos more than likely, your "ex-carpet layer" guy, will have one sitting in storage at his shop that layers can use, if it was ever needed etc... and your layer will probably borrow it, just to keep the pain in the arse customer happy (that being you).

good luck with it.

I worked in the carpet industry for 2 and ½ years, selling only. I don’t know that much about the stretcher thing, all I care about is that the carpet gets hooked onto the smooth edge and doesn’t come off.

In my eyes you can use a stretcher all you like with a polly and it won’t do any better than a knee kicker!

But I think if I had a wool carpet I would be going for the stretcher!

have to disagree with you there... a stretcher will ALWAYS get a better stretch than a knee kicker.

the job may look all good and fine at the time... but over time, as you walk over the same area of carpet, if it hasn't been properly stretched your carpet will begin to 'walk' and create 'waves'....

there is no finer example of it than in my dad's very own house, he bought a newly built house, one of those auctions where the profits goto charity (in this case it went to the geelong hospital apeal)... where everything was done (incl. carpets) and the waves in his house are that bad, that we have to tell people that he bought the house with carpet in it, and that he didnt lay it himself. makes him look like a really bad layer. lol

only took 6 months to start moving, and 2 years to get to a stage that it's really bad.

i know what your thinking... he should redo his own carpet... unfortunately it's a case of "can do everyone else's, but too lazy to do your own" syndrome!... i know how he feels...

Ok folks, sorry about the repetition, but how about I reword the question, that way nobody is actually "recommending" anyone, just stating facts...

Does anyone know someone in Sydney that lays carpet according to the Australian standard?

Cheers,
A

i know this is an old post, but i have had a customer ask me the question about stretching carpet and they were more confused with the above posts than answers recieved.

I am a carpet layer and whilst I haven't read the entire novel of pages I will go over some basics to hopefully clear up some issues.

Firstly in regards to salespeople giving information as to how carpet should be installed, please dont listen to them, they are only salespeople, and I have worked in many different shops and there are very few who actually know what they are talking about when it comes to both carpet installation and carpet itself. Not that they aren't intelligent capapble people, but they have been most likely taught by those who dont have the correct information in the first place, and the end goal is to sell a product, not recommend what is best for you.

In regards to stretching, there is no comparison on powerstretching vs knee kicking, even in the rare occasion that a layer knows how to knee kick correctly, any space over 2 metres will not be stretched correctly when a knee kicker only is used.

A powerstretcher is a must! you will also note that it's listed in the Australian Standards as a pre-requisite. It is there for two reasons, one being that it allows your manufacturer of the carpet to void your warranty and two, it is actually needed to correctly stretch your carpet.

A layers warranty only lasts 12 months, and this is the approx time your carpet will start to bubble when only knee kicked. I cannot tell you how many times I am called to restretch someone's carpet that is only 1 year old.

In regards to seam-sealing. this is also recommended by the Australian Standards. I personally dont do it, reason being I know how to correctly do a join in carpet, and when done correctly there will not be any issues.

I come from a family of Carpet Installers and in our combined decades of installation there has not once been an issue from the way in which we seam joins together. I have however witnessed how other layers are taught and I can clearly see why manufacturers recommend seam sealing. I usuallly cringe and have to walk away when I see the way in which "professional" layers put joins together and even the way they work out how they choose to lay, again I have to walk away.

In the end id highly recommend you get a layer who not only has a powerstretcher, but who actually knows how to use one. You may request a layer with one, but the shop may only supply an existing layer with one and tell them to make out they are using it.

You best bet is word of mouth, find a layer who comes recommended. There are plenty of good ones out there, but there a tonne of bad ones.

Reason for this is there is nothing stopping the average joe from deciding to lay carpet, even without training. So you will find alot of desperate DIY'ers get into the trade just because they can. And they can bounce from shop to shop for years and eventually they will be 'ok' enough and undercharge the professionals just enough that they become "layers". no documentation required, they say you need documents of being taught.

hope that rample clears a few things up, I have no doubt offended second rate carpet layers and uneducated salespeople. that's fine, cos they need to hear it.

have a good day.

Just wondering if you let the customer know you are going against manufacturer installation requirements (its not a recommendation, its a requirement), possibly voiding the warranty or do you just do it without telling them?

Everything else i agree with. Too many cowboys and salesman who say anything to get a sale. Sometimes i wonder why I did a 4 year apprenticeship, when people do a 3 day course and start giving out adivce.

In the 40 years I have laid floorcoverings, I have never seam sealed carpet joins of JUTE backed carpets. As others have said, if it is done properly, there is never a problem.
BUT however, in recent years, manufacturers are moving away from the hessian back, and using various, and different synthetic backs.
Some of these backs must be seam sealed, as the quality/amount of latex adhering the back to the carpet is questionable. And when cut for a join, the heat tape does not penetrate to the primary back as the hessian back does.
The felted type backing are the worst for it, and must be seam sealed for long term durability. Especially if it is a continuous filament pile eg. loop pile carpet with this backing.
My 5 cents worth

as was said this is an old thread. Turned out our layer was old school and did use one he was quite impressed that we'd even heard of a carpet stretcher, let alone asked that one be used. "_ Our carpets have now been down almost 5 years. They look great. No bubbling etc.

To Royalblue
I am a carpetlayer of 22 years and I power stretch a lot of my work, but there are some carpets like the Red book carpet that you mentioned that do not meet the manufacturing standards
The carpet with the smooth backing is known for delaminating ( pile separating from backing) and power stretching enhances the problem

As carpet layers we are having to adapt to all the different experiments of how carpet is made
As for the felted back carpets we would use a flame burner to singe the back of the carpet so we could prevent the joins from splitting when stretched, another carpet style I would not power stretch

The majority of carpetlayers do not use a power stretcher.
You would be amazed at the internal conflict on carpetlaying specific sites over the recommended use of a stretcher over a kneekicker.
Just mention to your carpetlayer as to why he is not using a power stretcher and you will hear all the BS under the sun as to the reason.
It is really that he doesn't have one and wouldn't know how to use one anyway, or he has not been trained by professional layers in the first place.