Browse Forums Building A New House 1 Apr 11, 2018 11:10 pm My builder submitted my draft house plan to city council and the approval was granted in Feburary. However, the revision or update to the plan is still on going. After the plan was approved by council, I requested the builder to adjust the window head heights from 2100mm to 2400 to match the upgraded high ceiling. This request had been accepted by the builder. Today when I request the builder to move the Family sliding door a little bit towards elevation D (as shown in highlight in the attached picture), the request is rejected by the builder as the builder advises this will require amendment to engineer report and renewal to the council approval. From my point of view, this sliding door adjustment is much like the previous window headhights adjustment, the difference is just one for vertical movement and the other for horizontal movement. Why the window head height adjustment doesn't impact engineer report and council approval but the sliding door does? I suspect that it was just an execuse for the builder to avoid make any amendment to this exising drawing. Does any one have the expertise or experience to advise if I move the family sliding door a little bit (say around 240mm towards elevation D and remain the size of the door intact) would require amendment to engineer report and council approval? Thank you very much. Like ⋅ Add a comment ⋅ Pin to Ideaboard ⋅ Re: What changes of plan will impact engineer report & appro 2Apr 11, 2018 11:47 pm I would have thought horizontal movements would have more bearing on the frame design than shifting windows vertically, but don't know enough to say whether they are reasonably refusing the request or not. Ultimately I don't see why you couldn't ask for redesign and recertification (if that was indeed required), but they would be entitled to issue you with a variation for any additional costs incurred. The first question I'd put to them is "which engineering report". A residential house design may involve multiple engineers e.g. one for slab/foundations, another for frame and trusses. If they are vague or unwilling to provide details then it may be an indication that they simply don't want the hassle of organising the changes or having the resultant delay in them commencing works (and being able to make progress claims). Re: What changes of plan will impact engineer report & appro 3Apr 12, 2018 12:03 am iTool I would have thought horizontal movements would have more bearing on the frame design than shifting windows vertically, but don't know enough to say whether they are reasonably refusing the request or not. Ultimately I don't see why you couldn't ask for redesign and recertification (if that was indeed required), but they would be entitled to issue you with a variation for any additional costs incurred. The first question I'd put to them is "which engineering report". A residential house design may involve multiple engineers e.g. one for slab/foundations, another for frame and trusses. If they are vague or unwilling to provide details then it may be an indication that they simply don't want the hassle of organising the changes or having the resultant delay in them commencing works (and being able to make progress claims). Thank you very much for your suggestion itool. I've requested the builder to provide a copy of the so-called engineer report. Astonishingly my previous request for move the winodw verticallly (head height change) was accepted, but today's request to move the sliding door horizontally is rejected, alternatively I could pay additional cost for amendment to both engineer report and council approval to facilitate the proposed change. However, I just suspect the cost may be just a barrier or execuse for them to avoid the hassle of organising the changes, so I came here to seek some advice or proof to defend. Re: What changes of plan will impact engineer report & appro 4Apr 12, 2018 12:32 am The wider a window/door is, the more load it has to bear, but I would have thought raising the window height doesn’t change anything from an engineering perspective which is maybe why the height increase was allowed but not the width Building Monte Carlo 40- Wisdom homes Re: What changes of plan will impact engineer report & appro 5Apr 12, 2018 1:25 am MandM+4 The wider a window/door is, the more load it has to bear, but I would have thought raising the window height doesn’t change anything from an engineering perspective which is maybe why the height increase was allowed but not the width Thank you for your reply MandM+4. Maybe my description is a little bit confusing. To clarify, the builder confirmed the sliding door could be moved to where I requested, but it involves amendment to existing engineer report and re-stamp the council approval, which will incur additional cost. I just want to confirm if this change really requires the amendment to engineer report and re-stamp of council approval as I suspect this is an execuse for the builder to avoid this hassle to change the plan. Re: What changes of plan will impact engineer report & appro 6Apr 12, 2018 8:36 am larry1124 what are the options 1.Post contract variation ,,Pay a fee ie $500 Admin + Council + Engineering +others? 2.The builder is tired of any more changes and just wants to get on with the project 3 Bit late now for you... but engineers make structural changes to plans on site all the time..ie. revisions things get moved 250mm a. Revisions are done with a red pen the drawings aren't necessarily redrawn b. The builder also builds thing that may not be compliant nor in the standards,, they don't necessarily get an engineer for everything..cost is a factor, If the builders detail is challenged an Engineer will more than likely assess it. c.Here are some typical excuses I've heard by Builders involving Engineers on Why Things should not be done, can't be done, costs more? i.Engineer says The footings needs to change? ii.The engineer says the trusses don't line up.. an extra truss will need to be added by variation? iii.The Engineer profession is trusted The battlers & Punters generally accept others using the word "Engineer" That also makes engineers a soft target for the above excuses as you never get to meet the builders engineer and that's the way builders like it. OT ..On a lighter note .. clients use to ask Builders and engineers to make changes on site and all it would cost is a carton of beer for the tradies. Also I have it on good authority the regulations are tightening even further similar to the US I suspect you will eventually hire your own engineer..Goodluck Designer,Engineer (Civil,Const & Envir),Builder,Concrete & Masonry Contract.Struct Repairs Re: What changes of plan will impact engineer report & appro 7Apr 12, 2018 10:26 am Don't forget that if you are on a standard contract then the builder has the right to refuse a variation, and you can't blame him for that. Essentially you have already agreed for the builder to construct to the plans in the contract and now you want something else. Builder may agree on his terms or refuse, you can huff and puff and whinge but ultimately you are whistling Dixie. The time to get it right is prior to signing the contract. If you are the builder then you will know that contract variations are profit loss. You are far better off to just get the job done and move on to the next. The math? $ 250k Home, profit $50k , Variations 50K, profit 15K approx. same admin resources, more hustle and time extensions. Foremost Building Expert in Australia,assisting with building problems/disputes, building stage inspections,pre-contract review advice for peace of mind 200 blogs http://www.buildingexpert.net.au/blog Re: What changes of plan will impact engineer report & appro 8Apr 12, 2018 11:04 am building-expert Don't forget that if you are on a standard contract then the builder has the right to refuse a variation, and you can't blame him for that. Essentially you have already agreed for the builder to construct to the plans in the contract and now you want something else. Builder may agree on his terms or refuse, you can huff and puff and whinge but ultimately you are whistling Dixie. The time to get it right is prior to signing the contract. If you are the builder then you will know that contract variations are profit loss. You are far better off to just get the job done and move on to the next. The math? $ 250k Home, profit $50k , Variations 50K, profit 15K approx. same admin resources, more hustle and time extensions. Thank you for your reply building expert. To meet the expiry date of my pre-approved loan, i signed the contract with the builder first and then proceed with colour selection stage. Due to this reason, i'm eligible to make changes via PCV for free until I agree with the final drawings. 3 5191 The engineering is the engineering. It's irrelevant how much material you have. Unless it fits the requirements of your design the engineer can't "make"it work. You might… 7 8004 1 1339 |