Browse Forums Building A New House 1 May 22, 2010 8:28 pm I have read so many threads on site cost and its still a rather tricky subject. We paid $10311.00 to the builder as fixed site cost at the time of tender as the engineering reports were not available. The site was classified as P due to fill but we got what they call Type 1 modified slab or M class modified . If M class was already included as a part of the base price, I am asking the builder to refund some of the $10311 because theirs no way it going to cost and extra $10311 for a modified M. Here are some of the specifications if anyone can give me more info please Site classification -"P class site due to fill House size -29.47 Sq or 273.81 sqm Location -Sandarra Wall construction -Brick Veneer & tiled roof 2590 wall height Cut & fill -Cut & fill required to 200mm footing details -M class modified or type 1 modified Retaining wall -none Drainage requirements -Agri drain required along base of cut Special requirement -Termite barrier Reinforcement -Slab fabric Sl 82,Internal rib N12btm,External Rib 3L12,edge beams cost $10311 plus $2162 temp fencing ,crushed rock sediment control and council cost etc any comments ,I am trying to get my builder to refund something Re: P Class site and M class modified Slab -why $10311 2May 23, 2010 11:23 am andy I have read so many threads on site cost and its still a rather tricky subject. We paid $10311.00 to the builder as fixed site cost at the time of tender as the engineering reports were not available. The site was classified as P due to fill but we got what they call Type 1 modified slab or M class modified . If M class was already included as a part of the base price, I am asking the builder to refund some of the $10311 because theirs no way it going to cost and extra $10311 for a modified M. Here are some of the specifications if anyone can give me more info please Site classification -"P class site due to fill House size -29.47 Sq or 273.81 sqm Location -Sandarra Wall construction -Brick Veneer & tiled roof 2590 wall height Cut & fill -Cut & fill required to 200mm footing details -M class modified or type 1 modified Retaining wall -none Drainage requirements -Agri drain required along base of cut Special requirement -Termite barrier Reinforcement -Slab fabric Sl 82,Internal rib N12btm,External Rib 3L12,edge beams cost $10311 plus $2162 temp fencing ,crushed rock sediment control and council cost etc any comments ,I am trying to get my builder to refund something Hi class "P" stands for Problems site, this can include site with fill as yours is, tree roots, rock etc etc foundation requirements for sites with fill depending on how deep the fill is usually requires piers to go down to natural ground level over the entire house but depends on what type of slab they are doing. Do you know what type of slab? I would ask you builder for a copy of the slab design and ask them to point out the additional costs involved so that you can understand it. While $10,000 may seem alot the foundation is one of the most important parts of you home so its best to get it right. You cant cut corners here anyway due to council requirements and they have to sign off on the foundation anyway. Budde Design 3D Architecural Visualizations, Architectural Rendering, Artist Impressions, 2D & 3D floor plans http://www.buddedesign.com nathan@buddedesign.com Re: P Class site and M class modified Slab -why $10311 4May 23, 2010 8:04 pm "Fixed site costs" - do you mean that you and the builder agreed upon a price, regardless of future soil reports etc? If so, then you're taking a gamble and so are they, and its a calculated risk that you decide on at the time. You might come out way in front, or you might pay more than you need to, but the point is that you know what the site costs are going to be upfront and you can budget for that amount. There's always a winner and a loser in those situations, and nothing either can do about it. Re: P Class site and M class modified Slab -why $10311 5May 25, 2010 10:05 pm I gathered a few people around where I work who have built through project builders ,so to speak and they are beginning to see what a rip off ,builders charge on site cost. The bottom line is M class slab is included in the base price .Any upgrades to that will be as follows Instead of SL72 mesh they add SL82 cost $89 and $115 for the latter. N12 bars cost $13.64/mtr L12 bars $58.23 Concrete $150 cubic metre keep in mind the base price includes a M class slab ,so how much extra do you need .All the above prices are retail . Now how does that work out to $10,000 as a upgrade is my question. If your builder can you a break down on what it cost them ,good luck but most project buillders wont . Iam still trying . Re: P Class site and M class modified Slab -why $10311 6May 25, 2010 10:41 pm Hey andy, TBH i think your opening statement : Quote: We paid $10311.00 to the builder as fixed site cost at the time of tender as the engineering reports were not available. As well as kek's comments really are whats going to matter to you here, or more specifically your builder. Exactly what is written in your contract? As that is what it will come down to. Perhaps a call to consumer affairs vic - building section may give you a better idea of where you really stand. This link you might find some use. http://www.consumer.vic.gov.au/CA256EB5000644CE/page/Building+and+renovating-For+home+owners+and+buyers-<img+src%3d%2fCA256902000FE154%2fLookup%2fCAV_Images_misc%2f%24file%2fblank.gif+width%3d0+height%3d15+border%3d0>Foundations?OpenDocument&1=09-Building+and+renovating~&2=10-For+home+owners+and+buyers~&3=110-<img+src%3d%2fCA256902000FE154%2fLookup%2fCAV_Images_misc%2f%24file%2fblank.gif+width%3d0+height%3d15+border%3d0>Foundations~ Our Build - Places Fairhaven 23+ - https://forum.homeone.com.au/viewtopic.php?f=31&t=28045 Our Landscaping - Belial's Backyard - https://forum.homeone.com.au/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=45375 Re: P Class site and M class modified Slab -why $10311 7May 26, 2010 8:38 pm Thanks Belial Consumer affairs is the last think on my mind because I will be presenting the facts to the CEO of CH and pointing out how much a M class modified slab would have cost them. I will then ask him " what business ethics platform they operate from". Even though I signed a contract for fixed cost of $10300 and it only cost them $5000 max extra they should give me back something . A bit of arm twisting may work!! Re: P Class site and M class modified Slab -why $10311 8May 26, 2010 9:05 pm Good Luck Andy, I say it's worth a try. Site Start: 10th September, 2010 PCI : Friday 27th January, 2011. Handover: 3rd February, 2011 Build Thread: viewtopic.php?f=31&t=37677 Re: P Class site and M class modified Slab -why $10311 9May 30, 2010 9:41 pm The "at the time of tender as the engineering reports were not available" is a trick builders use. It is your right to have the engineers report at the same time as the contract signing.
It's a ploy by big builders to hide the true total cost to be more competitive. Ask anyone, Victoria as an example I have been told that you need nothing less than a H class. So why do they have a standard an M class? Also, you are contractually allowed a copy of any specifications and even the traddies invoice for the slab they pour if it was included under Provisional Sums. Re: P Class site and M class modified Slab -why $10311 10May 30, 2010 10:06 pm Andy, For your reference we also have a P class site due to the original old house demolished and our builder has advised a modified M slab is required. Block is flat and house is 29 squares. Our extra site cost was $3300 which I thought was reasonable. Hope this helps with your case. Magee Re: P Class site and M class modified Slab -why $10311 11May 31, 2010 8:10 pm Txs for your info I rang CAV today and they advised me that builders must have the "engineering specifications" and soil report prior to signing any contracts. This I didnt have and my next option is to submit a application through the CAV for them to take up with the builder. I still havent received a response from the builder to my email I posted on friday the 28th. Re: P Class site and M class modified Slab -why $10311 13Jun 01, 2010 10:33 am Another tip for emailing builders.. add "Please confirm that you have received this email" to every single email. If they don't confirm by the next day, call them and ask if they've received it. If the builder knew what the site costs would be when you signed, or they should have, then I think you've got a good case. Our site survey was included with the contract documents when we signed. Metricon Riva 33 - http://herlihy-riva.blogspot.com Site start 15/03/2010 - Handover 23/12/2010 9 months and 8 days (284 calendar days) from site start to handover Re: P Class site and M class modified Slab -why $10311 14Jun 02, 2010 10:00 pm kek "Fixed site costs" - do you mean that you and the builder agreed upon a price, regardless of future soil reports etc? If so, then you're taking a gamble and so are they, and its a calculated risk that you decide on at the time. You might come out way in front, or you might pay more than you need to, but the point is that you know what the site costs are going to be upfront and you can budget for that amount. There's always a winner and a loser in those situations, and nothing either can do about it. Agree 100%. If you signed the building contract for "fixed price" site costs and understood what the implications were at the time (ie. I wont pay any more if the site is really bad, but I also wont pay less if its not) I dont see where the issue is or what recourse you have to try to claim a discount? I cant see how they have been unethical unless they knew that site costs were going to be less than the agreed $$ figure at contract signing?? Adam.M Ask anyone, Victoria as an example I have been told that you need nothing less than a H class. So why do they have a standard an M class? We are in Melb. and had M. Re: P Class site and M class modified Slab -why $10311 15Jun 02, 2010 11:14 pm Hypothetically speaking, what if they did know that site costs were going to be less than the agreed $$ figure at contract signing? Eg. they already had detailed foundation plans with exact piering plans, as well as the soil report ... but they never gave them to Andy ... so Andy got locked into a fixed cost based on his inexperience and having no knowledge at that time about these things ... My signature is distracting people from my wise posts ... Re: P Class site and M class modified Slab -why $10311 16Jun 03, 2010 12:06 pm I have tossed around all the arguements from the builders point of view and everyone elses and yes ! I signed a contract for fixed site cost for "better or for worse" as a matter of speaking(no arguements their). In OCT09 their were no engineering or compaction reports available(for our block) when we signed the contract, They were only available in DEC09. 1.stage 1& 2 were released by then (we were in stage 3) which was OCT09,they knew what what to expect in that estate going by stage 1&2. 2. like i said to the builder a worse case scenario for you would have been H class slab ,which by the way would have cost them $8000.00 approx . 3. CAV said we might have case here because when it comes to fixed site cost in contracts ,they must have the compaction and engineering available ,so the owner can do a proper analysis. It comes down to business ethics(if their is any left these days),Procon verbally informed me that slab(M modified) would not have cost any (M is included in base price)more than $5000.00 nice mark up isnt it? How many of you have signed fixed site cost on a estate(not established area) and found site cost to be more ? not many I suppose. Re: P Class site and M class modified Slab -why $10311 18Jun 03, 2010 4:04 pm Hi Andy, as you know I am in Stage 5 at Sandarra building the same house as you actually, and my site costs weren't that high. Ended up being quoted a H class slab for about $6k. On another question all together, when you settled your land did you have to pay land tax at Sandarra, and if you did, do you remember how much it was roughly? Site Start - 20th July 2010 Slab Pour - 30th July 2010 Frame Start - 6th August 2010 Roof Tiles - 18th August 2010 Plaster Completed - 6th September 2010 Bricks - 3rd - 20th September 2010 Painting - 4th October 2010 Fitoff Begins - 21st October 2010 Re: P Class site and M class modified Slab -why $10311 19Feb 06, 2012 2:12 pm Hi All, I build with m3tr1c0n, there is 2 options, - Fixed site cost - $13000, including any rocks removal - Not fixed - $9500 based on Geosite program. after that I told them to use Not Fixed as my land in williams landing potentially flat. but a bit risk though Suddenly m3tr1c0n said to me that I can get rebate if the site cost is lesser. Should I believe them and choose fixed site cost? Here is what he said... " now we can offer fixed site costs, if the actual costs come lower, m3tr1c0n will refund you the balance, if higher, we will pay it, not you. So you get total peace of mind " Any experience ? Thanks I am not sure whether Perth has its own way of doing things in regards to this. Most of Perth has class A (sandy soil), except for some areas near rivers or hills. 2 13053 The Soil classification has little to do with piers. The purpose of the classing of the soil is to identify the clay content and the "average expected range of movement… 2 9841 That sucks! Hope it all works out. Good to move away from steel anyway for all your reasons, but it's also thermally poor. 16 17774 |