Browse Forums Building A New House 1 Nov 06, 2008 6:39 am My $0.02
- Get EVERYTHING in writing. - Make sure the plans are correct, and all specification/extras/fittings are included BEFORE signing the contract. - Get a solicitor/conveyancer to go through your contract before signing - Try and make any and all payments subject to an inspection by an inspector of your choice. Paul After 2 false starts, a year living overseas, two more world trips and 3 years of uncertainty we are now starting the build process again - hopefully for real this time! Re: Any tips for a easy building process. 2Nov 06, 2008 7:33 am muzzman My $0.02 - Get EVERYTHING in writing and photograph everything. - Make sure the plans are correct, and all specification/extras/fittings are included BEFORE signing the contract. - Get EVERYTHING in writing and photograph everything. - Get a solicitor/conveyancer to go through your contract before signing - Get EVERYTHING in writing and photograph everything. - Try and make any and all payments subject to an inspection by an inspector of your choice. - Get EVERYTHING in writing and photograph everything. Paul and to add from a previous post to_do_list The fine print…. Between smeagol, and myself and other members I think we've nailed the things to keep in mind with contracts….remember contracts are not papal decrees, handed down by Moses, or dug up on some thousand year old scroll....they are negotiable, they are flexible.....most importantly though pick your battles with your builder. to_do_list smeagol Think about the following objectives..... Completeness, Accuracy, Validity, Timeliness Beautifully and succinctly stated.....Smeags Couple of simple rules in writing contracts: - if it's said once it doesn't need to be said again, avoids ambiguity and "double-dipping" on prices - determine the order of precedence of documents if there is an a discrepancy between the contract, inclusions list, drawings, etc what will take precedence - if it doesn't need to be in, delete it, don't fall for the old "that's a standard clause but we never invoke it" - if it needs to be in put it in, don't fall for the "yeah, nah, we do that anyway" - check your drawings, then recheck, then check again, oh and check your drawings, match elevations with plans, with electrical, with plumbing, with site layout - "standard" building contracts can be changed by mutual agreement, they are not carved in stone, written in holy script, or blessed by the pope, never to be amended - the MBAV and HIA are "industry groups" they are looking after the best interests of the people that pay their subscriptions, therefore the contracts are biased towards builders and not owners, remember that when you read any clause - make sure the contractor "shall" do something, most requirement specifications (i.e. contracts in the real world) use the word "shall" to denote a requirement, MBAV and HIA contracts occasionally use the contractor "will" and "may" contractually these terms reduce the strength of the requirement - don't go for wishy washy statements for instance Duminda picked up on the following Duminda Ours is an MBAV contract, and it says that builder shall do 'everything possible' to start within 14 days of receiving the last approval required (usually the building permit) ... but there's no penalty if they don't start within that period, and the owner is still bound by the contract. - with regards to inclusions there will be a clause stating that they can change say a stove, HWS, etc for another make sure you add "to the same performance specification and with the written consent of the owner" The builder will think you are a picky b*stard but I got use to it....! There is all sorts of cr*p that builders appear to get away with which they would be sent straight to arbitration or to the courts if they tried on in the "real" construction industry. Hope this helps in some small way. In case you wondering about the 'tude I'm going through a contract disagreement at work with a contractor but we're covered because of these simple points. And once you start in earnest document everything As my grandfather the judge said, one line of writing is worth more than 100 pages of talky talky.... ....although he did say it in Hungarian! oh and Get EVERYTHING in writing and photograph mmm....donuts Homer Simpson 1956- Links: Site Costs Ready Reckoner | H1 Addiction Medical Advice | Château TDL: The Backyard Re: Any tips for a easy building process. 3Nov 06, 2008 7:42 am TDL,
Great informaiton, but what does "and photograph everything" mean? Are you sayign photograph things to go into the cotnract or photograph the building process? Cheers, Casa Demolition August 2009, Construction Started September 2009, Completed December 2010 Re: Any tips for a easy building process. 4Nov 06, 2008 7:49 am We NOW realise that everything we discussed with our Building Consultant, really stood for nothing. Our excitement over building our house and her agreeing with everything simply made us lose our rational thinking.
In hindsight we should have got EVERYTHING in writing. When we were ready to sign contract, things changed and it was merely our word against hers. Good Luck Re: Any tips for a easy building process. 5Nov 06, 2008 7:51 am My 2c... a bit of paraphrasing from something I've posted previously.
Everything the others have already said is spot on.... I know I'm repeating some of it, but some things you cannot say too many times. 1. Do not proceed with staff you don't feel comfortable with. Inconvenience yourself if you have to so you work with an SC etc that you're comfortable with. The quality of your relationships with staff can and will impact on your enjoyment of the process. 2. Be realistic. There will be mistakes. 3. When there are mistakes? Pick your battles. Don't get upset about mistakes that don't matter, just get them fixed. By the same token, rationally stand your ground on the big ones. 4. While being prepared to stand your ground, also be prepared to forgive mistakes, most can be fixed. Hanging on to issues and anger will not benefit anyone. Move on from one issue to the next as they are resolved. 5. Know your paperwork inside out. Be so familiar with your plans that you can see when something isn't correct. 6. Know your rights inside out. 7. Document everything. 8. Treat people with respect. Treat the staff well and in a way you would like to be treated. Screaming and having tanties for no reason is not in your best interests. Jo I leave you to fend for yourself, figure things out yourself. Terrence Malick Re: Any tips for a easy building process. 6Nov 06, 2008 7:55 am joles My 2c... a bit of paraphrasing from something I've posted previously. Everything the others have already said is spot on.... I know I'm repeating some of it, but some things you cannot say too many times. 1. Do not proceed with staff you don't feel comfortable with. Inconvenience yourself if you have to so you work with an SC etc that you're comfortable with. The quality of your relationships with staff can and will impact on your enjoyment of the process. 2. Be realistic. There will be mistakes. 3. When there are mistakes? Pick your battles. Don't get upset about mistakes that don't matter, just get them fixed. By the same token, rationally stand your ground on the big ones. 4. While being prepared to stand your ground, also be prepared to forgive mistakes, most can be fixed. Hanging on to issues and anger will not benefit anyone. Move on from one issue to the next as they are resolved. 5. Know your paperwork inside out. Be so familiar with your plans that you can see when something isn't correct. 6. Know your rights inside out. 7. Document everything. 8. Treat people with respect. Treat the staff well and in a way you would like to be treated. Screaming and having tanties for no reason is not in your best interests. Jo Excellent post joles spot on. Re: Any tips for a easy building process. 7Nov 06, 2008 8:07 am Casa2 TDL, Great informaiton, but what does "and photograph everything" mean? Are you sayign photograph things to go into the cotnract or photograph the building process? Cheers, Casa Photograph the building process...not only is it useful for documenting faults and later reference when doing post build work...but a date stamped photo of the house is an excellent way of proving to "head office" that there stage payment is incorrect. Also photograph your tile and carpet selections so there's no arguments on selections...again another argument I won with the builder with one photo. Besides we all know what a bunch of sticky beaks we have here on H1. mmm....donuts Homer Simpson 1956- Links: Site Costs Ready Reckoner | H1 Addiction Medical Advice | Château TDL: The Backyard Re: Any tips for a easy building process. 8Nov 06, 2008 8:32 am joles My 2c... a bit of paraphrasing from something I've posted previously. Everything the others have already said is spot on.... I know I'm repeating some of it, but some things you cannot say too many times. 1. Do not proceed with staff you don't feel comfortable with. Inconvenience yourself if you have to so you work with an SC etc that you're comfortable with. The quality of your relationships with staff can and will impact on your enjoyment of the process. 2. Be realistic. There will be mistakes. 3. When there are mistakes? Pick your battles. Don't get upset about mistakes that don't matter, just get them fixed. By the same token, rationally stand your ground on the big ones. 4. While being prepared to stand your ground, also be prepared to forgive mistakes, most can be fixed. Hanging on to issues and anger will not benefit anyone. Move on from one issue to the next as they are resolved. 5. Know your paperwork inside out. Be so familiar with your plans that you can see when something isn't correct. 6. Know your rights inside out. 7. Document everything. 8. Treat people with respect. Treat the staff well and in a way you would like to be treated. Screaming and having tanties for no reason is not in your best interests. Jo Good post! Point 8, i would add, dont call them over every little thing, every day of every minute! One call with several questions is fine, but several calls on one day is bound to annoy them, you'll end up becoming more a problem and they may react with just any answer to 'shut' you up rather then the proper one Sure its been said, DO YOUR HOMEWORK! starting from the banking progress right up to building, know what your rights are and know what you are getting into so you don't get sucked in getting things you really don't need by someone told you that you MUST have it! the internet (and this site especially) very handy tools, use them Plus knowing the progress yourself you'll find you won't need to speak to our CSO or SS as much cause you'll know the answer, takes out that frustration of not knowing what is happening and them not being so helpful, dont get me wrong, still a frustrating process, knowing how it works for yourself l found made it a little less painful Re: Any tips for a easy building process. 9Nov 06, 2008 8:45 am I like to keep all their emails and reply everything in emails as well. Our CSO requested a few times to talk to her on the phone but I have refused on the bases that I am 'working' So she has to send everything in writing.
We recently had an issue with our builder and thank goodness we took PHOTOS!!!! We were able to send photos and details to our PCA (whom we never meet or correspond to) and had the matter sorted out without leaving my desk!! And remember, builders and tradies are human as well. We all make mistakes, some more than others but the main thing is how they fix it. As joles said, pick your battle. Re: Any tips for a easy building process. 10Nov 06, 2008 11:36 am Ask for clarification even to the point of being pedantic. It is better to be annoying then to be annoyed because you didn't understand what they meant. Fi has moved in!! Re: Any tips for a easy building process. 11Nov 11, 2008 1:02 pm Thanks to all.
A few points stand out to me from your kind replies: Get it in writting Be comfortable with the sales person Im currently buying the block to build with a volume builder. Ive had a deposit down for 7 months. A price freeze for 3 months. I had difficulty getting the block of my choice. The 3 month price freeze expired, I was told by sale person dont worry I can back date it for you just get the land and we can submit it for a quote. By the way the price went up $9,000. I was concerned as to paying the 9k more. So I said put in in writting. A week latter I get a letter " can garentee the price as cost of building is going up" so much for the nice sales guy. Recently a 5k more price rise, I rang him and expressed my concerns. Same story we just need to get the paper work in and you should be right. I said put it in writting. A week latter I get an email not hard copy and nort signed my him. Saying the company will back date it for 3 months. I did not beleive it so I rang manager of company, I expressed my concerns in a nice way. I asked him will he back date it for 3 months. He said no we dont do that. So I then told he about the email. He said its not correct. He surgested I re deposit my holding fee to avoid the next price rise I said OK. A few day latter I get a call from the sales person, not happy with me at all. I said I wanted to re freeze the price to avoid the next price rise. He not happy and same old **** we hold the price for 3 months and spoke to me in a rude manner. What do I do? "Get it in writting" we what more can I do????? I get it and the its still BS. I want to build and give my 220,000 to a person I trust and who I think will help me, and not just think of the commishion. Can I change sales person, with in the company? Even the addmin staff said most of the staff are hopeless. The company is cheap & I like a design, now what. I want to buy the land with confidence that I will build this houseat that price If not I want buy the land. Any surgestions for me. Pick your battle. If I change sales person the next one will be the same or worse. Should I just work with this guy and bite my toung. What if the quote comes back at the new price not the old & im told well we cant back date it????? Thanks to all for your help. KW........ “It's just as unpleasant to get more than you bargain for as to get less” George Bernard Shaw. Re: Any tips for a easy building process. 12Nov 11, 2008 1:32 pm At the end of the day all sales consultants have the same drive, their pay check, but there are ones who know have to give good customer service as well! to me that is how you chose your battle, why deal with a sale guys ie- help his pay check, if he isnt helping you! clearly he has one thing and one thing only on his mind HIMSELF! Remember without you he doesnt get that pay check so you hold the power just much
l would perhaps see if you can speak to another sales person, do you have that option to go with the house u want and sit down with another sale consultant? As for the backdating and locking in the price (dont quote me) i think the things that can go up regardless of putting money down is structure changes, that can go up in the market, they need to cover cost, things like the set house price i thought was locked in with a deposit. Thats how it was for us, we lock the price of the house and the little extras we got, but the structure changes went up by the time we went to contract, not by much but! l would still insist on speaking to someone who KNOWS what is correct and what isnt then get it in writing, seems your getting a lot of different opinions from different ppl!! Thank you so much. This has been very helpful. We definitely wish to settle and get these people out of our life. They are trying to charge us interest on late… 7 14282 DIY, Home Maintenance & Repair I mean, I install them/sell them for a living so I haven't done DIY, unless you count the first one I installed lol. (electrician by trade). Usually a 6-8 hour job for… 3 41555 I apologise for any confusion, but your understanding is correct. We approached our situation differently based on advice from… 11 53226 |