Browse Forums Building A New House Re: Dealing with council fee 2Jun 25, 2007 9:56 pm Hi devank,
I got that last year as well when we went through the presentation process with Clarendon. They called it "council liason fee" or something, for Parramatta council it's $2400. Looks like your council is a tough one... When we spoke with Eden Brae last year, they charge something similar as well. So far, I haven't seen/heard any other builder doing this other than these 2 companies. But that was last year... Their excuse was, they hired an external consultant company to handle/polish the application, to make it easier to suit each council's special requirement. If the builder has experience with the council's requirements, they would have knowledge to adjust the design accordingly. If the council is going to reject your application, there must be a reason and in writing. Personally I think it's ridiculous and don't think the extra $ will make any difference. Cheers Allan http://building-our-first-house.blogspot.com/ Re: Dealing with council fee 3Jun 26, 2007 7:17 am It sounds like a rort to me. Clarendon build 1500 homes per year, so the salesman told me. Surely they would have experience complying to most councils by now. Re: Dealing with council fee 4Jun 26, 2007 7:33 am Devank can you supply a few more details on what the actual fee was for.
I can't see any reason why a building co. would be justified in charging a fee for lodging a building application - above a normal application cost which would max out at around $1500. Applications for unit developments & the like requiring a planning application which would include the need to address 'neighbourhood character' 'landscape design' 'carparking' etc would cost more but still not near $10,000. Peter Clarkson - AusDesign Australia www.ausdesign.com.au This information is intended to provide general information only. It does not purport to be a comprehensive advice. Re: Dealing with council fee 6Jun 26, 2007 11:01 am Could Strathfield be out of Clarendon's regular area? From memory - they have a pretty bad track record with DA approval times and a lot of specialist requirements because of all the heritage homes in the area. Re: Dealing with council fee 7Jun 27, 2007 2:10 pm Cl@rendon said that the 10K covers
1. Council Liaison Fee 2. Cost for the trades people to go to Strathfield 3. Delivery charges They also said that other builders may include this into their building cost but Cl@rendon charges depending on the area. hmmm... still thinking... Re: Dealing with council fee 8Jun 27, 2007 3:06 pm ![]() Cl@rendon said that the 10K covers 1. Council Liaison Fee 2. Cost for the trades people to go to Strathfield 3. Delivery charges They also said that other builders may include this into their building cost but Cl@rendon charges depending on the area. hmmm... still thinking... One day builders will charge $1 to build you a house, but have everything not included and say "other builders may include this into their building cost but …". It's ridiculous. Builders offer you a good price and then add everything else. That's why it’s important to ask how much is this house on my block - locked in - before paying any more than the $600 survey and soil test fee. And the survey and soil tests are yours to use elsewhere since you payed for them. Yes, I'm a bit upset about the ludicrous way builders quote prices. Re: Dealing with council fee 9Jun 27, 2007 3:27 pm How about a rebate on dealing with builders incompetence, chasing them to return phone calls and trips to their head office to sort things out??
Oh, did say that out loud........ ![]() Adrian B Re: Dealing with council fee 10Jun 27, 2007 7:25 pm Adrian !!!! ![]() Better use the big whackin' stick on yourself! Re: Dealing with council fee 11Jul 02, 2007 10:02 am oh well.... we decided to pay the fee and agreed to go head with the initial survey.
They (Cl@rendon) are the only reputable building company who are willing to make changes the way we want. The sales person has spent almost 10 hrs with us so far. Base price was 188K. We estimated the total cost to be 380K now! hmmm... now... anyone got a 2nd job for me? ![]() - devank Re: Dealing with council fee 12Jul 02, 2007 10:07 am Did you find out exactly what that 10K gets you?
Thats a lot of money just to get tradesmen to Strathfield. Was this cost included in the initial tender price? Re: Dealing with council fee 13Jul 02, 2007 10:23 am I'd chage a lot more than that to deal with council.
3xb ![]() ![]() ![]() Re: Dealing with council fee 14Jul 02, 2007 10:50 am ![]() oh well.... we decided to pay the fee and agreed to go head with the initial survey. It's ok to go ahead with the initial survey as it will only cost you around $600 and you will learn a lot through the process. Just be more careful before you sign any contract. ![]() They (Cl@rendon) are the only reputable building company who are willing to make changes the way we want. Don't quite agree with that! I agree that they are one of the largest, but don't think it's the only one willing to make changes. Suggest to give other builders a try. In the end you will find that for the same amount of money you spent, you get a much bigger house and much better interior than Clarendon. ![]() The sales person has spent almost 10 hrs with us so far. We visited Clarendon's display house at least 5 times, did a lot of research on the internet, and also spend a lots of hours with the sales before we spend $600 for initial survey. But we still dump them in the end due to their bad internal process. Read my story here: http://building-our-first-house.blogspot.com/2007/05/once-upon-time.html. I am not saying they are all that bad, hopefully just that we are unlucky. But if you start feeling sorry for the 10 hours that sales person spent with you, and start let that guilty feeling drive your decision, you could be making bad judgements. Personally I think you should calm down a bit and base your decision on facts, not feelings. ![]() Base price was 188K. We estimated the total cost to be 380K now! hmmm... now... anyone got a 2nd job for me? ![]() - devank $380K is a very high figure. You could have built 2 single storey houses with some builders! If you don't mind, can you please provide a little more details about what you are getting for that? e.g.: 1. size of buiding areas 2. number of rooms 3. material for kitchen, bathroom (e.g. size of cooktop, rangehood, tiling to ceiling, spa bath, granite or ceasorstone, ...etc) 4. which model you chose. 5. how much $ per sqrm they charge (e.g. for extension to rooms size) 6. What's included (e.g. alarm. air conditioning, TV points, size of water tank above and is it ground or underground, ...etc) 7. Any special feature such as bay window, internal balcony, ...etc 8. Ceiling height, is it 2.4M or 2.7M 9. How much of the 380K are for site cost? When we were with Clarendon, we compared their tender with others and found that they charge a lot more than others on some items. Don't get carried away by the name. Specially those who did a lot of advertisement on the TV. It's your money that's paying for those ads! One of our unlucky neighbours paid extra $ for the Clarendon name, but in the end, they get the same contractors who built another Domaine house a few houses down the same street. There are lots of friends here with lots of experiences and you will definitely get more unbiased opinions here than from the sales person! Hope this helps! Cheers Allan http://building-our-first-house.blogspot.com/ Re: Dealing with council fee 15Jul 02, 2007 11:16 am ![]() One of our unlucky neighbours paid extra $ for the Clarendon name, but in the end, they get the same contractors who built another Domaine house a few houses down the same street. Just for your info, Clarendon and Domaine are both owned by the Investa group. In fact all the Domaine home designs and the Domaine display centre at Glenwood are now branded as Clarendon. http://www.investa.com.au/Residential/ Re: Dealing with council fee 16Jul 02, 2007 1:45 pm www.Domaine.com.au takes you to the Clarendon page!
Yes ahuang. I have been reading you blog. It's really helpful for clueless people like me! ![]() Re: Dealing with council fee 17Jul 02, 2007 8:57 pm Here are the answers for your question Allan. This is a big house. We are trying to build a house for ourselves (upstairs), for parents (downstairs) and a dance studio.
1. size of buiding areas 42 squares 2. number of rooms 2 Master bed rooms with ensuites & built-ins, 4 other rooms 3. material for kitchen, bathroom (e.g. size of cooktop, rangehood, tiling to ceiling, spa bath, granite or ceasorstone, ...etc) Don’t know this info now. 4. which model you chose. http://www.clarendonhomes.com.au/html3/ ... /faca.html 5. how much $ per sqrm they charge (e.g. for extension to rooms size) $650 x 35 sq m = $23K 6. What's included (e.g. alarm. air conditioning, TV points, size of water tank above and is it ground or underground, ...etc) Only the following: Basix Certificate 3 year warranty on nominated appliances Water authority fee Soil test Development application & construction certificate White ant control system Caesarstone Kitchen benchtop Roof insulation Wall insulation Natural Gas package 3A water saving shower roses Water saving flickmixer kitchen tap Energy saving light globes in wet areas, kitchen, laundry & Garage Window Locks Deadlocks to all external hinged doors 7. Any special feature such as bay window, internal balcony, ...etc Added Ensuite & builtins behind the games room (new master bed room) Added a Ensuite behind the dance studio Added a room behind the grage (5x3) Added Alfresco (4.2x3.7) Added an external door Added an internal door Added 3 more windows Converted standard common bathroom to 3-way bathroom 8. Ceiling height, is it 2.4M or 2.7M Never thought of it & I don't know now. 9. How much of the 380K are for site cost? When we were with Clarendon, we compared their tender with others and found that they charge a lot more than others on some items. Council liaison fee: 10K (for sure) Drainage, Stormwater: 40K (a guess from the sales only) - devank ps: sorry it was a long message! Re: Dealing with council fee 18Jul 03, 2007 12:19 pm ![]() Here are the answers for your question Allan. This is a big house. We are trying to build a house for ourselves (upstairs), for parents (downstairs) and a dance studio. 1. size of buiding areas 42 squares Correct me if I am wrong, I heard that 1 squares roughly equals to 9.1 m2 42 * 9.1 = 382.2 m2 Wow, this is indeed huge. I thought mine on 352 m2 is quite big... ![]() 2. number of rooms 2 Master bed rooms with ensuites & built-ins, 4 other rooms The ensuite will be the most expensive one as it's wet area... ![]() 3. material for kitchen, bathroom (e.g. size of cooktop, rangehood, tiling to ceiling, spa bath, granite or ceasorstone, ...etc) Don’t know this info now. Suggest to have a chat with the sales or look into the fine print of their brochures for the details. As these wet area items are quite expensive. E.g. tiling to ceiling for 3 bathrooms cost us $6000. You mentioned "Caesarstone Kitchen benchtop" below. You also need to find out whether it's 40mm or 20mm thick. FYI, my neighbour who also built with Clarendon decided to use the basic benchtop because builder charge too much for Caesarstone benchtop. They did some calculation and found that it's actually cheaper to accept the default, then remove it and put in caesarstone benchtop by different vendor after hand over. If you want, I can PM you his address. They are very nice people, just knock on the door and they will have lots of information to share with you. That's what we did as well. Find at least 5 customers currently/already built with your builder and visit them, ask for help/information. You will be surprised that lots of people are willing to share/help. One of our builder's client even went through our tender line by line with us and picked up a few issues. ![]() Love the stairs, really nice. Allworth has a similar design called "Torquay" and it has an internal balcony, suggest to have a look. The link is here: http://www.allworthhomes.com.au/2storey/torquay.htm ![]() 5. how much $ per sqrm they charge (e.g. for extension to rooms size) $650 x 35 sq m = $23K That's roughly the same my builder charge for non-wet areas. ![]() 6. What's included (e.g. alarm. air conditioning, TV points, size of water tank above and is it ground or underground, ...etc) Only the following: Basix Certificate 3 year warranty on nominated appliances Water authority fee Soil test Development application & construction certificate White ant control system Caesarstone Kitchen benchtop Roof insulation Wall insulation Ask for the rating of roof/wall insulation. Is it R3.5 or R2? The higher the better. Normally it's R1.5 for wall, R2.5/3 for roof. We upgraded ours to R3.5 for roof and it cost us $1850. ![]() Natural Gas package 3A water saving shower roses Water saving flickmixer kitchen tap Energy saving light globes in wet areas, kitchen, laundry & Garage Window Locks A minor one, make sure all windows are key-alike. So you can lock/unlock all of them with same key. ![]() Deadlocks to all external hinged doors Also ask for key-alike. This is good, our builder only provides deadlock to front door, cost our $160 to add extra deadlock to laundry external door. ![]() 7. Any special feature such as bay window, internal balcony, ...etc Added Ensuite & builtins behind the games room (new master bed room) Added a Ensuite behind the dance studio Added a room behind the grage (5x3) Added Alfresco (4.2x3.7) We got an alfresco as well. Like to know how much they charge you for this. Ours is 7450mm x 4420mm, roughly double size of yours. Our builder charged us about $5000 for the alfresco. But we didn't ask for same thick concrete slab as the house to save some $. We will simply get our Landscaper to put normal concrete slab for gardening path and then tile it. ![]() Added an external door Added an internal door Added 3 more windows Converted standard common bathroom to 3-way bathroom 8. Ceiling height, is it 2.4M or 2.7M Never thought of it & I don't know now. Might want to check the brochure or speak with the sales about this. Standard is 2.4M, higher ceiling is better, it also makes your house looks more attractive. We spent $5950 to raise ground floor ceiling to 2.7m (council requirement). And extra $4950 to raise upper level to 2.7m ![]() 9. How much of the 380K are for site cost? When we were with Clarendon, we compared their tender with others and found that they charge a lot more than others on some items. Council liaison fee: 10K (for sure) Drainage, Stormwater: 40K (a guess from the sales only) After you done your presentation, check for "provisional site cost" in the tender. ![]() - devank ps: sorry it was a long message! No problem, mine is even longer!! A few other things: 1) I don't see anything mentioned about water tank, isn't that standard requirement from all Sydney council? Ours 3150 litre cost $7950, thanks to friends from this forum, we were told that's quite high. Discussed with family, we decided to leave it as it is to avoid the hassel to arranging our own electrician + plumber after hand over. Asked around and found that that's the normal price charged by project home builder for that size of tanks. If you don't mind the hassel, you can save a few thousands from the water tank system. With water tank, make sure you pick the slim one, not the round one. The round one is too big and can only be put in the backyard. We chose the slim one and hide it behind the garage, not visible from backyard or from the front. Our neighbour's big round water tank (by Clarendon) in the back yard looks like a chemical factory. It visible from the kitchen/family room and doesn't look that nice... If you have enough budget, pay extra $5000 or so and replace it with underground one. 2) what about air conditioning and alarm? With such a high price, you should have both included as well. 3) Is the tile concrete or terracotta? 4) Is fly screen/door included? 5) Make sure the windows for bathroom have obscure glazing or other treatments, so that you can't see through from outside. Some builders charge extra for that. 6) Check if automatic garage door opener is included, and you should have at least 2 remote handset. When you received your tender, make sure they break down the cost for all the individual items. Clarendon is a good company, if you already have in mind what you want, shop around and you might get a better bargain from other builders. Hope this helps! Cheers Allan http://building-our-first-house.blogspot.com/ Current stage: old house demolished, contract signed, waiting for excavation to start... Re: Dealing with council fee 19Jul 03, 2007 12:47 pm Just went through my tender and found a few more:
1) Check the included toilet, is it in full ceramic or comes with plastic water tank? 2) What type of cornice is included? (the decorative board above all walls, covering the connecting part to ceiling) 3) What type of skirting board/arches/door frames you are getting? Normal ones are quite low and in joined pine and painted. We asked for stained maple timber and it cost us $4350. 4) What's the benchtop in bathroom? Are they also in ceasorstone? 5) The shower screen for all shower area, are they frameless? Our builder charge $1000 to upgrade to frameless for each shower, we have 3 showers and it's quite expensive. We decided to remove all shower screens, and install by another supplier after handover, saved about 30%. 6) Check your sewer diagram and work out how far is it from the house. Ours is on the road and cost us $9000 to dig through the road, connect it back to our house. Before we choose our builder, we paid $600 to Clarendon, another $600 to Domaine, dumped Eden Brae because they interpreted the council rules wrongly and only willing to build a much smaller house, dumped Bellmarch because the sales asked for $1000 for initial soil test plus other reason, ...etc. Have you visited the home world in Kellyville yet? Definitely shop around, you will learn a lot. Before you sign the contract, the sales will give you discounts here and there just to get your business. Use the figures from one company to get bargins from another. Don't forget that their margins are at least 25% for basic items (stated in the contract), for any variations you request, their margin can be some times higher than 40%. Cheers Allan http://building-our-first-house.blogspot.com/ Current stage: old house demolished, contract signed, waiting for excavation to start... Re: Dealing with council fee 20Jul 03, 2007 12:48 pm ![]() www.Domaine.com.au takes you to the Clarendon page! As pointed out by Mark/cookiemonster, they have merged into one company. Cheers Allan http://building-our-first-house.blogspot.com/ Current stage: old house demolished, contract signed, waiting for excavation to start... Hi Minho I have heaps of experience in Ku-ring-gai with both DAs and CDC ( this is the main area we build in). DA's are taking 12-18months and CDC's we have been doing… 1 16682 ![]() Just for reference, it took almost 7 weeks to complete after numerous phone calls , brisbane city council approval took 4 weeks , however gas company rescheduled the jobs… 4 13610 We had a DA approved last year and here is the condition that was imposed by Northern Beaches council: 1 7845 ![]() |