Browse Forums Building A New House 1 Feb 28, 2013 10:14 pm what can anyone tell me about the responsibility of the builder when there are visible ceiling and wall joins? they claim it's within "tolerance" but in my opinion it's visible to the naked eye under normal lighting and with daylight shining through the windows. if that is within australian standard, australian standard is quite poor.. Re: visible ceiling/wall joins 2Mar 01, 2013 2:09 am The problem is called glanced light. Modern construction and sunlight from a window tends to exaggerate the problem. There is a lot more information here http://www.anewhouse.com.au/?p=1401 The Harder You Try - the Luckier You Get ! Web site http://www.anewhouse.com.au Informative, Amusing, and Opinionated Blog - Over 600 posts on all aspects of building a new house. Re: visible ceiling/wall joins 3Mar 01, 2013 5:49 am This is where I disagree with others in the industry and in particularly with BC that produced The Guide to Standards and Tolerances. Many people mistakenly think that the guide is the standard,the law it's not. All it is is tolerance for dummies. The problem with the guide is that it attempts to "formalise" defects. Something looks like s**t but it's OK because it is within tolerances. I have seen many items of work that were defective yet there was builder's attempt to avoid rectification because it was "within tolerances" I am a builder and yes I believe that every builder is entitled to tolerance but what is reasonable is always a question of fact and not what is written by BC. So how do we do it? Here we are guided by law in Victoria and in particular Domestic Building Contract Act 1995 S8 Implied warranties : (d)(1)The builder warrants that the work will be carried out with reasonable care and skill. Builders are educated and trained for the precise reason so that they can produce building work that is not only functional but also pleasing to the eye. Pleasing to the eye means free from obvious defects. Free from evidence of lack of care and skill. In my view a proper assessment of defect is to look at the workmanship in question and ask: Would a reasonable person expect better standard from a tradesperson ordinarily skilled in their art? If the answer is yes, then yes a defect is confirmed. That is the law, forget about the guide. My derivative on that is Mladichek Law No2 "If it looks wrong it is" Ask yourself a question. Would managing directors of building company have the same display of workmanship in their house? There is your answer. To answer Ownit problem: If you can see joints in normal daylight viewing conditions it's a defect. Don't let anyone tell you otherwise. Foremost Building Expert in Australia,assisting with building problems/disputes, building stage inspections,pre-contract review advice for peace of mind 200 blogs http://www.buildingexpert.net.au/blog Re: visible ceiling/wall joins 4Mar 02, 2013 8:08 pm Great answer BE. Even dealing with engineers/technicians on a daily basis (both electrical and mechanical), it's not uncommon to have them falling back the age old excuse of tolerances to avoid fixing sloppy work or even arguing against possible design flaws. Sometimes pride in workmanship is inherent, other times it simply needs to be forced up them Complain until it's to your satisfaction! Re: visible ceiling/wall joins 5Mar 02, 2013 8:13 pm Thank you Marmalade it's nice to be appreciated. Foremost Building Expert in Australia,assisting with building problems/disputes, building stage inspections,pre-contract review advice for peace of mind 200 blogs http://www.buildingexpert.net.au/blog It sounds like you have a crack in your garage where the wall meets the ceiling, along the shadow line on the… 0 17131 Thank you again Simeon.. I will call my certifier for that. Have a good day 4 5105 Unless the room is for storage then it's non compliant BCA V2 2019 S3 P3.8 You have 2 options 1. The builder deconstructs the section and rebuilds as per plan /… 7 10610 |