Building a flame zone house in West Pymble on a steep site

Ashington Homes · Oct 24, 2023 12:44 pm

Joolsie

Long time lurker here; I just wanted to check in and say thanks so much for posting all this detail.
The costings especially are really informative in these times of run-away prices.
Please keep up it up!

Hi Joolsie

Thank you so much for your comments and awesome to see you stop lurking

I am trying to be as honest, open and informative as possible without being too boring.

The goal is to take people through every step of building a home, including the good, the bad and the ugly, and hopefully we all learn something along the way.

Seriously, if you have any questions, no matter how silly they may seem, feel free to ask. Nothing is off limits and no one will judge!

Also, as with my duplex build. If anyone wants to drop by and see how a house is built, I will always make time for you. Just give me a shout.

Have a great afternoon

Simeon

Ashington Homes · Oct 24, 2023 4:51 pm

Hi Everyone

I mentioned in my last post that we are waiting on structural steel to be manufactured.

The obvious question that comes from that statement is " why don't you pre-order it?" to save time.

A lot of builders do pre-order steel. We are given structural engineering plans which specify the type of steel, the length of the beams and the types of joins ( bolts & welds etc).

The problem is that it is nearly impossible to get a slab 100% perfect. The concretors do their best and we double and triple check formwork measurements, but then during the pour the formwork might shift slightly or something else unexplained happens and the slab could be out by 20mm or 30mm. That's enough to mess things up.

This is often why you see pre-made timber frames overhanging the slab rebates.

So to negate this, what we do is build all our frames on site, stand them, mark out the location of the steel beams and columns. Then the steel manufacture comes to site and adjusts his measurements accordingly. He then custom makes to fit the slab which most of the time works out to be a better finish.

I hope this makes sense

Simeon

alexp79 · Oct 24, 2023 4:55 pm

Yes, makes 100% sense.

How deep and long are your floor joists? Do you use any prefabricated ones?

Joolsie · Oct 26, 2023 6:08 pm

Ashington Homes

Joolsie

Long time lurker here; I just wanted to check in and say thanks so much for posting all this detail.
The costings especially are really informative in these times of run-away prices.
Please keep up it up!

Hi Joolsie

Thank you so much for your comments and awesome to see you stop lurking

I am trying to be as honest, open and informative as possible without being too boring.

The goal is to take people through every step of building a home, including the good, the bad and the ugly, and hopefully we all learn something along the way.

Seriously, if you have any questions, no matter how silly they may seem, feel free to ask. Nothing is off limits and no one will judge!

Also, as with my duplex build. If anyone wants to drop by and see how a house is built, I will always make time for you. Just give me a shout.

Have a great afternoon

Simeon

Thanks Simeon, and I don't think it's boring at all - one can't be too informed in this area. Definitely agree that both clients & builders will benefit from understanding the good and the bad from both sides - I think a project is more likely to succeed if that collaboration starts early.
I really appreciate that there are many people here willing to share their expertise. It will definitely give some confidence to know when the time is right to start my own adventure!

Ashington Homes · Nov 09, 2023 7:05 am

Hi Everyone

Time for a quick update on this build.

The great news is that we are tracking right on program. Since my last post we have completed all the lower frames, the structural steel and the lower Hebel walls will be finished today, ready for scaffolding to be erected Friday.

This means we are on track to have the upper frames finished by the end of the month and are still in with a good chance to get the roof on by Christmas.

That will be a massive achievement considering we only started the pool excavation on the 28th August 2023.

So in 9 & 1/2 weeks we have built a pool, slab, lower frames, flooring and external walls. It would be nice if all our builds went that smoothly!

What I want to talk about today is our quality assurance process, especially around frames, as I often get asked questions from forum members about wall straightening, and acceptable tolerances and how to fix walls that are not straight.

Timber is a natural product and it is very normal to have some studs that have bows in them. If the timber is exposed to even a small amount of rain these bows can increase. If you pick up on these early on it is a really simple process to straighten them.

So what we do at the end of each framing stage, is we go through each room, wall by wall with our carpenter, using a 2m straight edge and a builders square and check each wall for straightness horizontally and each stud vertically.

The allowable tolerance is 5mm over 2m but personally I think that is too much, we work to around 1-2mm.

Each stud that needs straightening is marked, and there are various methods to straighten a bowed stud, but the one my guys use is to cut a small notch, pull the bowed section forward and then nail blocks into each side. The limitation to this is that you can only do a maximum of 25%, but we never come close.

We then measure every window to make sure they are the right size and in the right location ( sometimes they aren't) and check all of the other technical issues like bolts, brackets joist hangers etc.

Our boys will then spend a day tidying everything up.

On this job, I invited the clients along so that they could experience the QA process. We had some particularly bad bows in a couple of our 3500mm high walls. When I say bad I mean we had two studs which were out by 30mm, we also had a structural beam that had minor a twist in it which was affecting the Hebel flooring, so that needs to come out.

I enjoyed having the clients come along so they could see the good the bad and the ugly, and at least they could see that we were taking the quality aspect seriously, although I think they got bored.

Coming back to the reason the bows were bad in the 3500mm high living areas. Due to the height a small bow in the timber is exaggerated over that height so in future builds, I am thinking of substituting the normal 90x45 pine with 90x45 LVLs which are dead straight. The only issue is that they are not always available.

Here are some photos from earlier in the week. Not too exciting but will give you an idea of the progress.

Till next time

Simeon

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ponzutwo · Nov 09, 2023 8:31 am

Ashington Homes

We then measure every window to make sure they are the right size and in the right location ( sometimes they aren't) and check all of the other technical issues like bolts, brackets joist hangers etc.

This is so important. I used a volume builder and had some custom changes to the design. This included additional windows in custom sizes in the kitchen.

The display had a beautifull bifold servery window out to the alfresco, but the upgrade was an obscene 8k. The display also had a litlle side window on the adjoining corner we liked as the kitchen would be dark without it.

The standard in place of the bifold was tiny. So we had the builder get the window makers manufacture an awning window that was the same size as teh display bifold. 1k instead of 8k. Good outcome.

Then the issues came thick and fast. The plans didnt reflect it several times, then did, then didnt again. Then when the frame wnet up the opening was for teh original smaller window. Smaller window was also delivered and larger one never manufactured. The corner window was not at the right level in teh frame but was on the plan. Etc.

Because this was a "custom" element to the plan, and having done this before, I had a feeling there would be mistake after mistake on something that was pretty basic. In the end it was all sorted as we needed it, but i hazard a guess that it would have been a worse fight if we'd not picked it up when the frames went up.

long story short, good on you for checking the window sizes. It was the first thing i did when teh frames went up.

Pedro4137 · Nov 09, 2023 12:40 pm

Will hebel go in that skinny spot

Ashington Homes · Nov 10, 2023 6:45 am

Pedro4137

Will hebel go in that skinny spot

That skinny post is just a temporary prop

We need to concrete a footing and build a proper column which will be 350 x 400mm

Ashington Homes · Nov 10, 2023 6:47 am

ponzutwo

Ashington Homes

We then measure every window to make sure they are the right size and in the right location ( sometimes they aren't) and check all of the other technical issues like bolts, brackets joist hangers etc.

This is so important. I used a volume builder and had some custom changes to the design. This included additional windows in custom sizes in the kitchen.

The display had a beautifull bifold servery window out to the alfresco, but the upgrade was an obscene 8k. The display also had a litlle side window on the adjoining corner we liked as the kitchen would be dark without it.

The standard in place of the bifold was tiny. So we had the builder get the window makers manufacture an awning window that was the same size as teh display bifold. 1k instead of 8k. Good outcome.

Then the issues came thick and fast. The plans didnt reflect it several times, then did, then didnt again. Then when the frame wnet up the opening was for teh original smaller window. Smaller window was also delivered and larger one never manufactured. The corner window was not at the right level in teh frame but was on the plan. Etc.

Because this was a "custom" element to the plan, and having done this before, I had a feeling there would be mistake after mistake on something that was pretty basic. In the end it was all sorted as we needed it, but i hazard a guess that it would have been a worse fight if we'd not picked it up when the frames went up.

long story short, good on you for checking the window sizes. It was the first thing i did when teh frames went up.

That's a great example as to why it's so important to check measure everything

Ashington Homes · Nov 20, 2023 5:49 am

Hi Everyone,

Just a super quick update.

Last week we finished the framing and erected the scaffolding. This was forecast to be completed by the 30th November. So we have picked up 2 weeks on the program.

This allowed us to take a pause and do a massive clean up. We managed to remove 20 tons of rubbish. I get so stressed when there is rubbish onsite! This job has been moving at such a frenetic pace that there has been no opportunity or room to get a bin as material deliveries have been taking up the space.

Anyhow, this week ( weather permitting - there is a lot of rain forecast for most days) we will do the upstairs Hebel, and then late next week start the roof. The goal was always roof by christmas.

Here is a photo from Friday.

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Cheers

Simeon

Ashington Homes · Dec 06, 2023 4:01 pm

Hi Everyone,

This will probably be my final post for the year. It has been a massive one and I am totally exhausted and ready for the break!

We hit a major milestone today and I am over the moon. We completed all of our external walls!

I have the roofers booked in tomorrow and this means that the massive goal I set at the beginning, which was to have the roof on by Christmas will be achieved.

So despite losing all last week to rain, since the 1st August we have managed to:

1. Demolish a house
2. Excavate a pool in solid rock
3. Pour a concrete pool
4. Lay a complex slab with a large amount of drop edge beams
5. Hand frame an almost 400 sqm house
6. Install all external drainage
7. Install hebel and yellowtongue flooring
8. Install all Hebel external walls
9. Keep the neighbours happy

Between now and next Friday's shutdown we will get all the windows measured and into production, start rendering the walls and finish the upper roof.

Then back in the new year for a clean run at the interiors.

Have a merry and safe christmas everyone.

Below are some photos

Till next year

Simeon

Pre Demolition This was taken on the 1st August 2023Like ⋅ Add a comment ⋅ Pin to Ideaboard ⋅

A photo of the vacant siteI think this was taken circa 18th August 2023Like ⋅ Add a comment ⋅ Pin to Ideaboard ⋅

Aerial shotI think this was taken around the 23rd October 2023Like ⋅ Add a comment ⋅ Pin to Ideaboard ⋅

Facade photo 4 weeks agoThis was taken on the 6 November 2023Like ⋅ Add a comment ⋅ Pin to Ideaboard ⋅

Facade with all hebel finishedThis was taken on the 6th December 2023Like ⋅ Add a comment ⋅ Pin to Ideaboard ⋅

Structural plywood roofpart of the BAL FZ compliance
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Upper Hebel wall exampletaken on the 6th December 2023Like ⋅ Add a comment ⋅ Pin to Ideaboard ⋅

SJT76 · Dec 06, 2023 4:08 pm

Really happy for you - you deserve every success that you achieve.

Appreciate your support throughout my build, and if you ever start building in Melbourne, let me know and I'll build something just so you can build my house!

Ashington Homes · Dec 06, 2023 4:09 pm

SJT76

Really happy for you - you deserve every success that you achieve.

Appreciate your support throughout my build, and if you ever start building in Melbourne, let me know and I'll build something just so you can build my house!

Thanks and you are very kind

alexp79 · Dec 06, 2023 4:35 pm

Great progress, Simeon! Probably one of the fastest 'complex' builds I have seen so far on this forum.

Ashington Homes · Dec 07, 2023 5:41 am

alexp79

Great progress, Simeon! Probably one of the fastest 'complex' builds I have seen so far on this forum.

Thanks Alex,

My intention was to blog this one warts and all, and other than that week of rain we have gotten lucky and not had any issues to date.

I wish they were all this smooth, we have a few others that have hit some hurdles.

This is probably a good time to mention for anyone who needs a S73 approval, ie sewer encasement, sewer connection or a water connection, in October, Sydney Water introduced a whole new level of paperwork and approvals for their contractors around safety and there is now have a massive backlog holding up projects.

We have a duplex which has been on hold since August when we applied for S73 in June and we can't seem to get out of the queue.

Anyhow, moral of the story, get you S73 in as early as you can.

Cheers

Simeon

suku18 · Dec 07, 2023 9:04 am

Great going Simeon,
This looks amazing and progressing well.

What I wanted to ask looks like you didnt go with brick walls for the house. Any particular reason for this.
Are these Hebel external walls as mentioned in your post. Are these strong enough and good for a two storey house.

Thanks

Ashington Homes · Dec 07, 2023 9:19 am

suku18

Great going Simeon,
This looks amazing and progressing well.

What I wanted to ask looks like you didnt go with brick walls for the house. Any particular reason for this.
Are these Hebel external walls as mentioned in your post. Are these strong enough and good for a two storey house.

Thanks

Thanks Suku

Yes these are the 75mm Hebel powerpanels.

There are a number of reasons we chose Hebel for this build including:

1. It is a flamezone build and Hebel is in our opinion the best product on the market to achieve compliance with fire rating. It is a fully sealed system so no need for weep holes

2. Cost - It is roughly 25-30% cheaper than rendered brick

3. Speed - it is far quicker to install than bricks

4. Thermal properties - from our experience the thermal properties especially in the hot summers far exceeds brick

And yes it is definitely strong enough for a 2 story home. We have done quite a few Hebel builds and our clients love the results.

Thanks again for your questions

All the best

Simeon

alexp79 · Dec 07, 2023 11:41 am

suku18 Hebel panels are not load bearing, so the 'strength' still stays with the frame.

@Ashington Homes I thought rendered Hebel veneer was pretty much similar cost wise with the brick veneer before, is it less expensive now or bricks became more expensive?

Ashington Homes · Dec 08, 2023 7:23 am

alexp79

@suku18 Hebel panels are not load bearing, so the 'strength' still stays with the frame.

@Ashington Homes I thought rendered Hebel veneer was pretty much similar cost wise with the brick veneer before, is it less expensive now or bricks became more expensive?

It is very hard now to find a decent bricklayer under $1.60-1.80, so by the time you factor in the bricks, lintels, sand, cement, weepholes, brick ties and then render, bricks are more expensive.

And then there is the time factor and the mess etc

Ashington Homes · Dec 08, 2023 7:29 am

Hi everyone

I took this photo this morning and I thought it might be interesting to see what goes into a BAL FZ roof.

So what you can see is 15mm structural ply, then each joint has been sealed with a fire rated silicone.

Battens have been installed and the next step is a fire rated insulation and then an anticon blanket.

On top of that we will install klip lok sheeting as there are no penetrations, and finally all of the ridges will be tediously filled with fire rated foam then fire rated silicone.

The joints between the fascias and walls will also have silcone.

Eaves & soffits will have two layers, fire check and then villaboard and also be caulked with a fire rated silicone before being painted.

Cheers

Simeon

BAL FZ roof under constructionLike ⋅ Add a comment ⋅ Pin to Ideaboard ⋅