Browse Forums Building A New House Re: Heating and cooling option for the new build 3Feb 08, 2022 8:30 am The Harder You Try - the Luckier You Get ! Web site http://www.anewhouse.com.au Informative, Amusing, and Opinionated Blog - Over 600 posts on all aspects of building a new house. Re: Heating and cooling option for the new build 7Feb 10, 2022 10:23 am I'm getting one those installed. Pro's Better zone control than ducted, each room is separately heated and cooled, if one kid likes it 22c and the other 24c and you like it 20c the rooms can be set to different temps. Cheaper to run than ducted, more expensive than individual split systems If the outdoor unit is sized properly you have the possibility of adding additional internal units down the line or upgrading individual room capacity reasonably cheaply. You can oversize the unit, for example if the outdoor unit is 20kw you can normally connect 30kw of indoor units, if they're all turned on you only get 20kw of capacity, but if you might have 10kw of living room running during the day and 20kw of bedrooms running at night so the outdoor capacity isn't overwhelmed. No ducting, so no issues of air leaks in the ceiling cavity where you end up paying to cool the roof. each indoor unit gets its own control panel. more flexibility on internal units, can have wall, floor, ceiling and bulkhead units. Cons More expensive to install than ducted, less expensive than installing individual splits for every room. More parts to potentially breakdown. Less ability for the house to be 'one temperature' as each room is individually controlled area's like hallways are harder to cool, in a ducted system the return is often in the hallway so the cool or warm air from the various vents travels through the house to the return cooling those additional areas on the way. a split system has the return built into the unit so its less effective at cooling those extra areas, though this is part of what gives it better efficiency, you're not cooling unused portions of the home. Re: Heating and cooling option for the new build 8Feb 10, 2022 10:32 am My daughter just had one of these installed. She alreday had a split in her lounge/dining so got a multihead unit installed for the bedrooms. Pricing was extremely reasonable, approx $2000 less than was quoted for a ducted install to the bedrooms, and it gives total control over each room. If I built again I'd probably go that way. Re: Heating and cooling option for the new build 9Feb 10, 2022 6:52 pm Spazzen I'm getting one those installed. Pro's Better zone control than ducted, each room is separately heated and cooled, if one kid likes it 22c and the other 24c and you like it 20c the rooms can be set to different temps. Cheaper to run than ducted, more expensive than individual split systems If the outdoor unit is sized properly you have the possibility of adding additional internal units down the line or upgrading individual room capacity reasonably cheaply. You can oversize the unit, for example if the outdoor unit is 20kw you can normally connect 30kw of indoor units, if they're all turned on you only get 20kw of capacity, but if you might have 10kw of living room running during the day and 20kw of bedrooms running at night so the outdoor capacity isn't overwhelmed. No ducting, so no issues of air leaks in the ceiling cavity where you end up paying to cool the roof. each indoor unit gets its own control panel. more flexibility on internal units, can have wall, floor, ceiling and bulkhead units. Cons More expensive to install than ducted, less expensive than installing individual splits for every room. More parts to potentially breakdown. Less ability for the house to be 'one temperature' as each room is individually controlled area's like hallways are harder to cool, in a ducted system the return is often in the hallway so the cool or warm air from the various vents travels through the house to the return cooling those additional areas on the way. a split system has the return built into the unit so its less effective at cooling those extra areas, though this is part of what gives it better efficiency, you're not cooling unused portions of the home. Thanks a lot spazzen appreciate for providing good detail and wow comparison. I am now leaning towards multi head split system. Just need one clarification. Is performance same whether internal units are on wall, floor, ceiling and in bulkhead? Is ceiling an option for the ground floor? Re: Heating and cooling option for the new build 10Feb 10, 2022 6:53 pm Althom My daughter just had one of these installed. She alreday had a split in her lounge/dining so got a multihead unit installed for the bedrooms. Pricing was extremely reasonable, approx $2000 less than was quoted for a ducted install to the bedrooms, and it gives total control over each room. If I built again I'd probably go that way. Thanks althom for sharing the personal experience. I will work on multi head split system quote with the builder. Re: Heating and cooling option for the new build 11Feb 11, 2022 10:12 am idev Spazzen I'm getting one those installed. Pro's Better zone control than ducted, each room is separately heated and cooled, if one kid likes it 22c and the other 24c and you like it 20c the rooms can be set to different temps. Cheaper to run than ducted, more expensive than individual split systems If the outdoor unit is sized properly you have the possibility of adding additional internal units down the line or upgrading individual room capacity reasonably cheaply. You can oversize the unit, for example if the outdoor unit is 20kw you can normally connect 30kw of indoor units, if they're all turned on you only get 20kw of capacity, but if you might have 10kw of living room running during the day and 20kw of bedrooms running at night so the outdoor capacity isn't overwhelmed. No ducting, so no issues of air leaks in the ceiling cavity where you end up paying to cool the roof. each indoor unit gets its own control panel. more flexibility on internal units, can have wall, floor, ceiling and bulkhead units. Cons More expensive to install than ducted, less expensive than installing individual splits for every room. More parts to potentially breakdown. Less ability for the house to be 'one temperature' as each room is individually controlled area's like hallways are harder to cool, in a ducted system the return is often in the hallway so the cool or warm air from the various vents travels through the house to the return cooling those additional areas on the way. a split system has the return built into the unit so its less effective at cooling those extra areas, though this is part of what gives it better efficiency, you're not cooling unused portions of the home. Thanks a lot spazzen appreciate for providing good detail and wow comparison. I am now leaning towards multi head split system. Just need one clarification. Is performance same whether internal units are on wall, floor, ceiling and in bulkhead? Is ceiling an option for the ground floor? As I understand it the units perform the same regardless, if its a 2.5kw indoor unit its 2.5kw. You'll get some differences, a floor unit is better for heating as hot air rises and a ceiling unit is better for cooling as cold air falls, that's why radiant heaters etc are always on the floor. https://www.mitsubishielectric.com.au/a ... e-2019.pdf https://www.mitsubishielectric.com.au/a ... ingles.pdf Every brand is different but Mitsibishi have 1-20 different internal units, 6 or 7 are designed to be concealed in a ceiling, I'd imagine some are suitable for a ground floor ceiling. Re: Heating and cooling option for the new build 13Feb 13, 2022 7:33 pm Just a note/question. I recently lived in an apartment which had what I now recognise was a multi-head system. I forget the brand. It was a smallish apartment, with interior units in the living area and the single bedroom, with a single exterior unit on the balcony. We found (eventually, after much puzzlement and a few complaints) that it only worked if both interior units were working. In other words, while the two rooms were controlled separately, you could cool both rooms or heat both rooms, but not just one. In any other configuration (cooling one and switched off in the other, fan in one while heating the other, etc etc) it would simply operate as a fan. This always seemed nonsensical to me - surely it defeats the purpose of having multiple units in the first place. You can't close off the bedroom and keep it cool, without cooling the entire apartment. Does that sound at all normal for this kind of setup? (Obviously it wouldn't heat and cool at the same time, but that's to be expected). Re: Heating and cooling option for the new build 14Feb 14, 2022 12:34 pm ThatGuy42 Just a note/question. I recently lived in an apartment which had what I now recognise was a multi-head system. I forget the brand. It was a smallish apartment, with interior units in the living area and the single bedroom, with a single exterior unit on the balcony. We found (eventually, after much puzzlement and a few complaints) that it only worked if both interior units were working. In other words, while the two rooms were controlled separately, you could cool both rooms or heat both rooms, but not just one. In any other configuration (cooling one and switched off in the other, fan in one while heating the other, etc etc) it would simply operate as a fan. This always seemed nonsensical to me - surely it defeats the purpose of having multiple units in the first place. You can't close off the bedroom and keep it cool, without cooling the entire apartment. Does that sound at all normal for this kind of setup? (Obviously it wouldn't heat and cool at the same time, but that's to be expected). thanks thatguy42 now I am keen to know this so can make the right choice Re: Heating and cooling option for the new build 15Feb 16, 2022 8:42 am idev ThatGuy42 Just a note/question. I recently lived in an apartment which had what I now recognise was a multi-head system. I forget the brand. It was a smallish apartment, with interior units in the living area and the single bedroom, with a single exterior unit on the balcony. We found (eventually, after much puzzlement and a few complaints) that it only worked if both interior units were working. In other words, while the two rooms were controlled separately, you could cool both rooms or heat both rooms, but not just one. In any other configuration (cooling one and switched off in the other, fan in one while heating the other, etc etc) it would simply operate as a fan. This always seemed nonsensical to me - surely it defeats the purpose of having multiple units in the first place. You can't close off the bedroom and keep it cool, without cooling the entire apartment. Does that sound at all normal for this kind of setup? (Obviously it wouldn't heat and cool at the same time, but that's to be expected). thanks thatguy42 now I am keen to know this so can make the right choice I was 99% certain that they work independently but I called my AC guy to double check as I was calling to discuss other options such as Wi-Fi controllers anyway. My unit is 22.4kw and can ramp down to 2kw with the smallest connected units being 2.8kw. I can run all of the units at once or just have a single one on if I want. I've got a total of 20.8kw of indoor units connected to the outdoor unit, 1 8kw unit, 2 3.6kw units and 2 2.8kw units. The outdoor unit can have between 11.2kw and 29.12kw of indoor units connected, though if you turn on more than 22.4kw of indoor units all at once the cooling capacity is still only 22.4kw. I intend to add an extra unit to my garage at some point in the future. I was also told that you can install a branch box which allows refrigerant to be reversed so you can heat one room while cooling another, this is more expensive though. They've all got individual controllers in the respective rooms, but I'm now also looking at adding a central controller with override power so I don't have to go to each room to check if they're on or off. I'd certainly check with your AC guy as maybe some brands or models aren't as flexible or are setup differently, but from googling it, most systems say you can run just a single unit if you want. Re: Heating and cooling option for the new build 16Mar 15, 2022 12:01 am Spazzen idev ThatGuy42 Just a note/question. I recently lived in an apartment which had what I now recognise was a multi-head system. I forget the brand. It was a smallish apartment, with interior units in the living area and the single bedroom, with a single exterior unit on the balcony. We found (eventually, after much puzzlement and a few complaints) that it only worked if both interior units were working. In other words, while the two rooms were controlled separately, you could cool both rooms or heat both rooms, but not just one. In any other configuration (cooling one and switched off in the other, fan in one while heating the other, etc etc) it would simply operate as a fan. This always seemed nonsensical to me - surely it defeats the purpose of having multiple units in the first place. You can't close off the bedroom and keep it cool, without cooling the entire apartment. Does that sound at all normal for this kind of setup? (Obviously it wouldn't heat and cool at the same time, but that's to be expected). thanks thatguy42 now I am keen to know this so can make the right choice I was 99% certain that they work independently but I called my AC guy to double check as I was calling to discuss other options such as Wi-Fi controllers anyway. My unit is 22.4kw and can ramp down to 2kw with the smallest connected units being 2.8kw. I can run all of the units at once or just have a single one on if I want. I've got a total of 20.8kw of indoor units connected to the outdoor unit, 1 8kw unit, 2 3.6kw units and 2 2.8kw units. The outdoor unit can have between 11.2kw and 29.12kw of indoor units connected, though if you turn on more than 22.4kw of indoor units all at once the cooling capacity is still only 22.4kw. I intend to add an extra unit to my garage at some point in the future. I was also told that you can install a branch box which allows refrigerant to be reversed so you can heat one room while cooling another, this is more expensive though. They've all got individual controllers in the respective rooms, but I'm now also looking at adding a central controller with override power so I don't have to go to each room to check if they're on or off. I'd certainly check with your AC guy as maybe some brands or models aren't as flexible or are setup differently, but from googling it, most systems say you can run just a single unit if you want. Would you mind sharing what brand you went with and how much it costs? I'm also building a double storey and looking for cooling solution.. This sounds like a configuration that will also work for me. I can't imagine that this would cost me less than ducted though. Builder quoted me around 15k for ducted.. wondering if that might be cheaper. Re: Heating and cooling option for the new build 17Mar 15, 2022 6:35 am Babbo Spazzen idev thanks thatguy42 now I am keen to know this so can make the right choice I was 99% certain that they work independently but I called my AC guy to double check as I was calling to discuss other options such as Wi-Fi controllers anyway. My unit is 22.4kw and can ramp down to 2kw with the smallest connected units being 2.8kw. I can run all of the units at once or just have a single one on if I want. I've got a total of 20.8kw of indoor units connected to the outdoor unit, 1 8kw unit, 2 3.6kw units and 2 2.8kw units. The outdoor unit can have between 11.2kw and 29.12kw of indoor units connected, though if you turn on more than 22.4kw of indoor units all at once the cooling capacity is still only 22.4kw. I intend to add an extra unit to my garage at some point in the future. I was also told that you can install a branch box which allows refrigerant to be reversed so you can heat one room while cooling another, this is more expensive though. They've all got individual controllers in the respective rooms, but I'm now also looking at adding a central controller with override power so I don't have to go to each room to check if they're on or off. I'd certainly check with your AC guy as maybe some brands or models aren't as flexible or are setup differently, but from googling it, most systems say you can run just a single unit if you want. Would you mind sharing what brand you went with and how much it costs? I'm also building a double storey and looking for cooling solution.. This sounds like a configuration that will also work for me. I can't imagine that this would cost me less than ducted though. Builder quoted me around 15k for ducted.. wondering if that might be cheaper. I'm not sure what the total cost was. The initial quote for the house included a 15kw ducted system and the upgrade price was around 7k though a large portion of that was just from going from 15kw to 22.4kw. Brand is Mitsubishi. Re: Heating and cooling option for the new build 18Mar 16, 2022 9:12 am Spazzen Babbo Spazzen I was 99% certain that they work independently but I called my AC guy to double check as I was calling to discuss other options such as Wi-Fi controllers anyway. My unit is 22.4kw and can ramp down to 2kw with the smallest connected units being 2.8kw. I can run all of the units at once or just have a single one on if I want. I've got a total of 20.8kw of indoor units connected to the outdoor unit, 1 8kw unit, 2 3.6kw units and 2 2.8kw units. The outdoor unit can have between 11.2kw and 29.12kw of indoor units connected, though if you turn on more than 22.4kw of indoor units all at once the cooling capacity is still only 22.4kw. I intend to add an extra unit to my garage at some point in the future. I was also told that you can install a branch box which allows refrigerant to be reversed so you can heat one room while cooling another, this is more expensive though. They've all got individual controllers in the respective rooms, but I'm now also looking at adding a central controller with override power so I don't have to go to each room to check if they're on or off. I'd certainly check with your AC guy as maybe some brands or models aren't as flexible or are setup differently, but from googling it, most systems say you can run just a single unit if you want. Would you mind sharing what brand you went with and how much it costs? I'm also building a double storey and looking for cooling solution.. This sounds like a configuration that will also work for me. I can't imagine that this would cost me less than ducted though. Builder quoted me around 15k for ducted.. wondering if that might be cheaper. I'm not sure what the total cost was. The initial quote for the house included a 15kw ducted system and the upgrade price was around 7k though a large portion of that was just from going from 15kw to 22.4kw. Brand is Mitsubishi. Oh man! That sounds super expensive if you had to pay 7k on top of a 15k ducted system. Re: Heating and cooling option for the new build 19Mar 16, 2022 9:18 am Babbo Oh man! That sounds super expensive if you had to pay 7k on top of a 15k ducted system. 15kw, not 15k. I don't know what the initial price was, it was baked into the overall house quote. Looking at prices online, just upgrading the outdoor unit from 15kw to 22.4kw costs about 3k, whether it was ducted or multi split. I could have just had a 15kw multi split, but I wanted the extra power as I live in a hot part of the country so it cost more. Re: Heating and cooling option for the new build 20Mar 24, 2022 12:50 pm idev Hi members, can you share your experience and advise on the heating and cooling options for the new double story townhouse build in Melbourne south east. Not sure what options are cost effective and also energy efficient to run at low cost. some of the options I can think of: 1. Ducted Gas Heating + Evaporative Cooling 2. Ducted Gas Heating + Refrigerated Cooling 3. Central heating and cooling system like Daikin. Is this same as reverse cycle air conditioning system? thank you. I have owned both evaporative cooling and now central refrigerated cooling (3 phase 20kw). I can honestly say for Melbourne, evaporative cooling is a lot better especially at night time when it's the most critical. Evaporative cooling takes fresh air from the outside and blows the air into the house. Refrigerated cooling recirculate the same stale air but cools it via a condenser outside the house. As the temperature variation for Melbourne is quite large, when it's night time, evaporative cooling cools the house much faster as it can displace air at a much faster rate than refrigerated even if you use it like a regular fan since the outside air would be significantly cooler than inside. The problem with refrigerated is the air displacement is low and as soon as you turn it off, the air temperature turns right back on as the bricks surrounding the house continue to emit heat radiation it absorbed earlier. Also the air is very dry and Melbourne's summers are dry as it is so the whole thing isn't as comfortable. As for heating, I know people swear by heat pump but I went with gas as I find gas heating does not dry the air out like a heat pump. Newbie question for flooring options. We are thinking of changing the flooring for bedrooms and passage area. Last time we looked at flooring options was almost 8years… 0 3519 Hi, I'd like some advice on the best option please on the estimate options we've been provided from our builder. This is for the… 0 4066 Would also like an opinion from anyone that has used xcem over hebel for floors. Thanks 1 14227 |