Browse Forums Building A New House 1 May 19, 2022 12:14 am Hi, can anyone advise if online build calculators are accurate and up to date such as the bmt quantity surveyors. I want to check cost of building single storey in Sydney objectively. Have three builders quotes they varying wildly for 280sqm 4 bed 3 living 2 bath. 660k, 750k, 800k. Mid inclusions flat land. The large difference makes me suspect price gouging or taking advantage of uninformed customer but i don't want someone who is too cheap and cut corners. How do you work out if the quote is reliable? Re: Cost of single storey build 2May 19, 2022 5:03 am macx Hi, can anyone advise if online build calculators are accurate and up to date such as the bmt quantity surveyors. I want to check cost of building single storey in Sydney objectively. Have three builders quotes they varying wildly for 280sqm 4 bed 3 living 2 bath. 660k, 750k, 800k. Mid inclusions flat land. The large difference makes me suspect price gouging or taking advantage of uninformed customer but i don't want someone who is too cheap and cut corners. How do you work out if the quote is reliable? Hi Macx, We just priced up our first ever 2 story, 260sqm came in at $2700/sqm or $700k. Would be happy to share the spreadsheet with you if you email me - simeon@ashingtonhomes.com.au Then you can see the accurate cost of each item, but I would say your $750k one is close to being accurate. cheers Simeon Architectural Homes & Duplexes - specialising in custom designing homes to your budget Get a Free Onsite Consultation Today or send a PM for information, questions or advice. Re: Cost of single storey build 3May 19, 2022 9:13 am Hey macx Welcome to the forum There is quite a difference in pricing between 1S and 2S homes. As for oneline pricing calculators... forget them atm as they are too difficult to maintain Once builders stop updating their pricing, data solvers for analysis become usless...besides you don't want to using Metricon oneline house prices. (humour) Best to start with a 3D Bim sketch (without the fake BS coloured renderings) , include your own build data and 1st quantities, key trigger rates are online, make sure you include engineering. 3D Bim, 1st Quantities, Internet pricing , MS open data Expect big discounts from timber suppliers once housing starts dry up and supplies normalise. Though if you are locked into contracts and delayed you won't be seeing any discounts. Cheers Chris Designer,Engineer (Civil,Const & Envir),Builder,Concrete & Masonry Contract.Struct Repairs Re: Cost of single storey build 4May 19, 2022 10:39 am StructuralBIMGuy Hey macx Welcome to the forum There is quite a difference in pricing between 1S and 2S homes. As for oneline pricing calculators... forget them atm as they are too difficult to maintain Once builders stop updating their pricing, data solvers for analysis become usless...besides you don't want to using Metricon oneline house prices. (humour) Best to start with a 3D Bim sketch (without the fake BS coloured renderings) , include your own build data and 1st quantities, key trigger rates are online, make sure you include engineering. 3D Bim, 1st Quantities, Internet pricing , MS open data Expect big discounts from timber suppliers once housing starts dry up and supplies normalise. Though if you are locked into contracts and delayed you won't be seeing any discounts. Cheers Chris Chris That was a very good post and good advice! Cheers Simeon Architectural Homes & Duplexes - specialising in custom designing homes to your budget Get a Free Onsite Consultation Today or send a PM for information, questions or advice. Re: Cost of single storey build 5May 19, 2022 10:51 am StructuralBIMGuy Hey macx Welcome to the forum There is quite a difference in pricing between 1S and 2S homes. As for oneline pricing calculators... forget them atm as they are too difficult to maintain Once builders stop updating their pricing, data solvers for analysis become usless...besides you don't want to using Metricon oneline house prices. (humour) Best to start with a 3D Bim sketch (without the fake BS coloured renderings) , include your own build data and 1st quantities, key trigger rates are online, make sure you include engineering. 3D Bim, 1st Quantities, Internet pricing , MS open data Expect big discounts from timber suppliers once housing starts dry up and supplies normalise. Though if you are locked into contracts and delayed you won't be seeing any discounts. Cheers Chris Hi Chris Good comment. Curious as to what you think the difference would be from a 1S to 2S? Assuming level of finish is the same, a 30sq 1S to a 30sq 2S. I've often heard builders say the pricing is the same, but being 1 level I would have thought it would be considerably cheaper to build. Re: Cost of single storey build 6May 19, 2022 11:31 am AJ1111 Curious as to what you think the difference would be from a 1S to 2S? Assuming level of finish is the same, a 30sq 1S to a 30sq 2S. We build double brick and concrete suspended slabs, so make sure the build materials are the same? Try This Builder 1 GF house area m2 x $X /m2 + 1F house area m2 x $Y/m2 = $ Base House cost Builder 2 GF house area m2 x $X /m2 + 1F house area m2 x $Y/m2 = $ Base House cost Builder 3 GF house area m2 x $X /m2 + 1F house area m2 x $Y/m2 = $ Base House cost cost Approximate simultaneously GF and 1F, X & Y costs m2 -> simple math/graphing If you wish to get closer to the costs you will need to add in more variables but there is a limit to the computing power available . hth AJ1111 I've often heard builders say the pricing is the same, but being 1 level I would have thought it would be considerably cheaper to build. That doesn't make sense...... Handling and placing/fixing a Hundred tonnes of materials on upper floors comes at addition costs Cheers Chris Designer,Engineer (Civil,Const & Envir),Builder,Concrete & Masonry Contract.Struct Repairs Re: Cost of single storey build 7May 19, 2022 12:22 pm StructuralBIMGuy AJ1111 Curious as to what you think the difference would be from a 1S to 2S? Assuming level of finish is the same, a 30sq 1S to a 30sq 2S. We build double brick and concrete suspended slabs, so make sure the build materials are the same? Try This Builder 1 GF house area m2 x $X /m2 + 1F house area m2 x $Y/m2 = $ Base House cost Builder 2 GF house area m2 x $X /m2 + 1F house area m2 x $Y/m2 = $ Base House cost Builder 3 GF house area m2 x $X /m2 + 1F house area m2 x $Y/m2 = $ Base House cost cost Approximate simultaneously GF and 1F, X & Y costs m2 -> simple math/graphing If you wish to get closer to the costs you will need to add in more variables but there is a limit to the computing power available . hth AJ1111 I've often heard builders say the pricing is the same, but being 1 level I would have thought it would be considerably cheaper to build. That doesn't make sense...... Handling and placing/fixing a Hundred tonnes of materials on upper floors comes at addition costs Cheers Chris Thanks Chris. Yes I agree, it doesn't make sense to me either. I actually haven't had a builder discuss sqm price by floor level, just all in one. I'll start asking this is see what they say. Cheers Re: Cost of single storey build 8May 19, 2022 1:26 pm Ashington Homes macx Hi, can anyone advise if online build calculators are accurate and up to date such as the bmt quantity surveyors. I want to check cost of building single storey in Sydney objectively. Have three builders quotes they varying wildly for 280sqm 4 bed 3 living 2 bath. 660k, 750k, 800k. Mid inclusions flat land. The large difference makes me suspect price gouging or taking advantage of uninformed customer but i don't want someone who is too cheap and cut corners. How do you work out if the quote is reliable? Hi Macx, We just priced up our first ever 2 story, 260sqm came in at $2700/sqm or $700k. Would be happy to share the spreadsheet with you if you email me - simeon@ashingtonhomes.com.au Then you can see the accurate cost of each item, but I would say your $750k one is close to being accurate. cheers Simeon Hi Simeon Did you mean $2700 sqm for a single or double storey? That must be fairly high spec? Re: Cost of single storey build 9May 19, 2022 1:46 pm AJ1111 Ashington Homes macx Hi, can anyone advise if online build calculators are accurate and up to date such as the bmt quantity surveyors. I want to check cost of building single storey in Sydney objectively. Have three builders quotes they varying wildly for 280sqm 4 bed 3 living 2 bath. 660k, 750k, 800k. Mid inclusions flat land. The large difference makes me suspect price gouging or taking advantage of uninformed customer but i don't want someone who is too cheap and cut corners. How do you work out if the quote is reliable? Hi Macx, We just priced up our first ever 2 story, 260sqm came in at $2700/sqm or $700k. Would be happy to share the spreadsheet with you if you email me - simeon@ashingtonhomes.com.au Then you can see the accurate cost of each item, but I would say your $750k one is close to being accurate. cheers Simeon Hi Simeon Did you mean $2700 sqm for a single or double storey? That must be fairly high spec? For a single story $2700/sqm same double story around $3000/sqm Main differences are no scaffolding, no stairs, slightly less wall area, trades charge less for material handling ie taking gyprock upstairs, less rough ins, but with a single story you do have more roof area and more concrete. We build to a medium to high specification and our prices include demolition and landscaping generally. No upgrades needed by the client ( ie we include downlights to all rooms, clipsal iconic powerpoints and switches, cameras, alarm, intercoms etc and a high range of stone to all joinery), square set cornices and more I hope that helps Simeon Architectural Homes & Duplexes - specialising in custom designing homes to your budget Get a Free Onsite Consultation Today or send a PM for information, questions or advice. Re: Cost of single storey build 10May 19, 2022 2:16 pm Thanks Simeon. Good to get some input. $2700/sqm is probably out of the budget range for me, but it's great you do landscaping/demo/upgrades etc inclusive. We've been pricing up with a couple of builders. Claredon seem to be coming in at around $2000/sqm with upgrades for one of their off the shelf single storey designs that tick most of our boxes. Still need to add demo/landscaping, maybe a pool. Re: Cost of single storey build 11May 19, 2022 3:00 pm AJ1111 Thanks Simeon. Good to get some input. $2700/sqm is probably out of the budget range for me, but it's great you do landscaping/demo/upgrades etc inclusive. We've been pricing up with a couple of builders. Claredon seem to be coming in at around $2000/sqm with upgrades for one of their off the shelf single storey designs that tick most of our boxes. Still need to add demo/landscaping, maybe a pool. Sounds cool! Clarendon are a good project home company. We put a lot more money into the structure and thermal insulation and we pay for a foreman to be onsite most of the time to ensure quality. But Clarendon are a good fit for people who can't afford custom. Clarendon built my first home in 2004/5 and it is still standing , oh and the owners ( who I know love reading my posts) are very nice as well. Although they did fire me once - Thanks Matt Cheers Simeon Architectural Homes & Duplexes - specialising in custom designing homes to your budget Get a Free Onsite Consultation Today or send a PM for information, questions or advice. Re: Cost of single storey build 12May 19, 2022 4:17 pm Thanks all this has been a good discussion. What i'd like to know is how builders do their margins when they price. Do they total their costs then apply an x% margin on top? Or do they get crafty and add some margin into each cost item then also add x% on the total 'inflated cost'? No transparency and hard for customer to follow every cost 'farm to table'. Chris, appreciate your comments and if i could get it down to cost/unit of things i would. As an average Joe interested to know where can i access this BIM sketch? Doesn't sound like it's part of the average Joe's budgeting toolkit so would i have to pay an enginner? Not sure i have the resources or time, though sounds like it might be $ worth spending to be fully informed, Re: Cost of single storey build 13May 20, 2022 1:26 pm If the Architect / Designer or the builder has provided you with a coloured rendered image of the project, then you can assume correctly that they are using 3D bim modelling software. here Show us your facades If they can't/ or won't show you the associated engineering Bim model and data, then they will be lining you up for price increases latter on in the documentation process as engineering is an easy target eg Siteworks, Footing Upgrades $50k-$150k? Think of it this way. They'll paint you a realistic picture of your project, and fill in the details and engineering later on in the process... Home builders pay excessive building charges for engineering upgrades, most don't blink an eyelid, saying "they trust engineers.." The question is can you trust most salesman/builders? Unfortunately, that's how the industry has evolved. Now if you want certified engineering 3D bim and data then you need to find an engineer that will do it for you. The flip side is why builders can't and don't want to do it for you as we all use a common 3D Bim Software ( that's a question for your builder?). Cheers Chris Designer,Engineer (Civil,Const & Envir),Builder,Concrete & Masonry Contract.Struct Repairs Re: Cost of single storey build 14May 20, 2022 2:56 pm macx No transparency and hard for customer to follow every cost 'farm to table'. do you really need to though? you're either happy with the price, or you're not. if you're not - you can question it and see if it can come down, but at the end of the day it's up to the builder to price his builds in a sustainable manner and ensure customers are happy that they get value for their money. if you want to know all the costs 'farm to table' - that's where owner building comes in. Re: Cost of single storey build 15May 20, 2022 3:47 pm Good point. I think builders like any business needs to run a sustainable busines or everyone will end up where metricon is. Where i am coming from is i know nothing about building and being given three quotes varying 140k (much more than i expected) makes me question how profit is being made or how things are charged. It hasn’t been that clear to me. The price of 1 brick should be fairly consistent among builders, right there’s only a couple of manufacturer phg and austral. Bricklayers might charge differently but shouldn’t vary that much? Reminds me of plumbers charging what they like except building a house is expenditure on a far greater scale Re: Cost of single storey build 16May 20, 2022 3:57 pm with quotes being that far apart (and assuming those quotes are like for like and aren't just from sales people) i'd start looking into what each builder brings to the table in terms of value. e.g the cheapest one could be doing a sloppy job constantly delaying his build, and the most expensive one could be impeccable build that allows high degree of flexibility and quality oversight. however if the quote came from a sales person, rather than from builders pricing an exact spec that you could sign a contract on today, you might discover that those numbers are wildly inaccurate and change a lot by the time you actually get to contract signing. so while a brick at the brickyard is a brick at the brickyard, a brick in the wall is not necessarily a brick in another wall. Re: Cost of single storey build 18May 20, 2022 4:20 pm strannik with quotes being that far apart (and assuming those quotes are like for like and aren't just from sales people) i'd start looking into what each builder brings to the table in terms of value. e.g the cheapest one could be doing a sloppy job constantly delaying his build, and the most expensive one could be impeccable build that allows high degree of flexibility and quality oversight. however if the quote came from a sales person, rather than from builders pricing an exact spec that you could sign a contract on today, you might discover that those numbers are wildly inaccurate and change a lot by the time you actually get to contract signing. so while a brick at the brickyard is a brick at the brickyard, a brick in the wall is not necessarily a brick in another wall. Thanks that will be my next step thanks Strannik Re: Cost of single storey build 19May 20, 2022 4:23 pm macx Good point. I think builders like any business needs to run a sustainable busines or everyone will end up where metricon is. Where i am coming from is i know nothing about building and being given three quotes varying 140k (much more than i expected) makes me question how profit is being made or how things are charged. It hasn’t been that clear to me. The price of 1 brick should be fairly consistent among builders, right there’s only a couple of manufacturer phg and austral. Bricklayers might charge differently but shouldn’t vary that much? Reminds me of plumbers charging what they like except building a house is expenditure on a far greater scale Macx Think about it like a car, there are cheap ones that use cheap materials and there are expensive ones that use more expensive materials and have better quality assurance processes. Using just bricks is a poor example. Expensive builder may use a stronger concrete, may put more steel in your concrete, may put more labour into supervising the concreters to make sure your slab is set out properly and vibrated correctly whilst the cheaper builder just gives your slab to a concreter and never attends site. Have a look on here at some of the pictures where frames are overhanging slabs or sewer pipes are coming through bottom plates. The more expensive builder may be cutting frames on site whilst the cheaper one may be using prefab frames. There is a massive difference in quality between the two methods. There is a ton of difference between a cheap house and a more expensive house. There are also a lot of builders who are not pricing jobs properly and may go broke. You cant just assume that the expensive one is ripping you off. You should ask them about what makes them different. Architectural Homes & Duplexes - specialising in custom designing homes to your budget Get a Free Onsite Consultation Today or send a PM for information, questions or advice. Re: Cost of single storey build 20May 20, 2022 5:36 pm macx Where i am coming from is i know nothing about building and being given three quotes varying 140k (much more than i expected) makes me question how profit is being made or how things are charged. It hasn’t been that clear to me. The price of 1 brick should be fairly consistent among builders, right there’s only a couple of manufacturer phg and austral. Bricklayers might charge differently but shouldn’t vary that much? Reminds me of plumbers charging what they like except building a house is expenditure on a far greater scale Hey macx Precisely why you need a base line for cross checking builders data and quotes The designer/Architect could be p!ssing in your pocket, as most get hidden commissions on leads/designs. Asking builders is pointless too, the builder that's too high is going to tell you the lowest guy left something out? On the other hand the lowest quote builder will be telling you the others are r!pping you off.. only to pull your pants down with increased variation costings...if you aren't informed you can't choose wisely Plumbers, electrician and licensed trades have been over charging for years now the other trades have also cottoned on and are using the same tricks, break the jobs/trades down to a flat price and compare the meerkats lol, Tell your brickie, "I've been to the Stuttgart, mate, we aren't building Mercedes- Benz's here, the job pays to lay bricks for houses that's it" Quote Cheers Chris Designer,Engineer (Civil,Const & Envir),Builder,Concrete & Masonry Contract.Struct Repairs Hello All 🙂 We are planning to start our journey of construction our first home. We zeroed down on Metricon and henley homes based on design suitable for our lot and… 0 8200 The price you're seeing for a high-spec 2-storey home in Perth sounds steep, but unfortunately, it's kind of the norm these… 8 7956 1 4581 |