Browse Forums Building A New House 1 Nov 06, 2014 10:20 pm Hi all,
I bought a 450m2 (15x30) block in Holland Park Private Estate, Piara Waters. Title due in Jan 15. Started looking around for builders now, but still not going anywhere. Just too much sales pitch among the sales reps, you just don't know who to trust at the end of the day, plus it's our first time building. As most people would agreed, Dale Alcock would probably be the one with the highest price tag due to their reputation, but I really don't wanna pay more just for their "name". So, which builder would you recommend who still provide quality and timely build without the "dale alcock" price tag? Communication is very important to me too, as I'm working off site, so can't always visit the site to monitor the progress, so good site supervisor without crazy workload also an important factor for me. I heard about many "small" builders assigning too many projects to their site supervisors at once, causing them to be really slack in their communication and attention to details, so we really like to avoid that. At the end of the day, we're not after just cheap builders, but reasonably priced builders with good workmanship and customer service management. Love to hear from those with first hand experience. Thanks! **Added** Some of the criterias I'm focusing on when selecting plans are as below: 1) 4x2x2 at least 2) Kitchen close to window openings, i.e. not central (don't like cooking smothering the living area) 3) Fairly big alfresco area (>20m2) 4) Home theatre & office/study area 5) 2nd bathroom with shared access between smaller bedrooms So far Complete home's Sherborne promo plan http://www.completehomes.com.au/house-d ... 3-bathroom best met those criteriaa (except the alfresco quite small, but should be able to amend for bigger area?). The one thing that got me is its ugly elevation (can't win them all). What could I do to improve the elevation without spending a fortune? Love to hear your suggestions. Or if you came across any plans with those criteria mind, it'd be great if you could share. Many Thanks! Re: Good builders in Perth without "dale alcock" price tag 2Nov 06, 2014 10:23 pm I saw a top of the range Celebration homes build the other day, the owners tell everyone it was Dale Alcock built and you probably wouldn't be able to tell it wasn't if you didn't know. That is a cheaper was of getting a Dale Alcock I guess? Our build thread: https://forum.homeone.com.au/viewtopic.php?f=31&t=70984 Re: Good builders in Perth without "dale alcock" price tag 3Nov 06, 2014 11:12 pm Not basing it on any experience, but most of the bigger builders have 'cheaper' brands. I.e. celebrations (Dale alcock), Domain (plunkett/jwh group), Goodlife (gemmill) etc. I'm sure they all use the same tradies as they use on their premium spec homes. However, you'll find that if you spec the cheaper homes up to the standard of the higher priced homes, they probably aren't that far apart in pricing.
Re: Good builders in Perth without "dale alcock" price tag 4Nov 07, 2014 12:34 am Try Genesis Home Builders based in Baldivis WA. I wish I had known them before signing up with our current builder. Re: Good builders in Perth without "dale alcock" price tag 5Nov 07, 2014 8:11 am If you want quality, you're going to have to pay for it one way or the other. You will never get the same standard in a 200k home than a 300k that is based on the same design. Builders do not charge 100k extra just for their name, they'd be out of business in a month. If DAH prices are higher, it is because they just include more and better things from the start. And yes, their service is probably included in the price too, but that amount would be negligible in the total price. I'll never understand why people think they can get DAH quality with a lower price tag elsewhere. All builders charge very similar for the different things they put in their homes, they almost all use the same suppliers and get similar discounts, so if you're paying more with one, it is because you're getting more. Re: Good builders in Perth without "dale alcock" price tag 6Nov 07, 2014 11:45 am I am with Raytia - you will get what you pay for. Quality/desirable things cost more - it is as simple as that. I would be dubious going with anyone's recommendations that they got a million dollar build for $200k - it's just not possible. If you see one builder offering 'free' air conditioning worth $10k - that $10k has come out of reduced specifications or the original price was $10k inflated to compensate - there is no such thing as free air con. If you are seeking quality on a budget - have you considered reducing your home size? By going small I was able to upgrade a bucketload of stuff and the price never went over the base price of the original home (ie the credit I got for reducing the footprint went a long way). I am also a bit surprised that Dale Alcock is seen as the pinnacle of quality - even within his own company - surely Webb & Brown Neaves would be higher spec, and even then we are still in project builder territory - all these homes are built to a price and based on volume and repeatability - surely people's aspirations are a little higher Dale Alcock for their dream home? Small footprint in Eliza Ponds, Spearwood WA Re: Good builders in Perth without "dale alcock" price tag 7Nov 07, 2014 11:48 am D_rail I'm sure they all use the same tradies as they use on their premium spec homes I do not believe this is the case. The 'brands' are kept quite separate and run as independent businesses. Small footprint in Eliza Ponds, Spearwood WA Re: Good builders in Perth without "dale alcock" price tag 8Nov 07, 2014 12:26 pm Tristanium D_rail I'm sure they all use the same tradies as they use on their premium spec homes I do not believe this is the case. The 'brands' are kept quite separate and run as independent businesses. I agree with D_rail - tradies are tradies and they are transient. One thing you can count on - when you speak to the sales assistants they WILL be l*ying to you regarding time frames... it is not 12 months!! Another thing you can count on - poor communication - I don't think you will find many people on here that haven't complained about the lack of communication during their build. What you've got to watch out for - the costs of their variations or upgrades at prestart, make sure you ask your sales rep about these. An easy one to check on is their prices for additional powerpoint and lights. Also ask about if you will be allowed variations after prestart and what their charge/fee is for a variation. Some builders charge $250 for a variation, some charge $500 and some won't let you change anything at all once all documents are signed. You don't have to go with the plans they have, plenty of builders are willing to change their plans to suit exactly what you want. It is just a matter of finding the builder you are most comfortable with. My build: viewtopic.php?f=31&t=68002 Re: Good builders in Perth without "dale alcock" price tag 9Nov 07, 2014 1:47 pm skydroid Hi all, As most people would agreed, Dale Alcock would probably be the one with the highest price tag due to their reputation, but I really don't wanna pay more just for their "name". Thanks! Quality costs money quite simply. If you want better trades etc, they get paid more to keep them on their jobs. I wouldn't be saying that DAH is the most expensive in Perth by a long shot though. I'd also agree with what's mentioned above, a group of companies will not necessarily share trades either, sometimes due to the rates the tradies get, and also because a supervisor will try and maintain their own little group of tradies. Good builders in Perth without "dale alcock" price tag 10Nov 07, 2014 1:48 pm Tristanium D_rail I'm sure they all use the same tradies as they use on their premium spec homes I do not believe this is the case. The 'brands' are kept quite separate and run as independent businesses. You are right, the businesses are run separately, however the trades are shared across the group depending on demand. The businesses have been set up for the purposes of marketing and attracting consumers at different pricing points. To illustrate my point, go to the web page to register your interest in working as a tradie for Dale Alcock homes. It redirects you to a page for the 'Alcock Brown Neaves' group. Re: Good builders in Perth without "dale alcock" price tag 11Nov 07, 2014 2:13 pm Our bricklayers came from Zorzi Builders, who had no work on at the time. Our slab was laid by a team from Blue Print, our roof carpenters do work across three builders. Our renderers are on the books with Home Group. We are building with Home Group. So, while companies keep all their sub companies separate, SS will have a pool of trades they prefer to use and will call on them first - but sometimes they will look elsewhere. The only thing you can guarantee is it will take longer to build your home than any sales rep will ever promise and communication will be hit and miss, limited and likely drive you round the bend! Re: Good builders in Perth without "dale alcock" price tag 12Nov 07, 2014 2:53 pm Don't be sucked in by the quality comes at a price argument. The pool of tradies in Perth is very shallow so they are all transient and who you get is purely luck of the draw. DAH charge more but they don't deliver any more than builders who are charging significantly less. Re: Good builders in Perth without "dale alcock" price tag 13Nov 07, 2014 5:59 pm We met with Dale Alcock, Redink, Ross North before deciding to build with Visionone Homes which is part of Novus Homes. All of them quoted much (much) lower than DAH. Most of the "salesman promises" were consistent in regards to quality of their trades, build time etc etc.... How are we going so far with Visionone? We shall see and I will be updating the build in my thread So far, so good.... Our Build Thread: The "Extended" Marina by Visionone Homes Our Inspirations: Frank Lloyd Wright | Houzz Re: Good builders in Perth without "dale alcock" price tag 14Nov 08, 2014 12:19 pm Builders use the same trades across their brands. This is what I've been told by a SS (not ours) and trades themselves. The difference in price between brands come from the specifications or inclusions. Quality of build? Inspect your place very often or as much as you can. Don't rely on SS. Get a building inspector too for added peace of mind. Re: Good builders in Perth without "dale alcock" price tag 15Nov 08, 2014 2:10 pm The quality of a home is NOT solely dependent upon the trades that work in them. Agreed, it is very important, but people forget that materials in a home are also extremely important. To clarify: our house cost us 300k to build, the house next door is approx. half that. They have a 25 ceiling hardiflex alfresco, ours is 33c plasterboard. Their doors and windows are lowest quality Jason Windows, ours are high quality with low e glazing. We have sarking under our roof tiles, they don't. We have insulation in our double brick walls, they don't. And the list goes on and on. It's things like that that make the difference in price too: a more expensive builder simply adds more and better stuff in your home. (not trying to bag my neighbour, they have a lovely first home, but quality wise it doesn't compare to ours). @ Tristanium: You are right of course to say that is is odd that DAH is considered high quality when there are builders of MUCH higher quality still. I suppose this is because DAH often sits at the top of that 'normal-people income' bracket - houses of 250k-400k. Go one step beyond that and suddenly you're looking at 500 or 600K+ houses. There's this odd 100k-something gap between the usual project builders and the premium builders, and I guess DAH just sits at the top of the usual project builders, price-wise and quality-wise. Whether that is warranted is a different matter of course (though I think it is). Re: Good builders in Perth without "dale alcock" price tag 16Nov 08, 2014 3:51 pm Tristanium D_rail I'm sure they all use the same tradies as they use on their premium spec homes I do not believe this is the case. The 'brands' are kept quite separate and run as independent businesses. We are building with New Generation and so far we have had all the Summit Homes tradies. I can't fault them either, New Generation have been great for us so far. Skydroid, if you want details of the great salesman we used let me know. Re: Good builders in Perth without "dale alcock" price tag 17Nov 08, 2014 11:42 pm We are building with New Generation Homes in Heron Park, Harrisdale. I think Piara Waters is just across the road of Heron Park. My experience with NewGen Homes so far is very good. Currently we are at lockup stage. The quality of build is good as well as the communication from builder is timely. Aveiling is also a good builder, one of my friend build with them lady year and the overall process was good. If you need contact details of my sales agent then let me know. AB Building with New Generation @ Heron Park, Harrisdale, WA My Build: viewtopic.php?f=31&t=70662&p=1167117#p1167117 Re: Good builders in Perth without "dale alcock" price tag 18Nov 09, 2014 2:34 pm seabreezewaikiki Try Genesis Home Builders based in Baldivis WA. I wish I had known them before signing up with our current builder. Mind I ask why the recommendations? Re: Good builders in Perth without "dale alcock" price tag 19Nov 09, 2014 2:41 pm Raytia The quality of a home is NOT solely dependent upon the trades that work in them. Agreed, it is very important, but people forget that materials in a home are also extremely important. To clarify: our house cost us 300k to build, the house next door is approx. half that. They have a 25 ceiling hardiflex alfresco, ours is 33c plasterboard. Their doors and windows are lowest quality Jason Windows, ours are high quality with low e glazing. We have sarking under our roof tiles, they don't. We have insulation in our double brick walls, they don't. And the list goes on and on. It's things like that that make the difference in price too: a more expensive builder simply adds more and better stuff in your home. (not trying to bag my neighbour, they have a lovely first home, but quality wise it doesn't compare to ours).. So Raytia, who did you build with? Cheers Re: Good builders in Perth without "dale alcock" price tag 20Nov 09, 2014 2:45 pm Althom Don't be sucked in by the quality comes at a price argument. The pool of tradies in Perth is very shallow so they are all transient and who you get is purely luck of the draw. DAH charge more but they don't deliver any more than builders who are charging significantly less. This is the exact argument I have in mind. We're definitely in shortage of tradies in WA, but the demand for houses is so high now..you can see why I'd rather not just go with the more well known builders as I don't think they can control the situation in the industry too even though they charge more. This certainly doesn't look good. I would be engaging with an independent inspector to have a look at this. As for the unscheduled site visits, most builders are quite… 1 28157 Elvis has left the building... The site supervisor quit after 2 month on the project. I guess he was just instructed to bark at people, but didn't like when he was… 26 20826 Hi, I contracted a Builder to do a Garage to Bedroom + ensuite conversion (Class 1a), the Builder engaged the Certifier and Engineer and received BDA from the Certifier… 0 4906 |