Browse Forums Owner Builder Forum Re: Has anyone bought windows, doors or roof tiles from chin 2Jun 23, 2011 4:09 pm Only windows tested here comply and you may not get a certificate of occupancy. Aside from that, Chinese windows are unsuitable for Australian construction by virtue of Australian construction methods. The remainder, you will find on other threads on exactly this. Ed "ECOECO" At 'EcoEco', we design windows, we design the best windows, we do it for you, so that when you’re happy we are happy. Tel. 1800 326 326 Re: Has anyone bought windows, doors or roof tiles from chin 3Jun 23, 2011 4:17 pm I have imported a Cast iron bath from China and that went fine. Also importing a container load of other things from Europe and again no issues. I see no value in importing Roof tiles, Windows and doors though, unless it is something pretty special. Cost here is not that excessive and glazing is something you usually do post brickup anyway. (Double glazed windows probably worth it but I would go to Europe for those) But single glaze not enough to be saved IMO There certainly is a place for importing and saving money but IMO most building materials are not worth it due to quantities Fitout items though is an entirely different matter and easy to save 50% on local prices https://forum.homeone.com.au/viewtopic.php?f=38&t=44762 My Owner builder journey extending a 1930's Bungalow Re: Has anyone bought windows, doors or roof tiles from chin 4Jun 25, 2011 2:02 am ^ agree with docker_rob and ed, for the reasons they mention, but for others, too. I currently live in China, my hubby is running heavy manufacturing workshops here. I can tell you that just about ANYTHING made in China is of sub-standard quality, using toxic materials, and more than likely, pig farmers moonlighting as skilled labor. I can also tell you that everything runs on bribes here (including the export/import agents), and that anything foreigners buy attracts an unofficial 'foreigner tax'. Most people aren't even aware they are paying it. So, unless it's something very rare or antique you're after (and in which case, it's probably fake) then I would look closer to home, or at least a source you can trust. But that's just my experience of the place, maybe I'm a little jaded after buying fake eggs, fake milk, fake rice, toxic pork etc. Maybe it's the smog fogging my brain, or my hubby coming home fuming, telling me how his 'skilled workers' managed to manufacture 350 of this particular item, and how only 2 of those were made correctly. In any case, hope you decide to support Aussie made, and if not, at least anything but Chinese made...good luck either way I like pigs. Cats look down on us, dogs look up to us. Pigs treat us as equals. Re: Has anyone bought windows, doors or roof tiles from chin 5Jun 25, 2011 8:04 am MiainBundy ^ agree with docker_rob and ed, for the reasons they mention, but for others, too. I currently live in China, my hubby is running heavy manufacturing workshops here. I can tell you that just about ANYTHING made in China is of sub-standard quality, using toxic materials, and more than likely, pig farmers moonlighting as skilled labor. I can also tell you that everything runs on bribes here (including the export/import agents), and that anything foreigners buy attracts an unofficial 'foreigner tax'. Most people aren't even aware they are paying it. So, unless it's something very rare or antique you're after (and in which case, it's probably fake) then I would look closer to home, or at least a source you can trust. But that's just my experience of the place, maybe I'm a little jaded after buying fake eggs, fake milk, fake rice, toxic pork etc. Maybe it's the smog fogging my brain, or my hubby coming home fuming, telling me how his 'skilled workers' managed to manufacture 350 of this particular item, and how only 2 of those were made correctly. In any case, hope you decide to support Aussie made, and if not, at least anything but Chinese made...good luck either way I deal with China all the time... Nokia phones have 3 plants in China, not EVERYTHING is bad from China. You can buy bad quality here too, and you can employ poor quality labour here too (tell me about it!!). Walmart & Nokia source from China and they set their own ethical standards for their suppliers. In my industry, the standards here in terms of quality of design are LOWER than China. I am an industrial engineer and have worked in many countries, and in general, China tries very hard to meet and exceed my expectations. Once you have selected your supplier, and that is an arduous task that should not be taken lightly, (in Australia too, but especially in a country where English is not their first language), then most difficulties stem from cultural differences and communication (we control that by having Chinese staff here). My suppliers are passionate about what they do. Graft? Well in China if they are caught they can lose their lives, here they get a slap on the hand (check some recent cases where the graft cost you and me heaps). Why do we in Australia pay more than any other country for stuff??? Check prices in the USA... I import from there too (DeWalt drill here $600, USA $125). To what do we attribute the price difference between here and other Western countries? Regarding part-time labour, I worked in the largest private company in the world, and they had the same problem, pig farmers and the like who used their spare time to work in the factory. Where? Australia. Why? Because the 4 shift roster allowed them that level of flexibility. I am sure your husband's part-time labour is due to them being casual, paid by the time they are required, or they are on piecework either way with no continuity of work. How can they live on the $5/day (some $2) they get in the factory, when it's paid only when they are required? I selected my suppliers carefully. I built a long term relationship based on trust and mutual respect. Support Aussie made by all means, just make sure you're not supporting a rigged marketplace or lousy quality. Australian industry needs to be competitive, it won't do that by protecting itself with rigged markets and rigged anti-dumping rules - that will only make us lazy, and remove the need for capital investment. OMG... I ranted... Ed "ECOECO" At 'EcoEco', we design windows, we design the best windows, we do it for you, so that when you’re happy we are happy. Tel. 1800 326 326 Re: Has anyone bought windows, doors or roof tiles from chin 6Jun 25, 2011 10:07 am ^ That's ok, I did too, lol. I think your situation, however, is very different from OP's. In Chinese culture, if you are a one-off customer, as OP seems to be, you will be ripped off, period. If they can see a long-term relationship on the horizon, they will most certainly up the quality and keep prices reasonable, as they much prefer the long-term profits. And yes, Nokia may have factories here, but I have walked into a phone dealer here to buy a phone, picked out a little Nokia, and the shop keeper actually said 'that's fake, here is a real one'. Can't tell the difference half the time. I also buy fake DVDs at $1 before they've even been released in cinemas, and can buy a 'real' Prada handbag in 20 different shops walking distance from my house for less than $50. My husband's company manufactures multi-million $ aluminium smelter equipment for Australia, the Middle East etc, they pay good (by local standards) wages, work is full time & overtime plentiful, they provide accommodation if required, constant training, supply food, medical insurance etc but there is no way you will over turn 5000 years of culture in one industrial revolution. For example, the workers do not kneel to weld, as 'there is gold beneath your knees', and prefer to squat, which causes bad welds and physical discomfort, but culture wins over common sense all the time. I agree with not rewarding Aussie manufacturers just for being Aussie, they must be competitive and innovative, but I also know my tap water here contains 5000+ chemicals from industrial waste, because people in the West want to pay less for a toothbrush or plastic bucket. I'd rather pay $20 a toothbrush to an Aussie company that employs environmentally responsible manufacturing methods, because the air China poisons one day, we'll be breathing in the next. It's not all about the $. However, if I can find an eco toothbrush online for $10 from India, I'll choose that one. I like pigs. Cats look down on us, dogs look up to us. Pigs treat us as equals. Re: Has anyone bought windows, doors or roof tiles from chin 7Jun 25, 2011 9:24 pm MiainBundy ^ That's ok, I did too, lol. I think your situation, however, is very different from OP's. In Chinese culture, if you are a one-off customer, as OP seems to be, you will be ripped off, period. If they can see a long-term relationship on the horizon, they will most certainly up the quality and keep prices reasonable, as they much prefer the long-term profits. And yes, Nokia may have factories here, but I have walked into a phone dealer here to buy a phone, picked out a little Nokia, and the shop keeper actually said 'that's fake, here is a real one'. Can't tell the difference half the time. I also buy fake DVDs at $1 before they've even been released in cinemas, and can buy a 'real' Prada handbag in 20 different shops walking distance from my house for less than $50. My husband's company manufactures multi-million $ aluminium smelter equipment for Australia, the Middle East etc, they pay good (by local standards) wages, work is full time & overtime plentiful, they provide accommodation if required, constant training, supply food, medical insurance etc but there is no way you will over turn 5000 years of culture in one industrial revolution. For example, the workers do not kneel to weld, as 'there is gold beneath your knees', and prefer to squat, which causes bad welds and physical discomfort, but culture wins over common sense all the time. I agree with not rewarding Aussie manufacturers just for being Aussie, they must be competitive and innovative, but I also know my tap water here contains 5000+ chemicals from industrial waste, because people in the West want to pay less for a toothbrush or plastic bucket. I'd rather pay $20 a toothbrush to an Aussie company that employs environmentally responsible manufacturing methods, because the air China poisons one day, we'll be breathing in the next. It's not all about the $. However, if I can find an eco toothbrush online for $10 from India, I'll choose that one. Hi there I have to say I agree with your sentiments and it does frustrate me when one asks where something is made and before they say 'china' one gets all the rhetoric about how it set up by the parent company blah blah blah. I will always pay more for things not made in China. Period. There are some things that I have really battled to source here and I have had to turn my head but the majority of things in my home are nt made in China for all the reasons that you highlight and some!!! Being an expat in a western country is challenging so I cant begin to imagine how tough it must be there. Great to hear your insight. What brings you to a site like this? Re: Has anyone bought windows, doors or roof tiles from chin 8Jun 25, 2011 10:44 pm Pitbunny Hi all, Looking for some help - has anyone had a good/bad experience importing from china etc? Can anyone recommend any companies? Cheers. I agree with docker_rob and also see no value in importing roof tiles, doors and other building materials etc. On the other hand I'm thinking about importing a kitchen either from china or from eastern europe. Because I'm not really ready to pay $15-20K to local manufacturer for something that should cost at least 5 times less. And still manufactured using same chinese melamine. ed @ ecoclassic Why do we in Australia pay more than any other country for stuff??? Check prices in the USA... I import from there too (DeWalt drill here $600, USA $125). To what do we attribute the price difference between here and other Western countries? Totally agree. I really want to support local business and do it every time when see fair price. However in most cases australian businesses are very ineffective, and they try to compensate it with much higher price tags. Sorry, personally I refuse to support that approach (that said, almost half of the stuff in my home is imported -from dslr camera to huge & expensive hi-fi stereo) Now we are about to built new home and thinking about importing kitchen and laundry cabinets, stone benchtops, maybe some material for WIR & BIRs (not cheap white melamine at $5/m they use here). We would also really want to import double (or even triple) glazed windows from germany or eastern europe, but for the reason mentioned by Ed probably will have to leave that idea... Re: Has anyone bought windows, doors or roof tiles from chin 9Jun 25, 2011 11:35 pm kayandandy I will always pay more for things not made in China. Period. And I will pay more (or less) for higher quality, regardless of the source. Ed "ECOECO" At 'EcoEco', we design windows, we design the best windows, we do it for you, so that when you’re happy we are happy. Tel. 1800 326 326 Re: Has anyone bought windows, doors or roof tiles from chin 10Jun 26, 2011 7:17 am MiainBundy For example, the workers do not kneel to weld, as 'there is gold beneath your knees', and prefer to squat, which causes bad welds and physical discomfort, but culture wins over common sense all the time. . That is fascinating - thanks so much for your posts - very interesting. Re: Has anyone bought windows, doors or roof tiles from chin 11Jun 26, 2011 8:12 am Amadio MiainBundy For example, the workers do not kneel to weld, as 'there is gold beneath your knees', and prefer to squat, which causes bad welds and physical discomfort, but culture wins over common sense all the time. . That is fascinating - thanks so much for your posts - very interesting. Actually, that's how they prefer to work. In a previous business we bought benches and the locals climbed up and squatted on the benches to weld and fabricate, that's what they are used to - I couldn't do it , their work was excellent, and we took away the benches, in case they fell off . What's common sense to us is not so common in other cultures, they have their own "common" sense. Ed "ECOECO" At 'EcoEco', we design windows, we design the best windows, we do it for you, so that when you’re happy we are happy. Tel. 1800 326 326 Re: Has anyone bought windows, doors or roof tiles from chin 12Jun 26, 2011 10:04 am ed @ ecoclassic Amadio MiainBundy For example, the workers do not kneel to weld, as 'there is gold beneath your knees', and prefer to squat, which causes bad welds and physical discomfort, but culture wins over common sense all the time. . That is fascinating - thanks so much for your posts - very interesting. Actually, that's how they prefer to work. In a previous business we bought benches and the locals climbed up and squatted on the benches to weld and fabricate, that's what they are used to - I couldn't do it , their work was excellent, and we took away the benches, in case they fell off . What's common sense to us is not so common in other cultures, they have their own "common" sense. Ed When we lived in the Middle East, the Indian workers squatted on Western style toilets, what a mess! But here, it's strictly an issue of taboo. A truck ran over a small dog in Shanghai, and the owner demanded either 5000 yuan compensation (month's wages), or for the driver to kneel for an hour, the worst humiliation you can suffer. Even when kids kneel down to play, they are yanked up by the red faced parents and told off. Another example, it's taboo for women to go outside, shower or wash their hair, and do anything outside a very strict ritualized daily routine for month after giving birth, despite medical advice to the contrary. Why? Because they believe that if they come into contact with water in that month, they will get arthritis when they are old. The country might be industrialized, but runs on old taboos and beliefs. It's a strange land. I can go to the local zoo, buy a live cow for $50 and have the keepers throw it it the lion cage! People pee on supermarket floors, spit everywhere, yet believe that eating crab meat in winter is what gives you a cold! I could go on, lol.... To answer kayandandy's question, I found this site as we are heading back to Australia in just over a week, and are OB on 5 acres in Qld. My hubby can build hundred tonne conveyors for mining sites, but I've seen his efforts at a wooden picture frame, and decided we need all the help and advice we can get! And I'm finding so much inspiration here, who knew you can have a wooden bath made in Scotland, for example? And I absolutely agree with everyone who has said Oz manufacturers need to lift their game. I shop online all the time, why pay $180 for something at a retail store, when purchased online it costs $50 delivered from OS? I just don't think people realize the enormous power their money has, or give much thought to what their lovely new bench top has cost the environment or what people were exploited to get it made. I'm not going to get preachy, everyone has the freedom to prioritize what's important to them, I just saw this topic and thought I would alert the OP to some of the realities of 'Made in China'. I like pigs. Cats look down on us, dogs look up to us. Pigs treat us as equals. Re: Has anyone bought windows, doors or roof tiles from chin 13Jun 26, 2011 12:36 pm ^ Interesting stuff... China and many countries have a lot of catching up to do, I see them trying. In some ways they are ahead, but there's still a long way to go. It's not so long ago spitting in the West was discovered to cause TB, now it's swine flu, but people still do it... http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/news/w ... 5764525189 Ed "ECOECO" At 'EcoEco', we design windows, we design the best windows, we do it for you, so that when you’re happy we are happy. Tel. 1800 326 326 Re: Has anyone bought windows, doors or roof tiles from chin 14Jun 27, 2011 12:18 pm I'm not going to say anything negative about this country, until I get back home lol. My VPN has been disconnected, there is lots of spyware on my PC, and some kind of strange crack down happening. All the pirate DVD shops have been raided and closed, police on literally every corner, and the spy planes are more frequent than usual. They may be expecting food price riots, not sure, but it's very uneasy atmosphere atm.... I like pigs. Cats look down on us, dogs look up to us. Pigs treat us as equals. I don't know them all, the first 2 top of your list are best known. 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