Building with Wisdom Homes

Norfolk · Mar 19, 2020 2:53 pm

cs199 It's high risk. Not just with international supply but with local importers and installers, both for your shutters & blinds and other building materials and manufactured components required to complete your house. China is starting to come back to work now however there will likely be many factories experiencing upstream supply chain delays in coming months. If you want to take a risk, suggest to your supplier you will only pay them half their 30% USD deposit (or similar) that they have to pay their Chinese supplier to start production, then half of the remaining 70% of the (FOB) factory’s price when your shipment is loaded onto the container ship. These are normal importer payment terms. Keep as much of you money as possible in hand until the shipping container is unloaded here (with photo proof of this) Ask them for documentary proof of such factory costs in USD before you consider. If your supplier won't share the information and some covid19 supply risk then you will know they are not confident either. This may seem harsh but in these times people will just tell you BS to get the order and you need to protect yourself by limiting your exposure.

Funk52 · Mar 20, 2020 7:58 am

Anyone able to advise on disputing extension of time delays? I have noticed a few issues with Wisdom's claim.

1. Commencement date is taken as the date excavation started but the date they quoted is at least a week after this took place.

2. They are claiming 3 weeks for the industry shutdown. The contract says this only applies if you couldn't forsee this period occurring within the build period. Given my build schedule was 44 weeks I am absolutely going to push back on this.

3. Claiming for weather on days where there were only 2mm of rain recorded. The contract doesn't mention how much rainfall is required before they can claim for it.

4. Claiming for weather after the roof is on. All up they are claiming for 29 days due to weather even though Sydney was in a drought for a long time. They are claiming days in February (last month) which is ridiculous.

5. Public holidays. There is nothing in the contract about this but I don't see how it is reasonable to claim for this.

M4bath · Mar 20, 2020 9:49 am

Funk52

Anyone able to advise on disputing extension of time delays? I have noticed a few issues with Wisdom's claim.

1. Commencement date is taken as the date excavation started but the date they quoted is at least a week after this took place.

2. They are claiming 3 weeks for the industry shutdown. The contract says this only applies if you couldn't forsee this period occurring within the build period. Given my build schedule was 44 weeks I am absolutely going to push back on this.

3. Claiming for weather on days where there were only 2mm of rain recorded. The contract doesn't mention how much rainfall is required before they can claim for it.

4. Claiming for weather after the roof is on. All up they are claiming for 29 days due to weather even though Sydney was in a drought for a long time. They are claiming days in February (last month) which is ridiculous.

5. Public holidays. There is nothing in the contract about this but I don't see how it is reasonable to claim for this.

Hey Funk52, how's the new house going? Are you in?

We are under the "new" process where W is informing us now of EOT rather than end of the build and current still backdating to early Mar. There are days of EOT where work was done so then it is removed, only after the CSR checks with SS.

I have been wondering whether the 3 weeks over Xmas/NY is counted in the build period and now knowing the clause you mention, it would be interesting to see feedback from other's.

Yea, how does rain days apply after lockup??

How many days/weeks are you over the build time of 44 weeks?

Funk52 · Mar 20, 2020 10:25 am

M4bath

Funk52

Anyone able to advise on disputing extension of time delays? I have noticed a few issues with Wisdom's claim.

1. Commencement date is taken as the date excavation started but the date they quoted is at least a week after this took place.

2. They are claiming 3 weeks for the industry shutdown. The contract says this only applies if you couldn't forsee this period occurring within the build period. Given my build schedule was 44 weeks I am absolutely going to push back on this.

3. Claiming for weather on days where there were only 2mm of rain recorded. The contract doesn't mention how much rainfall is required before they can claim for it.

4. Claiming for weather after the roof is on. All up they are claiming for 29 days due to weather even though Sydney was in a drought for a long time. They are claiming days in February (last month) which is ridiculous.

5. Public holidays. There is nothing in the contract about this but I don't see how it is reasonable to claim for this.

Hey Funk52, how's the new house going? Are you in?

We are under the "new" process where W is informing us now of EOT rather than end of the build and current still backdating to early Mar. There are days of EOT where work was done so then it is removed, only after the CSR checks with SS.

I have been wondering whether the 3 weeks over Xmas/NY is counted in the build period and now knowing the clause you mention, it would be interesting to see feedback from other's.

Yea, how does rain days apply after lockup??

How many days/weeks are you over the build time of 44 weeks?

Not yet. Initial inspection was at the end of February. There were a lot of issues found so the practical completion got pushed back a month. Also looks like they will be installing the pool pump equipment soon. The pool itself was installed 3 months ago.

I have sent Wisdom an email disputing their EOT claim. Want to do this now instead of waiting for the new PC date so I can resolve it sooner. End date should be 18th of February according to my calculations. Wisdom is claiming an additional 48 days on top of this. I have rejected everything except for 6 genuine rain days prior to the plasterboard stage.

Hoping for handover by mid April. Still need to get the driveway and landscaping done after handover before I move in. House should look great once its all done. Also have other things to install like solar panels, home theatre system, built in furniture etc.

One · Mar 24, 2020 9:51 pm

Hoping for some advice from those who have been through the final stages with Wisdom. We received a notice of practical completion with a date for inspection (we need to organise it with SS). Other than finances, what should we be doing to prepare? When should we organise our independent inspector to do their inspection?

I am confused about the final payment. I was under the assumption that would be be paid after PCI, which would be after Wisdom has addressed items that may be identified by independent inspection report. The letter I received seemed to suggest that the final 10% needs to be paid before PCI... Any ideas?

Norfolk · Mar 25, 2020 8:15 am

One I built with Metricon. Wisdom Homes processes are similar to theirs, and the pool of sub contractors they both use are the same, or of the same price / quality market position. Given this I would suggest you do a thorough Professional inspection before the PCI presentation. Also accompany your inspector.
if any major issues are identified you can dispute that practical completion has been achieved on the PCI day and then back this up with a formal Notification. This way at PCI you can relax knowing any major defect issues have already been identified and focus on the ‘game’ of marking minor paint blemishes and scratches etc with blue masking tape that your SS wants to play.

The final invoice is normally issued after the PCI presentation for payment of the 10% (less any offsets like liquidated damages or negotiated compensation etc) before you get the keys. Any minor defect rectification will be sone in the 1-2 weeks after PCI and before handover.

faykis · Mar 27, 2020 4:25 pm

[quote="WisdomHomes"]

Hi Mark, hope you are well. I hope its not wrong to address you here. We paid deposit for tender on 29/2/20 and out tender presentation is booked for 30/4/2020. Is there anyway we can bring this forward?

I understand that the team needs this time to complete all the necessary steps and therefore needs 6-8 weeks time. Our bank preapproval will run out early May and I am going on Maternity leave in May too. I really love the plan of our wisdom home design and would love to stick with Wisdom Homes as much as possible. Unfortunately due to the time limitations and our situation, we may need to go with other builders although we do not prefer them. Is there anyway this could be helped?

Thanks heaps

Manhattan52 · Mar 27, 2020 4:34 pm

faykis

You would probably need to PM Mark rather than comment on the forum about your particular issue

Are you waiting on your tender in order to seek your full approval for finance? Typically you would need a signed contract, end panel and council or CDC approved plans for your approval. This does differ between lenders though

Ambassador36 · Mar 27, 2020 5:18 pm

How is everyone tracking with their builds? We had the frames inspection yesterday which was exciting but we are unsure how the rest of our build will progress in the current climate.

Stay safe everyone

Norfolk · Mar 28, 2020 11:19 am

PeterJess have you completed your pre-lining inspection now? If yes, how did it go? Any issues?

faykis · Mar 28, 2020 12:14 pm

Manhattan52

@faykis

You would probably need to PM Mark rather than comment on the forum about your particular issue

Are you waiting on your tender in order to seek your full approval for finance? Typically you would need a signed contract, end panel and council or CDC approved plans for your approval. This does differ between lenders though

We have pre approval for building loan. Already have land loan running with the same bank. Our bank said they’ll give us A conditional approval based on a fixed price tender including plans n inclusions. Then full unconditional approval with CDC approved plans. Any extra selection choices may or may not be considered by the bank later on depending on situation and we may have to be prepared to pay post tender variations out of pocket.

We cant risk waiting for 30/4 thats too late to sign, then wait for the bank to do building valuation that late. valuation may come low at that time looking at the way the economy is going. We spoke to our broker (direct from bank) yesterday and he said if we can get the fixed price tender in now the building valuation should be ok if done this month/ quicker, he cant comment on how things may turn out if we have to wait till May.

Stukip · Mar 29, 2020 2:23 pm

I had suspicions WH were expensive on the landscaping side of things and we have asked them to do several things as part of our build where it made sense to us and the quality so far is good. But I now have the cost side of things confirmed.

We have a somewhat gently sloping block that requires a drop edge beam to the side of driveway for say 3-4 metres. We also had to have the dreaded Onsite Detention Tanks demanded by council under the driveway. When WH give you the $25k hydraulics quote back at End Panel stage, they don’t tell you that you will also have to have effectively a suspended driveway with piers and beams to protect the OSD tanks under the driveway, that I didn’t want in the first place.

WH quote for driveway, side path, steps to front door from front footpath, remove and reinstall damaged footpath (that WH contractors damaged mind you), remove and reinstall crossover and layback etc $67k.

First quote from independent concretor for virtually same thing - $30k. Just need to check this quote includes top colour to concrete. I’m sure this won’t cost $37k!

Funk52 · Mar 29, 2020 4:37 pm

One

Hoping for some advice from those who have been through the final stages with Wisdom. We received a notice of practical completion with a date for inspection (we need to organise it with SS). Other than finances, what should we be doing to prepare? When should we organise our independent inspector to do their inspection?

I am confused about the final payment. I was under the assumption that would be be paid after PCI, which would be after Wisdom has addressed items that may be identified by independent inspection report. The letter I received seemed to suggest that the final 10% needs to be paid before PCI... Any ideas?

Hi One,

My experience was that Wisdom sent me the notice of practical completion on the same day I organised for the inspection to take place. After finding a multitude of issues the official PCI date got pushed back another 4 weeks. I will not be paying the final invoice until I am satisfied that the issues I highlighted have been rectified to a reasonable standard and the bank also has to do a final valuation on the property. Although I won't hold up the process if there are some very minor issues remaining which can be fixed before handover.

Funk52 · Mar 29, 2020 5:02 pm

Stukip

WH quote for driveway, side path, steps to front door from front footpath, remove and reinstall damaged footpath (that WH contractors damaged mind you), remove and reinstall crossover and layback etc $67k.

First quote from independent concretor for virtually same thing - $30k. Just need to check this quote includes top colour to concrete. I’m sure this won’t cost $37k!

This is exactly why I didn't get any Landscaping done through Wisdom, only the swimming pool. Otherwise I was having a tough time trying to figure out where I could get the most bang for my buck with the landscaping voucher.

Funk52 · Mar 30, 2020 6:31 pm

Just had my second PC inspection today. Other than a few minor issues (which they will fix promptly) looks like everything else has been fixed to a reasonable standard.

Now I have a new issue which has come up. My bank (NAB) requires an interim occupation certificate before releasing the final payment. Wisdom's certifiers are claiming that I need to get the driveway (and a few other things) done before they can issue the certificate. The things they are saying I need to do are all items which will be completed after handover by my landscaper. I believe they have misinterpreted my DA requirements.

The bank does not agree that those items need to be done before the interim certificate can be issued so is refusing to release the funds. I have gone back and forth with my CSR on this issue and have asked her to escalate it to her manager.

Has anyone else had this issue?

BigD · Mar 30, 2020 7:03 pm

Wisdom Landscape Voucher

What are people using their free(?) voucher for??

M4bath · Mar 31, 2020 9:57 pm

Funk52

Just had my second PC inspection today. Other than a few minor issues (which they will fix promptly) looks like everything else has been fixed to a reasonable standard.

Now I have a new issue which has come up. My bank (NAB) requires an interim occupation certificate before releasing the final payment. Wisdom's certifiers are claiming that I need to get the driveway (and a few other things) done before they can issue the certificate. The things they are saying I need to do are all items which will be completed after handover by my landscaper. I believe they have misinterpreted my DA requirements.

The bank does not agree that those items need to be done before the interim certificate can be issued so is refusing to release the funds. I have gone back and forth with my CSR on this issue and have asked her to escalate it to her manager.

Has anyone else had this issue?

That’s interesting. I thought the interim OC no longer exist ..??

M4bath · Mar 31, 2020 10:00 pm

BigD

Wisdom Landscape Voucher

What are people using their free(?) voucher for??

Tough choice what to do eh, the quotes so far seem rather expensive compared to other landscapers. If their cost was just a tad more than the market, they would have much more business. I’m considering to do one side of my fence as it needs replacing.

M4bath · Mar 31, 2020 10:01 pm

faykis

Manhattan52

@faykis

You would probably need to PM Mark rather than comment on the forum about your particular issue

Are you waiting on your tender in order to seek your full approval for finance? Typically you would need a signed contract, end panel and council or CDC approved plans for your approval. This does differ between lenders though

We have pre approval for building loan. Already have land loan running with the same bank. Our bank said they’ll give us A conditional approval based on a fixed price tender including plans n inclusions. Then full unconditional approval with CDC approved plans. Any extra selection choices may or may not be considered by the bank later on depending on situation and we may have to be prepared to pay post tender variations out of pocket.

We cant risk waiting for 30/4 thats too late to sign, then wait for the bank to do building valuation that late. valuation may come low at that time looking at the way the economy is going. We spoke to our broker (direct from bank) yesterday and he said if we can get the fixed price tender in now the building valuation should be ok if done this month/ quicker, he cant comment on how things may turn out if we have to wait till May.

Did you end up having your tender moved to a closer date?

M4bath · Mar 31, 2020 10:13 pm

Ambassador36

How is everyone tracking with their builds? We had the frames inspection yesterday which was exciting but we are unsure how the rest of our build will progress in the current climate.

Stay safe everyone

Fortunately the construction industry is still running! Our build has been slower than I like in the last 2 months and believe it comes down to lack of tradies available.

Got a house down the street (would have went with that volume builder but was told they don’t build in my area 😳 ) that did their slab while we were in the framing stage. Now they are ahead in the internal stage and yes, similar size house.

One thing I realised is regardless if your frames are bowed or plumb during the inspection, they won’t be fixed until the last possible minute before the plasterboard. Guess that’s ok ... as long as it is fixed.