No to private inspection and no references

oznow · Nov 09, 2007 4:07 pm

Hi
Just talked to the builder, and plan to sign a contract.

However, the builder said no to my request for private building inspector arguing that it will delay the construction and the payment. The builder does not mind if the private inspection occur after the handover. Is the inspection after handover effective?

The builder also said that i dont need to be worried as the building invovled strict certification, and all building process will be according to the australian standard as mention in its building proposal which states:
-this proposal includes construction of the new home to the building code of australia and its relevant australian standards
-this proposal includes warranties as required by the ACT buuilding Act
-this proposal includess a maintenance period as set out in the HIA building agreement.

The builder also did not want to give out references and said that he will not want to "disturb" his previous customers, as he will not also disturb me in the future after finishing the house. He said that he has three display houses and that should be the prove of their workmanship.

The builder is a quite respected one. One of my neigbour has worked with them before and knew their quality workmanship. One homeone member (here) is also currently building with it, and so far is satisfied.

Any suggestions?
Ozn

mek · Nov 09, 2007 4:12 pm

I have a suggestion, Oz: don't build with them.

build.my.dream.home · Nov 09, 2007 4:17 pm

https://forum.homeone.com.au/viewtopic.php?t=3574

in cookie's reply about the contract, you are entile to use a inspector @ your cost if you want to...

+1 "dont build with them"

Michelle · Nov 09, 2007 4:31 pm

oznow

Hi
Just talked to the builder, and plan to sign a contract.

However, the builder said no to my request for private building inspector arguing that it will delay the construction and the payment. The builder does not mind if the private inspection occur after the handover. Is the inspection after handover effective?

The builder also said that i dont need to be worried as the building invovled strict certification, and all building process will be according to the australian standard as mention in its building proposal which states:
-this proposal includes construction of the new home to the building code of australia and its relevant australian standards
-this proposal includes warranties as required by the ACT buuilding Act
-this proposal includess a maintenance period as set out in the HIA building agreement.

The builder also did not want to give out references and said that he will not want to "disturb" his previous customers, as he will not also disturb me in the future after finishing the house. He said that he has three display houses and that should be the prove of their workmanship.

The builder is a quite respected one. One of my neigbour has worked with them before and knew their quality workmanship. One homeone member (here) is also currently building with it, and so far is satisfied.

Any suggestions?
Ozn

Anyone who doesn’t have ANYTHING to hide……will not worry about a private…whatever!!!!

I would be a little wary of these guys…they might do good work…..so what’s their problem?

An inspection doesn’t take THAT long to get done. My bet is the inspector can get it done faster than your builder can think about it.

Ask again….but this time TELL him.

oznow · Nov 09, 2007 4:40 pm

Thanks
The builder was in previous meeting okayed to my requests to have 3 inspections. but today he said no, apparently after discussing with his associate. He cited an example of the 2 month delays after an "out-of-date" inspector picked the a defect, which infact, not a defect (according to this builder). That inspector was apparently did not "keep up" with the building industry development.

I am still thinking... i have given this builder some document (not very important one) and still have not sign anything with them.

I knew that they are currently building couple of houses in my surrounding, and as i said before, quite a reputable one. but their refusals really have made me think twice now...

Michelle · Nov 09, 2007 4:47 pm

Oznow…..I don’t like to sound snotty here!

But reputable in some eyes don’t cut in other’s……

Do you know what I’m saying?

Cookiemonster · Nov 09, 2007 6:11 pm

And independant inspection is the only tool you have to ensure your house is being built correctly and to Australian standards.

Find another builder.

Yak_Chat · Nov 09, 2007 6:35 pm

I can see the builders point of view. We have projects where some contractors are not aware of the latest OH&S needs and they create us problems and delays.

So if you're really set on this builder - price, quality etc, how about you find the certifier you desire to use now, and have that person named in the contract so the builder knows who he will be dealing with - and he knows that they are reputable and up to date.

If he is still not happy - then I'd suggest you then really need to decide - would you be happy without a PI - or do you need to walk away.
Steve

rerob1 · Nov 09, 2007 8:22 pm

Hi Ozn, having read a few of your posts recently, I have noted that this builder you are keen on has constantly put forward a block on things and has made suggestions that seem less than standard....now - if you want to build with them, go ahead and sign, however, it is your RIGHT to have a private building inspection, it serves as an audit on the builders workmanship for your new home and therefore if you want to do this, it may save you thousands later on.....I would suggest telling the builder that you want to go ahead with them and that you are willing to wear any time delays that are caused by "out of date" issues created by the private inspections....then he really has nothing to lose if his work is really to BCA and relevant standards! However the builder should deal with any issues raised if they are relevant and as you are not an expert in building codes/standards you need someone independant to do this for you! Personally, I would tell the builder to "go jump!" if he didn't agree to that as there are plenty of builders out there that would agree to a private inspection!

commodorenut · Nov 09, 2007 9:01 pm

If he's blocking your requests now, what's going to happen during the building process if you spot something they have done wrong? Will the stop you from requesting it be corrected too?

I don't like the attitude he has shown you. Surely he could pass on a written request, from you, to his previous clients, so that he keeps their address private, and then leave it up to them if they feel they want to contact you.

Casa2 · Nov 09, 2007 9:19 pm

oznow,

The builder doesn't want you to have building inspectors independently check the work. The builder will not supply you any references. What's the attraction?

I'm sure if you tried (or spoke to some building inspectors) you could get the names and contact details of some previous customers. Talk to them and find out this builders reputation. Good references are critical before selecting a builder.

Cheers,
Casa

kasiakm · Nov 09, 2007 9:28 pm

oznow

Hi
Just talked to the builder, and plan to sign a contract.

However, the builder said no to my request for private building inspector arguing that it will delay the construction and the payment. The builder does not mind if the private inspection occur after the handover. Is the inspection after handover effective?

The builder also said that i dont need to be worried as the building invovled strict certification, and all building process will be according to the australian standard as mention in its building proposal which states:
-this proposal includes construction of the new home to the building code of australia and its relevant australian standards
-this proposal includes warranties as required by the ACT buuilding Act
-this proposal includess a maintenance period as set out in the HIA building agreement.

The builder also did not want to give out references and said that he will not want to "disturb" his previous customers, as he will not also disturb me in the future after finishing the house. He said that he has three display houses and that should be the prove of their workmanship.

The builder is a quite respected one. One of my neigbour has worked with them before and knew their quality workmanship. One homeone member (here) is also currently building with it, and so far is satisfied.

Any suggestions?
Ozn

Good builder doesn't mine the inspection at the handover.
cheers
kate

ahuang · Nov 12, 2007 10:01 am

What's the point of doing inspection "after" handover? At that stage you already paid all your money! If he doesn't allow any inspection during the process (which is a bit unusual!), unless he is willing to withhold at least 20% of the total amount until you done your own inspection after handover, don't build with this guy.

And the excuse of "Don't want to disturb his previous clients", I will read it as "don't want you to know how may disputes or court cases I was involved with all my previous unhappy clients...."

parker · Nov 12, 2007 10:30 am

get his license number and you can easily search his record online.

oznow · Nov 12, 2007 11:00 am

Thanks for all the replies.

I have not signed any contracts with this builder, although i have given them some document (such as approved building plan, which i always can get another copy). We had three to four times discussions, and I almost sign the contract. Two days ago i went again to TELL the builder that i want a private building inspection at least during the pre-handover ONLY. The builder still refused and was not happy, and replaid that the building has been CERTIFIED by several related parties, and i should have trust the builder. His question was WILL you inspect a NEW CAR when you decided to buy?

Okay, this is a very stupid question and i believe most of you will answer yes to it, but is it safe to cancel my plan to build with this builder at this late stage?

Thanks again everyone for your comments.
ozn

PS: From what i heard and read, I understand that this builder is a good builder. It also has several display houses. However, I CANNOT understand why he was reluctant to my requests.

PhoenixStar · Nov 12, 2007 11:07 am

Oznow, cancel it, this guy sounds like an arrogant so and so. Cancel it before you regret it. Make sure you do it in writing if need be so that he cannot comeback with anything and do your best to get back any deposits you have paid... (if you can't then run the other way anyway.)

If you are worried now, imagine when you build with them!!!!!!!!

ANY reputable builder will be more than happy to show off his work and have his customers provide their comments, good or bad about them.
Our builder did, and he was a small guy, only had 2 crews working for him.
For years we had peolpe knocking on our door and checking out our place. We sometimes even gave them a walk through.

Sorry, but alarm bells are ringing.

ahuang · Nov 12, 2007 11:09 am

oznow

Thanks for all the replies.

I have not signed any contracts with this builder, although i have given them some document (such as approved building plan, which i always can get another copy). We had three to four times discussions, and I almost sign the contract. Two days ago i went again to TELL the builder that i want a private building inspection at least during the pre-handover ONLY. The builder still refused and was not happy, and replaid that the building has been CERTIFIED by several related parties, and i should have trust the builder. His question was WILL you inspect a NEW CAR when you decided to buy?

Okay, this is a very stupid question and i believe most of you will answer yes to it, but is it safe to cancel my plan to build with this builder at this late stage?

Thanks again everyone for your comments.
ozn

What do you mean by "late stage"? As long as you haven't sign the contract, you can walk away. Don't feel sorry for that! If you feel sorry for this, you will be more sorry if things go wrong, the builder run away, you have a half completed house and the bank chasing you for money. You then have to pay to demolish it, start all over again, and don't forget you also need to pay extra rent $ as you need to live somewhere else!

How many builders have you approached so far? We spoke to at least 10, spent more than 3 months, before finalising 3 which we paid the initial $600 to each of them to start initial survey, then another few months before finalising to last one. It's a lot of money, so make sure you get lots of reference check, double check and triple check....

You don't inspect your new car becase it's a mass production process with lots of things fully automated. Building a house is totally different, as there so many trades person involved and it takes at least 6-10 months to finish.

louie · Nov 12, 2007 11:49 am

oznow

Thanks for all the replies.

I have not signed any contracts with this builder, although i have given them some document (such as approved building plan, which i always can get another copy). We had three to four times discussions, and I almost sign the contract. Two days ago i went again to TELL the builder that i want a private building inspection at least during the pre-handover ONLY. The builder still refused and was not happy, and replaid that the building has been CERTIFIED by several related parties, and i should have trust the builder. His question was WILL you inspect a NEW CAR when you decided to buy?

Okay, this is a very stupid question and i believe most of you will answer yes to it, but is it safe to cancel my plan to build with this builder at this late stage?

Thanks again everyone for your comments.
ozn

PS: From what i heard and read, I understand that this builder is a good builder. It also has several display houses. However, I CANNOT understand why he was reluctant to my requests.

He probably doesnt want to have a "boss" who he has to please. He may have had a bad experience with a previous private inspector who nit-picked him into a loss.

At any rate your local council are required by law to inspect the work and do so for free.

ahuang · Nov 12, 2007 12:01 pm

louie

At any rate your local council are required by law to inspect the work and do so for free.

Not really, if you go with project home builders, most of them hire their own inspector and by pass the council.

Cookiemonster · Nov 12, 2007 12:01 pm

louie

At any rate your local council are required by law to inspect the work and do so for free.

The local council inspects to ensure the house is built as per the council approved plans. They in no way check the quality of the structure or whether the building adheres to the Building Code of Australia.