Browse Forums Building A New House 1 Sep 12, 2015 1:09 pm We are about 1 week away from PCI and we have discovered so many problems with our build. I'm worried that we do not have a leg to stand on because of how things have panned out. I'll begin by saying the supervisor did us a 'hush hush' favour by leaving a door open so we could start painting, the job proved too big so we got 2 guys in the following day. These painters are very good but have discovered so many problems; * the white set was so terrible the worse the painters had ever seen, it took them both 9 hours to patch it * some patching isn't drying as the walls have moisture in them * one toilet has soft close lid, one doesn't (small issue I know) * the main toilet hasn't been sealed and actually moves on the ground * the ceilings have weird blister marks on them, the size of a plum * the wet areas don't drain to the floor waste, we actually dumped a bottle of water on the floor and the water ran everywhere BUT down the waste! * wet area grout is discoloured already, patchy * texture coat looks too thin and patchy in areas * a day after the texture coat was done ( by the same person that did the awful white set) it rained and where there were no down pipes yet, the texture literally washed away to bare concrete. They simply put the down pipes on over the bare concrete so when it gets fixed it will be patched around it. * the main floor tiles have the grout so deep or low set that its IMPOSSIBLE to sweep the floor, the sand and dirt sits right down in the grout and its impossible to sweep it out. * the interior doors are poorly glossed, they have an orange peel effect and even paint thats dried in runs. Paint bristles left stuck in the paint * they laid the wrong carpet in our house, it got mixed up with another house's carpet The painters said they feel sorry for us as the house is of such poor quality. I have asked the builder about the issues and he tries to give me builders jargon such as; * the grout discolouration is normal, something to do with salt from the slab * the plastering was standard, but they will pay for the day it took the painter to patch it * the texture coat is standard, most people repaint it themselves wtf??! * I can buff the bristles off the internal doors (they are high gloss, it will look awful!) I am so stressed as our rental is up in a month and we cannot renew. Also I don't think we have a leg to stand on as technically we weren't meant to be in the house to discover these problems, the supi did us a favour. The contract says the build can take 250 WORKING days, thats pretty much a year. Despite the supi saying we should be in by September at the latest (what a joke) so we felt comfortable signing a rental until October. We have been told the main tiles can not be fixed by adding more grout as the top layer will just break away eventually. The only way to fix all tiles is to jackhammer the floor out and start over. Sorry for the long story but its turned into a nightmare!! Does anyone have any advice? Re: New build poor quality, so many problems 2Sep 12, 2015 5:07 pm I would get an independent building inspector, you can have work stopped until the inspection and hand them the report. The you will also have another professional opinion with a bit of clout if you need it. My topic thread: viewtopic.php?f=31&t=76249&start=20#p1316378 Re: New build poor quality, so many problems 3Sep 12, 2015 5:44 pm I don't think that the entry into the house changes anything much. Unless they can blame you for causing the faults, then it is still their responsibility to fix the issues, and whether you see them before or at PCI doesn't much that much difference. The real issue you have is that the harder you push to have more things fixed, the later the handover date is likely to be. It's a bad place to be in, but you're going to have to work through the practical implications. It may be better to accept some faults and move in rather than bear the cost of having to wait further. You can also put some things down to it (hopefully) being a cheap builder, and that if you'd had better quality it would have cost more - and so you can sort-of justify spending a bit yourself later to fix up their work. Ideally this shouldn't happen, but you have to balance the practicalities, and work out just what it would cost you in accommodation in holding out longer. Some of the issues you have mentioned should be fairly easy to fix, or minor. In these cases, the builder should be able to fix them quickly prior to handover. If they are saying the bristles can easily be buffed out, then they should just be doing that. It may be that you can try to deal with some of these issues under the house warranty. The problem with that approach is that their incentive to do anything to help you diminishes greatly once they have your money in the account. The encouraging this is that most of these issues you mentioned are mainly cosmetic, and don't really affect the longevity of the house. The worrying thing though is that if this is an indication of the quality of the trades, then there may also be equivalent structural issues you haven't got to see yet. It looks like a battle ahead for you, but I hope things work out well. Re: New build poor quality, so many problems 4Sep 12, 2015 6:22 pm Thanks guys, my husband and I were talking over getting an independent building inspector in so thats a definite. I think pp is right about accepting some faults and moving in. The thing is this wasn't a cheap builder, they were one of the so called 'high end' builders who admitted to us their price range isn't aimed towards first home buyers. The painter who patched the white set told us that he would spend on average patching for 20 minutes before starting on the job, ours took 2 guys 9 hours! Re: New build poor quality, so many problems 5Sep 12, 2015 7:18 pm Hi Sandy... we are in similar situation. Builder - not cheap one. We took the independent inspector which builder just brushed away: they are fussy... and didn't try to rectify any defects. I am still on it and will not let it go. In which state your are building? I believe it is in all states that they have 6 months after hand over to rectify defects. First time builder myself: but we decided we will keep the report (records with photos) and jump on builder if things don't get sorted out. I have see in another post here that they put in the PCI: as per the building inspection report. Hopefully this gives you some legal backup and if things don't happen before 6 months deadline go to the State building association with the complain. At the end they are the one responsible for the licences. At least this is approach we will take, but still digging for more information... All the best Re: New build poor quality, so many problems 6Sep 12, 2015 7:48 pm Hi Assh, so the builder didn't seem interested in what the inspector said? Did the inspector look at absolutely everything? We are building in WA. I just didn't like how everything I brought up with the supervisor, he had an answer to such as normal, standard etc. We told him how the painter would hold up a light to show all the flaws in the white set and the supervisor tried telling me that was illegal! Surely not? Re: New build poor quality, so many problems 7Sep 12, 2015 8:35 pm Hi sandy feet. I'd suggest putting your concerns in writing, with photographs of the problems. I believe the most important thing to remember when trying to resolve any issue is just stick to the facts. Often when communicating about something so important to us (eg. Our home) its easy to get upset and emotions take over ... Then communication starts to break down. That's why writing's so much more effective. Gives you time to really think about the message, to give it more impact; and, you have it on record, so you have a legal trail should you need to progress further. Though I don't think the things you mentioned are worth the grief to you or your builder to progress down that route. As you've already expressed your dissatisfaction with your site super and he's fobbing you off, it's time to send that detailed letter/report to management. Find out that persons name and address it to them personally. You still still have to pay them for completion, yes? So in that letter you could let them know that you will only pay them the remaining 80% until the issues you've pointed out are rectified. I read this on Brian Bashworth's website (a credible building inspector) and think its a great tactic - it shows that you're being reasonable especially if it ever progresses further (it's on record that you're reasonable). Unfortunately we have issues much worse than this (structural) and this is the approach we've been taking and all credit to my builder, they at this stage have been very responsive and sympathetic. I give them credit for their willingness and attitude to get things back on track. Building a house is a huge logistical exercise ... There are a lot of people involved and schedules to organize. It helps to understand how easy it is for things to go wrong and remain positive that no one is being malicious and on the whole want to do the right thing. Otherwise businesses wouldn't survive, Try and stay positive. It will help you and your builder who I'm sure wants to build you a nice house you're happy with and will then recommend to friends or come back to build your second house with Re: New build poor quality, so many problems 8Sep 12, 2015 8:39 pm yep, I am in QLD but builder had answers on all the defects (how to avoid to do anything about it). Even questioned the credentials and asked us for the licences number - which is public information anyway. Which reminds me check anyone you intend to engage through the Commission Licence Search; Funny enough we had a change of supervisor during the build and new one was quite keen on additional inspection (we are paying for it of course) to get things right: this was on Friday, but at the next meeting (following Tuesday) he said "head office" is not happy for us taking independent inspector As mentioned we plan to keep all the photos, reports we have if anything goes south. We are close to the hand over stage. Through my research done we will contact State Commission for further information. In one of the pots I read: it's my legal right to have an independent inspection and he would take as long as it takes to do a thorough job. You may also see some answers on a post: "Building Inspector - Ask Anything" page8. It also suppose to be legally bind document - although not sure about that. If I understand (and it should be in your contract) they have 6 months to rectify defects after hand over. You need to make sure you stay on top of it. An inspector should also clearly state a reason to delay a handover if required. So close to the PCI - get a good Independent Inspector - possibly recommended here on a blogs, as soon as you can, and I would not do any further work in your house - builder may blame you for some defects without ground but... and on general: builder tries to find excuse at our site all the time - oh you know the external water tap is not where it suppose to be by the plan because probably he could not fixed there - well what happened with communication and explain the situation - before you go any further. Luckily we have building blogs like this and internet info to do own search... Don't bite into what he is telling you Let us know how you go please Re: New build poor quality, so many problems 9Sep 12, 2015 9:17 pm To TomCat: I do agree to "putting concerns in writing, with photographs of the problems..." our experience: we stayed polite at all the times, backed up our concerns with evidence, put everything in writing but still it goes in the air. But by saying "Building a house is a huge logistical exercise ..." I agree but aren't they payed for it? and that's when I become upset - I am not a builder but started to "project manage" our build with sending emails to the supervisor with instructions ( I pulled from official sources) how to do things properly... and soon after builder saying you cannot visit site without them, although from the beginning it was a problem... To Sandy: I am confident with the right approach you will sort out things, but at the end of the day you do need to be insist rectifying defects as you are the project owner and paying for it! All the best! Re: New build poor quality, so many problems 10Sep 25, 2015 10:16 am So update; the painters rectified the white set, it too them 48 hours to fix and the ss said the company will pay for it. Well now building company is denying ever allowing us access to the house, saying we breached the contract, saying they were never made aware of the problems and never gave the painters permission to rectify the work!! The cost of 2 guys patching for 2 days is over $2,700! I'm guessing the site supervisor is going back on his word to save his behind, I feel so sick about this. Re: New build poor quality, so many problems 11Sep 25, 2015 11:03 am Can he prove you didn't have permission? You and your painters didn't go through the windows- were other trades always on site when the painters were there? Keep calm and keep making your points. Use all evidence you can, as TomCat said. Did the painters ever see the SS on site and talk to him ie was it presumed they were allowed to be there? At the end of the day I think you will win through, after all it's their reputation and word of mouth is powerful. But it would be good to get some independent advice, as the project manager do you know your rights and responsibilities? This might give you more leverage to liaise with the builder. Good luck and let us know the outcome. Re: New build poor quality, so many problems 12Sep 25, 2015 11:29 am I spoke to ss over the phone letting him know we wanted to paint, he said he will leave the laundry door open for us, I don't have any texts or anything it was only over the phone. The ss did talk to the painters so maybe I can use them to back me up? Re: New build poor quality, so many problems 13Sep 25, 2015 11:43 am I think that's a great idea, especially if they ever met the SS and talked to him on site. It's your word against his so you need to prove you were given access...If he didn't order them off site when he talked to them, its tantamount to giving permission (in my book). Re: New build poor quality, so many problems 14Sep 25, 2015 12:53 pm That's my way of thinking too, he said to them they should have gotten their plasterer back but they may as well continue and finish it. To me that's advising them to finish the job. The good part is the painters where right in the house in bedroom 4 when they spoke to the supervisor face to face. If the building company is denying the fact they allowed us entry then they better be looking at their ss who apparently leaves the doors unlocked! Re: New build poor quality, so many problems 15Sep 25, 2015 4:49 pm They may still try to say you entered the house when other tradies were there, but yes the point is the SS was aware of their presence there and allowed them to continue. Otherwise he was within his rights to make them stop and resume after handover... Re: New build poor quality, so many problems 16Sep 25, 2015 10:48 pm Sandyfeet That's my way of thinking too, he said to them they should have gotten their plasterer back but they may as well continue and finish it. To me that's advising them to finish the job. The good part is the painters where right in the house in bedroom 4 when they spoke to the supervisor face to face. If the building company is denying the fact they allowed us entry then they better be looking at their ss who apparently leaves the doors unlocked! Argh, poor you. But that is the exact kind of reason I never tried getting a trade in before handover. And with the state of our $hit plaster why is never let their tradie back to repair. We will be tackling it ourselves... Some trades just don't give a xxxx and builders don't really seem to care. And it seems to be a theme in WA builds as far as I can see even trawling displays homes for the past 12 months the finish in some is pretty dismal. I would never build with Fowler homes. I built with them in 2021 and till date maintenance issues are pending. All their existing trades and businesses don't work with… 14 105546 They already have two well known ones (HIA & MBA) that many new home buyers mistakenly think are regulatory bodies that Joe Public can complain to. 6 18022 I am not a brick expert, but rendering would be 1 option, it would be costly to do the entire house though.... 2 6678 |