Sunset date

Hi everyone,

I'm buying an off-plan land lot at waterside which is developed by Stockland and I’m having a problem. I was told by its salesman the registration date would be next August (2011). They sent the contract to my solicitor and I met with the solicitor this morning. My solicitor brought up an issue about sunset date to me. The sunset date is about one year after the expected registration date, i.e. June 2012. And the contract says they rely on the sunset date to complete the land development, which means if they don’t complete the land development next August, they can extend it to at most June 2012. And only until then can I withdraw/terminate the contract. So the possible worst situation for me might be I end up without getting the land after about TWO years, and I can only get my deposit back and won’t get any compensation, and I waste two years to buy other land or house.

My solicitor also told me it’s normal there is a sunset date for off-plan lands and sunset date is normally 6-9 months after registration date. My situation is awkward because the expected registration date is already a bit long to now (next August). So plus one-year sunset date, it would be a too big risk for me. It wouldn’t be a problem if the expected registration date is 3 or 6 months later.

I’m very worried about the risk at the moment and am considering not signing the contract. Anyone has any comments/suggestion? Anyone had similar long sunset date and what was your experience? Any reply will be appreciated.

BTW, there is another requirement in the contract that I cannot start to build my house until they complete an acoustic wall and also complete several houses opposite to my land, which is required by Penrith council. So the plan for my land is not independent and instead is a part of neighbourhood development. I guess the reason for the two-year-later sunset date might be they need this time buffer to ensure they can complete all these work.

How nice a "sunset date" sounds .... but how nasty they are in practice.

To be honest with you I wouldn't trust a developer as far as I can throw them (and I'm pretty weak ). I signed a contract to purchase land in September 2009, it was meant to settle in December 2009. In reality it settled in April of 2010 significantly delaying the building of my home and there was nothing I could do about it. Bottom line: don't believe what the developers tell you as unless it's included in the contract it's not binding.

So in your case if you can't put up with a delay of 2 years plus (and lets face it who wants to wait that long?) you're best to walk away and find another block. By all means ask your solicitor to seek variations to the contract which are more to your liking but, in my experience, developers simply won't change anything because they know they have you over a barrel. At least here in Victoria land is so hard to come by that you may struggle to find another block that you like and can afford.

Sorry for all of the doom and gloom but better for you to go into the whole process with open eyes. Best of luck with it all.

Hi grom40,
Thanks for your reply. Yeah, it’s very frustrating when it’s delayed. Land in Sydney is also hot so I don’t want to give it up easily on the other hand.
I went to another land estate Jordan Spring today and talked with its sales about sunset day. It looks they have the same stuff, i.e. sunset date is about one year after expected registration date. I’m thinking maybe developers just put it in the contract for worst situation, but the possibility for the worst situation to happen is very small. To me, it is acceptable if it is delayed less than half year.
Also I checked some information about Stockland and it looks like a good company with a long history and with a lots of land estates under development. This reduces the possibility of worst situation further.

I’m not sure about the average situation about sunset date so I have a simple question: How long was the period between your sunset date and your expected registration date and what actually happened?

Anyone can share experience on this? Many thanks.

Stockland is a big developer, so that's an advantage I think. They have several estates down here in Victoria.

But you probably hit the nail on the head when you said the land is hot and you don't want to give it up easily - the developers know this and they will adjust the contracts to favor themselves, knowing that you have no choice but to accept. I also accepted a contract with some unfavorable conditions because if I didn't, someone else would.

As btherl said, Stockland is well known here in Victoria (they even run a shopping centre in my neck of the woods!) so I wouldn't be worried about that. But just being a widely known company does not give you any confirmation that they will finish the subdivision when they say they will.

I managed to negotiate with my developer to get the sunset date amended to 6 months from the time I signed the contract (which I needed to do for FHOG purposes). In fact, as I've said previously, the land did not settle until about 7 months from when I signed the contract. Technically I could have gotten out of the contract and been refunded my deposit however I had already committed myself to that block of land with my builder and land is scarce so I really didn't want to go through the whole rigmarole again.

If I were you I wouldn't be committing to buying the block of land you are looking at unless you can cope with a delay of more than 2 years. If it turns out that the land is titled sooner then that will be a pleasant surprise but don't trust what you are being told verbally- if it's not in the contract it's not binding.

I agree with Grom. It is in the contract that it can be delayed, so if you're not prepared to wait that long, don't go with it. These companies tell you what you want to hear, to get you to sign. We signed for our land in November 09 and were told land would title and settlement would be in February 10. In reality, our land settlement was the middle of July 10. Quite a long delay, and not what we expected.

Hi All,

I too recently purchased a piece of land in SW Sydney (paid the deposit for it after the cooling off).
The salesperson says the developers will be ready by the end of October 10 now he is saying 2nd week of November.

The scariest thing is we too have a sunset clause- 9months.

What has been everyone's experience, do developers finish on time?? or do they keep on postponing??

Thanks all for sharing.

Yes, we're weak party in this matter...

The bad thing of sunset date is it gives us the worst case and it is uncertain. My contract says the Completion date (the same as expected registration date to me) is about 1 year, i.e. next August. But developers are entitled to rely on the sunset date to complete. So it might be on time, 1 month delay, 2 months delay and so on until sunset date. If it's normal that people have a long period sunset date on contract but averagely it doesn't delayed that long, it wouldn't be a problem for me then. So I'm interested in twoplus1's questions too.
Also, I am considering other land lots which don't have the acoustic wall stuff and would be more likely to be completed on time. Buying a land is not easy...

Wow, this is surprising to me. Our developer amended the contract in regards to sunset date, deposit required, fee for breaking design covenants, provision of services to the block, the minor changes % re land size and a few other things. They are running some pretty major developments around the country too. Our solicitor flagged a number of these things and said it can't hurt to ask so we did.

I guess not being in a capital city (Hunter region) might help a bit as there's none of this camping out for land business up there.

Hi Greatplateau,

We built in the Waterside estate that you are looking to purchase from and our experience in regards to land registration was that we put our deposit down in Jan 09 and we were told that our land should be registered by the beginning of March and it ended up being registered on 3/6 so a little later than what they said when we paid our deposit but not really enough to be overly concerned about.

They way I see it is if the block you are looking at is what you are after then the wait should not matter as it will just be all the more sweeter when you do move in!

If you have any more questions about the estate don't hesitate to ask...

We signed for our block in July 2008. The land was meant to title in Sept 2008. December 08 soon came, then Jan, Feb
and it wasnt until April 09 that we eventually owned the block to start building some 8 months later than expected.

My understanding back then of the Sunset Clause was that it the date came around then the developers had
the option to relist the land at a new market value of it didnt title beforehand. All we could have opted for was
deposit back or pay the new rate.

I think you will be okay in the end, but we know all about delays and the frustration it can cause.

Ozz

Ours was September, then October, then November, and it actually titled in December, with settlement occurring on 23rd December, the last working day of the year! The irritating thing is that when they finally got around to titling, they demanded that we pay up within 14 days or they wouldn't give us a $3000 early settlement discount, and this is after they had delayed for 3 months themselves. But there's nothing to do about it - we signed off on those conditions because it was the block we wanted.

Thanks Sanderling37, ozzroo, and btherl. Your replies ease my mind a lot.
Yeah, I've decided to go on with the block in waterside. I drove there again last weekend and fascinated again by its existing community and its surroundings. Sanderling37, we're gonna to be neighbors, see you around. And I'm looking at your blog now.

Hello all...
Your post have raised some interesting questions for my partner and I to raise with the sales rep from Stockland tomorrow. We are looking to go ahead with the purchase of a property (house and land package) in the Central Release section. Have any of you purchased in this section? The acoustic wall features in the paper work we have received and comments attached state that the dwelling cant be occupied until the acoustic wall is completed. Hmmmmmm?
The continually revised registration dates, and prolonged sunset dates seem to be an issue of concern that an enthusiastic first home 'purchaser' might have overlooked. We shall take a few grains of salt along to the appointment
Thanks for the heads up.
Any further advice would be greatly appreciated...