Very basic cable run question

Apologies for what is probably a stupid question but thinking of getting a licensed cabler out to quote, but if I'm thinking correctly it is going to be too expensive anyway and will probably stick with wifi.
Looking through threads seem to indicate a rough charge of $120 per cable run.
If I wanted to connect a TV, Media Player, DVD Player and a spare for laptop is that 4 cable runs?
Are 4 cables required to then connect to 4 outlets? (These items are all bunched together)
I have the same again in the family room then there's bedrooms for PC's so if I'm correct it is too expensive and would be wasting a cablers time quoting.

Hi,
Others may not agree, but...
Run 1 cable to each room, then buy 4 or 8 port Ethernet Switches. Go for Gigabit.
Cisco, D-Link, TP link, and others. Not too pricey, not to big.
http://www.shopbot.com.au/m/?m=Gigabit+Ethernet+switch
Others may recommend particular brands/models. Staying out of that.

I don't think there would be any issues extending these from your Modem/Router, even with several switches.
I have done it this way, saved a lot of cable, and it works for me.
Plus you can take the switches to your next home. Cable stays in..

Cable will be faster than WiFi, and it is more secure.

Shop for best priced installer, but ensure they are qualified. If they can't prove it, walk away.

The switch would certainly be cheaper if the cabler counts 4 cables as 4 runs even tho the run is exactly the same as 1 cable, same effort.
If I had one cable and 4 devices connected to the switch would they all run at full speed or would each run at quarter speed?

All full speed ahead.
Cables is likely to charge for each and every point, as electricians do.
Every point is an individual cable, and has to be terminated at each end.

For example, if 4 cables run to tv room and 4 cables to living room, then you now have 8 cables back at the modem/router. Cost = 8 x 120 = $960
Most modem/routers only have 4 Ethernet outlets, so you must buy an 8 port switch. Say $100. Plus say $10 ea for patch leads, in either scenario.

1 cable to each room = 2 x 120 = $240 + 2 x 100 for gigE switches $440
960-440 = $520

Then the other rooms as required

BTW if you are yet to buy modem/router, get one with Gigabit Ethernet. Won't make your (non NBN) Internet faster, but will allow faster sharing "in-house".

ok let's stop this right now.. most Cablers actually charge for parts and labour and it pretty much takes the same time to install one point as it does 6 the only cost increase is the parts required to make it happen

I stand corrected, but replied because no one else had. Now we have a pro who can clarify what Kempe has asked about. Other posts in this forum have indicated price per point, but I am certainly glad that Pugs, and many others, do it differently.
My experience, in the commercial field, every point was charged for.
But can Pugs clarify if my suggestion on single point to room and GigE Switch at the end is a passable method to minimise data cabling, without impacting on Networking performance? Are there any drawbacks or complications?

krone tools at noon

A single point per room with a switch in each room will work, however there are some downsides to this approach...
- when a single device in the room is using the switch, it gets full speed but if multiple devices want to "talk" at once the link is shared
- you end up with more cabling overall, when you count power bricks for the switches, patch leads, etc
- in some cases the extra power point issue outweighs the cost of an extra data point or two
- it will probably look messier simply because placement of these extra switches is tricky
- more things to manage (firmware in particular, but even just dealing with failed components
- small cheap switches have a higher failure rate than larger units, and aren't very cost efficient (cheaper to buy a single centralised switch than half a dozen small ones plus a medium size one for the core)

Personally I went with a mixture of the two approaches. My office, where multiple machines will compete for bandwidth, gets four network ports. Bedrooms get a single port. TV area gets two ports, one for a switch, one for my media centre machine (which I'd prefer had guaranteed throughput).

I think I've posted this one before, but don't even consider 100mbit switches. GigE is cheap, 100mbit is rubbish.

Build your solution around how it will be used. Buy for the long term, avoid false economies of buy cheap now and entering into a cycle of frequent upgrades/replacements. Data points have become a surprisingly important part of modern home construction, so treat them as part of your overall build. Skimping here will hurt in the long run.

Just to add to the draw backs of this method;

- loss in resiliency - you are doing this because you are expecting to use the devices at the end of the data cable for whatever reason (Media, office, etc) - essentially building a dependency on this cable. What happens when for some reason it no longer works? At least if you have a second, you would hope both would not go down at the same time
- Added power cost - those switches are not cheap to run. You will need a central switch anyway (unless they are all plugged into the modem/router) then you have 'x' number of 9V switch power packs. Hope you have solar
- Management - Lurgen touched on this but I dont think enough has been said about it. Just the ongoing maintenance of all that equipment is not worth the hassle. 1 central switch and even buy a back up - you will end up ahead I assure you

Performance will all come down to the intended use - in the scenario you have 1 cable into a 4 port switch for your media room and you content is hosted elsewhere in the house. Streaming this content to your media player wont be effected, in isolation. If you are then, for whatever reason, are downloading large files (either via the web or locally within the home) onto your laptop via the same switch, you will find contention on the line. This is inevitable

Personally, you would only go down this path in an existing house where cabling has already been run (1/room) and retro fitting is not an option

Lurgen, JMAP
Thanks for explaining pros and cons of both methods. Good and valid points for Kempe.
The gear I used is good or premium quality, and zero failures over 12 years. I also did say "go for GigE", 100 is dodo time. Careful planning at the room end can be neat, but everyone seems to use open shelving, making that trickier.
Forgot the redundancy of having a 2nd cable . I had every room cabled at build stage, the majority with 2 points. Media Room had 4, even Bathrooms had 1. Handy when Internet Radios became affordable.
My Central Switch is 16 Port, with a CISCO 32 port Patch Panel, also used for phone patching. More than 8 PCs and Macs happily use this setup.
I only adopted the extender switch when the Media room required extra points for TV, BluRay(s), AppleTV and PVR. No congestion issues experienced, yet, even with the AppleTV playing, 2 overseas students downloading or direct streaming foreign language movies concurrently. That is my baseline.
I did get 2 Cat6 run later, to be sure that the extender switch got maximum data.

Thanks again, Lurgen and JMAP for coming in with valuable knowledge for Kempe's consideration.

I would suggest installing the extra points in the wall and not using a switch / router to split it. Not only for the main reasons mensioned but also it can cause a bit of a issue with devices talking to themselves, for example you go having 4 - 5 switches running and devices running off that, they sometimes might have problems talking to the other other switches in the house...

plus there is the power issue as well, you going to run power for all these switches and routers ?

From what i understand the laws, which is a bit of a grey area, you can install it yourself as long as you are under the supervision of someone who is a licensed installed...

as a bare minimum sure... but what if you want to run other non IP services over Cat5e/6?


lets make it 11:30 I have a lunch date

Pugs,
Not positive on "non IP" services. Cat6 carrying Video/Audio ?

I do data transfers across the LAN. Haven't progressed to a NAS, yet. My setup seems OK, but that is just my current setup, installed in 2000. I'm sure everybody's "mileage may vary".
My biggest data hog (LTO-3) is direct attached to 2 x Drobos, that also serve iTunes. Same CPU does LAN backup of my machines OK.

Won't be adding to this system, as I am about to sell, and build a new place.
I seem to be hijacking Kempe's thread here, sorry Kempe, but will be looking for new ideas for that build as planning progresses. So, suggestions welcomed.


My biggest blue was to overlook the need to have redundancy in Data Points.

Pugs, was that 11:30 EST (VIC) or SA time ?

redundancy and non IP service yes video/ music/ IR control

WA time just to mix it up

All good

The only regret I had with my place is that I didn't think enough about placement of the security stuff. I ran ample cabling for sensors, etc but If you want to install camera's etc, into your eaves or high up on brickwork, it can prove difficult to run to down the line

Best advise I would also add is to have a drag line from your roof cavity to your Rack - this way any future expansion you can get back to the rack (half the battle!)