Browse Forums Building A New House 1 Sep 12, 2008 12:49 pm Hi to all and sorry for the long post,
My wife and I were building with M but have just been sacked by M – yes it sounds unbelievable but is true. We had done the PC stage and were awaiting FC which was due approx 2 days ago. Up until this point they had been a little slow but nothing out of the ordinary. This was the first time either of us had dealt with a volume project builder. I have dealt extensively with a master builder in Hobart Tasmania (where lived for many years) and a master builder in Perth WA but never a project builder. Thursday last week we became aware of a super sale by H3nley. Now I imagine it is the same for most of us – budgets are tight and every dollar is precious so we were torn as what to do. We had already paid $4000 to M but H3nley was offering a $20000 discount on some of the houses we really liked. Even if we lost the money to M we would still be better off. Foolishly, in hindsight, we spoke to our M sales rep and told her of our concerns – I guess we were after reassurance that M was superior and we should stick with them. We also wanted to see if M could reduce its price at all to keep us as customers. Our rep was very disappointed at our attitude but spoke with her manager re the pricing. Come Monday morning they told us they wouldn’t reduce the price. Over the weekend we met with H3nley and discussed our site and whether they could build for us. As it turned out H3nley would not build on our block due to the slope being greater than 2 metres – a new rule – they said they have come down from 3 metres relatively recently. Our slope averages 2.6 metres. We had the contours from M’s report. So we waited for M’s answer on Monday and learnt they wouldn’t reduce their price. We therefore told them that we had reviewed everything and wanted to stay with M as considered them superior. Yes not quite the whole story but they should have been glad to still have the job. Not one word of thankyou for returning and ever since they have been acting strangely. The first sign of their attitude was to do with double glazed windows (see post in that part of forum). They wouldn’t provide information and told me to go find out for myself. Given the double glazing is $7800 I thought it was only reasonable that they would supply window details. Finally yesterday after asking several times we were told of our new FC date. It was the 7th of October. Well given we had only wasted 2 business days we didn’t think our date should be pushed out by a whole month. We thought we were being punished for having told them of our second thoughts. We protested vigorously to our sales rep and asked the matter be escalated to the manager. Our sales rep told us the answer would be the same but she would have him contact us. Given it seemed that the answer would be unsatisfactory I yesterday wrote to the State manager of M and this seems to have greatly upset them. M wrote to us today and sacked us! Remember at the moment we are still awaiting FC and we have paid a $4000 deposit. We as customers can terminate the deal at risk of losing the deposit but M has no contractual right to terminate the deal. It is bound to produce the final FC. I just can’t believe their level of service. I will put below the excerpt from their email to us so you can see for yourself. We were also querying some of their prices for alterations to the plans. Essentially we wanted value and for costs to be justified. In response they didn’t attempt to clarify the prices but just told us to refer to the PC. The PC document, in our opinion, wasn’t clear enough and we wanted further explanation but they weren’t willing to provide any. It seems they only want compliant customers and won’t tolerate questions. You are meant to just passively take what you are given at face value and accept any delays that occur. We told them that we had started to lose faith in M and wanted the FC brought back forward. Our sales rep didn’t even tell us they were cancelling our job last Thursday. If she had explained what she was doing we would have said just keep the job going. I now think that M is too large for its boots and isn’t interested in providing personal service. They are truly a volume builder and want things done their way or no way at all. Along with some other posts on the forum recently that I have seen I suggest you reconsider before signing up with M. We have written back telling M that they can’t sack us but if they insist on cancellation then we will accept it provided they refund $3000. We believe they can keep $1000 being for the soil tests but have warned them we will go to the Small claims court if they don’t refund the $3000 PC deposit. Please ask any questions and we will attempt to explain. It just seems that once we started to query things and demonstrated that we weren’t prepared to just accept whatever we were told then they didn’t want us. Dale. Dear name I have read some recent correspondence emails between yourself and (sales rep) and understand you’re not happy with our administration process. Late last week I believe you indicated to Ms sales rep that you were considering placing your business with another large volume Builder from the metro area and as a result we withdrew your file from our production cell convinced that we had lost you as a customer. I believe we lost two or three days and this resulted in several contract issue spots within our production office had since been filled by other customers of ours. This action pushed your new contract issue date back several weeks as you know. Unfortunately we do not reverse this scheduling process as we must adhere to our protocol that sees fairness to all of our clients. I suspect that we as a volume builder will not be able to meet your expectations relating to building your new home and therefore I terminate our relationship and we will not be proceeding with your new home. I recommend you seek a smaller Project type builder that can give you a timeline and pricing structure that satisfy’s your needs and most of all the service you desire. I am also aware that you have made attempts to contact my direct report or state manager as you have referenced, through our head office in Melbourne to voice your concerns, this person will be copied in on this response. You will note above in the CC task bar. I will examine our costs to date and refund any monies that we cannot show fair and reasonable cost for. I have never had such a high level of doubt demand for customer service or what appears to be high anxieties relating to our building business, nor have I experienced what appears to be total dissatisfaction with one of my sales team members who is highly regarded by all of her past and present clients, her work ethic and honesty is second to none. I apologise for any inconvenience we may have caused you and wish you well with your endeavours to build your new home. Well there you go. An astounding situation. We will now investigate other builders over the weekend. Our favourite at the moment is Carlisle as we really like the Monaco. Re: M3tricon has sacked us - Absolutely amazing 4Sep 12, 2008 1:11 pm woahhhh thats left me speechless....
good luck with finding another builder! Re: M3tricon has sacked us - Absolutely amazing 5Sep 12, 2008 1:14 pm Unbelievable You should let them know that you have posted their response here, and see what they say.
Goodluck with your search. 'chelle We have a hand-over date...15/10...but I won't hold my breath! http://people-in-glass-houses.blogspot.com/ Re: M3tricon has sacked us - Absolutely amazing 6Sep 12, 2008 1:15 pm Wow - you think that with new home construction slowed 25% since last year - they'd actually want customers After 4 years - we're in! Re: M3tricon has sacked us - Absolutely amazing 7Sep 12, 2008 1:18 pm It's really hard to comment on this without knowing absolutely all of the information....but I don't really see why this is so shocking.
I'd be much happier to hear this now from a builder concerning not meeting your expectations than for them to go forward knowing full well they will not be able to meet your needs. While it's unusual, I bet there's a lot of people building now that would have liked to have heard this from their builder rather than to progress with an unsatisfactory build for their circumstances. While inconvenient, I actually don't see a lot wrong with this and applaude their honesty. Just for your info.... we went almost to FC with M on a double storey... than had to switch to single... we got a $2500 credit towards the single storey, so it cost us $1500 to that stage. Might give you a guide. Jo I leave you to fend for yourself, figure things out yourself. Terrence Malick Re: M3tricon has sacked us - Absolutely amazing 8Sep 12, 2008 1:22 pm I think the shocking part for me is that it appears to me like the big M was having a big sook about Dale looking at other builders.
We are the customer and have a right to shop around for the best price, I did this with M and PD, both knew full well what I was doing and it wasn't a problem then. I don't think M terminated the contract because they couldn't meet Dale's needs (i thought Dale said he looked at other builders because he was trying to reduce costs, not because he was unhappy with how they built homes), I think they terminated it because they couldn't be bothered dealing with a customer who didn't go along with everything they said. My karma ran over your dogma Re: M3tricon has sacked us - Absolutely amazing 9Sep 12, 2008 1:29 pm Sorry that M sacked you guys. I just hope that you get your full $3k back. I'm hoping that they didn't do it purely because you mentioned you were going to talk with H*nl*y. That would be very childish...........
Hope you are able to get onto another builder quickly. We looked at a big block in a different Estate before buying the block we did and both Henl*y and PD would touch it because the slope was 2m. Happy at Home Re: M3tricon has sacked us - Absolutely amazing 10Sep 12, 2008 1:33 pm I can assure you Bel I haven't gone along with everything they've said. I question everything. Everything. I get everything in writing. M knew we were looking at other builders.... just makes me think there may be other issues.
Perhaps some of the options and things that Dale wanted structurally just didn't fit in with a project builder... thus their suggestion to go to a smaller builder. I know you didn't mean anything by it, but I'm getting a bit sick of the assumption on the forum and especially in the PeterOZ thread that if you're an M customer you must be some idiot that nods their head all the time. I can't understand the issue for a company to say "we cannot meet your needs, I suggest you go somewhere that can". What is wrong with that? Do we prefer companies to want our business at any cost? I've heard a million times on this forum about tradies, companies, etc, etc, etc.... "If they'd just let me know they couldn't help me I would have gone elsewhere and not wasted my time..." This company did that.... and it's still wrong? I don't get it.... We were borderline on getting through with a project builder.... M were the only ones willing to accommodate us. And we have compromised on things because they are a project builder.... without know in ghte circumstances, maybe custom is the best option for Dale.... I still don't see the problem. I leave you to fend for yourself, figure things out yourself. Terrence Malick Re: M3tricon has sacked us - Absolutely amazing 11Sep 12, 2008 1:41 pm I know what you are saying Jo - in fact if you read my post I also stated that we were dealing with both M and PD and both were great, it was only in the end that PD won because they worked with our budget a bit more.
I certainly don't think anyone building with M is an idiot, that would have made me an idiot I just think of this occasion, and its unfortunate for Dale, that he got a s/c, who didn't seem like they wanted to work with him as a customer. This is certainly not saying that all M staff are like this, my s/c at the big M was fantastic Like Toni, I just hope that M didn't pull the plug on things because Dale stated that he had spoken to Henl3y. That would be very childish, and from what he has mentioned in his post it reads like that is exactly what they did. My karma ran over your dogma Re: M3tricon has sacked us - Absolutely amazing 13Sep 12, 2008 1:48 pm We gave up on Metricon as an option when the sales person said we couldn't make a room larger (within the roof line) due to issues with plastering the ceiling in a room that size (even though it wasn't a particularly large area, and other homes in their range have far larger living areas!).
Their preference is for customers to buy a home out of the box, with as few changes as possible (if any). Maybe it does depend which side of the city you are on ... but we certainly found their sales staff in the south-east to be very much "this is our product, you have these standard options, sorry, we can't do anything else". Dale - PD probably have a similar design, go and talk to them. Where are you building? Re: M3tricon has sacked us - Absolutely amazing 14Sep 12, 2008 1:57 pm Thanks everyone.
Yes I should clarify that it was the customer service, or lack of it, that astounded us. I have no reason to doubt M's building ability or the quality of their designs but their lack of service was astounding and appalling. And yes it was solely due to price that we looked at H3nley - there was no dissatisfaction with M at that stage at all. Dale. Re: M3tricon has sacked us - Absolutely amazing 15Sep 12, 2008 2:02 pm We are building in Gisborne which has a regional surcharge with M.
I honestly believe it was a combination of us talking to H3nley and going to his manager. People don't like you going over their head and I think that was a problem. Part of M's problem with alterations is their own doing - they completely overspec their houses and make non standard changes, particularly to kitchen and outdoor areas so of course people want some of those changes we have seen. Dale. Re: M3tricon has sacked us - Absolutely amazing 16Sep 12, 2008 2:04 pm Dale Part of M's problem with alterations is their own doing - they completely overspec their houses and make non standard changes, particularly to kitchen and outdoor areas so of course people want some of those changes we have seen.Dale. I think all builder's do that.....PD and Henl*y's displays are full of upgrades. We were lucky with the display at Mernda for our house, there wasn't alot of upgrades in it. I'd love to see some displays that are "standard"!!!! Happy at Home Re: M3tricon has sacked us - Absolutely amazing 17Sep 12, 2008 2:09 pm To further clarify there is perhaps nothing wrong with M terminating PROVIDED they refund the $4000 in total. If they wish to walk away from the deal then they have to return everything including the first $1000 deposit. For them to try and walk away and yet keep the money is wrong.
We had made some changes to the standard layout including chopping out a wall, expanding outdoor area and altering rumpus room. All these changes were agreed to by them and already drawn up. It was only when we started querying the breakdown of some costings and asking for details on windows that they started getting upset. And this was after we had talked to H3nley so they may well have behaved themselves if we hadn't told them about H3nley. Dale. Re: M3tricon has sacked us - Absolutely amazing 18Sep 12, 2008 2:13 pm Dale To further clarify there is perhaps nothing wrong with M terminating PROVIDED they refund the $4000 in total. If they wish to walk away from the deal then they have to return everything including the first $1000 deposit. For them to try and walk away and yet keep the money is wrong. Dale. Totally agree with you Dale. It will be interesting to see how much they refund and what they deem as an appropriate amount to retain for work/service already provided. Happy at Home Re: M3tricon has sacked us - Absolutely amazing 19Sep 12, 2008 2:17 pm I wouldn't dwell, just get moving onto the next builder, much like they will from you no doubt. I suppose any company has the right to refuse for whatever reason.
Don't let it make you all bitter and twisted about the total building experience, it'll ruin it for you before you've even started. Re: M3tricon has sacked us - Absolutely amazing 20Sep 12, 2008 2:23 pm That's so unbelievabke, it's (almost) laughable!!!! I can't believe a builder would sack you!!!!
Hope you get the lot back (tho I doubt it from the careful wording of 'reasonable costs' ) and I hope you find someone you're happy with! I know PD build out there, so I'm guessing that most of the volume builders do. Good luck! Solidarity, not solidity.......The Lexicon of Life I work with owner, he/she is my man on the ground and I instruct them when to visit the site and take photos and I have other tools in the bag. 4 15265 4 14277 Thank you so much. This has been very helpful. We definitely wish to settle and get these people out of our life. They are trying to charge us interest on late… 7 14262 |