uPVC Windows

Hi
Yes I have updated my profile... thanks. We have supplied WA, Vic & NSW... shortly Tasmania.
Cynthia

Hi EPS

Aluminium has been the dominent product in Australia for over 20 years. Both Aluminium and timber have a place in the market. Dating of product happens to everything from homes to cars to MP3 players. The durability and performance of aluminium has stood the test of time.

In Victoria timber is a major part of the market.


The climate in Europe and part of the USA are so different to Australia that it does not follow that PVC will be required. Aluminium or timber with double glazing will provide all the thermal improvement you will ever need in the Australian climate.

Importatnly I would rather support our local industry before all jobs go offshore.

You can achieve 5, 6 and more star ratings with aluminium double glazed products as the main influencing factor is the glass area not the framing. There are a range of more cost effective methods to achieve a reduction in the energy output and comfort levels.

I have viewed projects with PVC Windows in Australia which after 2 years are discoloured and some importers dont us the strengening bars. This is a real concern but i will ask these questions of EcoClassic not you EPS

Ecoclassic

are you a member of the AWA
Do your windows comply with Australian Standard AS2047
Have they been accredited by an independent 3rd party to Australian Stardards

Thanks Eco

windowexpert

i dont believe that for one second. I live in Melbourne and we have had 2 cold mornings in about 8 months.

Each of those mornings resulted in no condensation and i live in a cool area.

No if i lived in Russia well maybe

Were you at Mt Buller?


I would rather put my excess funds when building or renovating into a Plasma TV or surrond sound or other mod cons. How many times do you even open your windows?

I dont care what they look like

thanks anyway Ed

Comfort Smart

Durability of PVC? Well PVC has been around in windows since the 1940s in Germany and as you know dominates the USA and Europe. Durability of aluminium I agree, but it's not just about durability - the typewriter is more durable than the PC, the sliderule is more durable than the electronic calculator. And now enter PVC, the MP4 player of the window market and just as durable as aluminium... how is aluminium in a coastal environment? Even with powdercoating and anodising Aluminium can and does corrode.

I agree in the building industry for everything except windows. Just look around, look at display homes, talk to any major builder, timber is too hard and too expensive to maintain and Gen Y (& my generation - Gen OLD ) is not into maintenance.

Nonsense - Our climate patterns overlap with Europe and the USA. when it's cold here it's b***** cold and when it's hot it's b***** hot, and PVC windows are now dominant in Asia after only 5 years - as they will be here in the same period. 37 degrees in Beijing last week minus 10 in the winter

A very good point. Up to 80% of all aluminium (which is around 60% of the material cost of a window) used by the major window manufacturers comes from China. And the majority of glass used in domestic windows (and windscreens etc) comes from (in order of sq.m.) China, Taiwan, Indonesia. India. And the quality is mostly as good as or even better than local. The largest glass manufacturer in China makes a Low-E product which is streets ahead of the equivalent local product performancewise. All the major window companies import or buy imported hardware and even the hardware manufacturers import - Doric (Hardware) has a factory in China that supplies the chainwinder on the A&L casement (the awning winder may come from China too).

In a nutshell - competition is good for Australia and good for the economy. Why? It creates investment in local companies who must keep up with technology. It makes local companies price conscious - the price of local aluminium dropped dramatically when imports appeared. Take 6 years ago when 3mm glass was $7.40/m2 to a certain window manufacturer (and said to be increasing 20% more as it was "in short supply" sand in short supply ) - now any manufacturer can buy glass locally for $4.50/m2 (at the time I sourced glass imports from an ISO accredited Co in India when the local market tightened - and suddenly it loosened - but not before some fun and games as the locals tried to stop me at the source - and that local supplier now uses my source ). That's the impact of imported product - more competition, and better product leading to a better lifestyle.

If you want to save Australia from imports get out of the window industry (I'll get to that soon) and get into another industry that can compete worldwide and provide jobs here (I have a software development company in Australia that employs 20 people here in Australia developing and supplying patented world's best systems to a company in the top 10 of the Fortune 500 in the USA and globally - a net job importer! And 90% of the staff were retrained from other areas including manufacturing - e.g. one from the Pilkington Glass factory, one from the Corinthian Doors factory - brilliant people ).

I seriously doubt if any local window manufacturer can use the "made in Australia" claim... check with the ACCC. Adding a few (imported) screws to imported materials and slapping on imported hardware using imported tools does not constitute Australian made. Check it out...

http://www.accc.gov.au/content/item.pht ... ZCERTA.pdf

May be true depending on the relative area of glass and frame - look elsewhere in this forum you will see that aluminium conducts heat 220 times better than glass 220x . Most window manufacturers (including A&L I believe) are researching or at the development stage of using improved frame technology for obvious reasons

Some methods are more cost effective (compared to some of today's window prices), but the major impact on energy efficiency is the window and if energy efficient windows (with energy efficient frames) can become more economical then that is the cost effective solution to the problem that the window creates as the hole in the insulation layer of a home. And if you really want comfort you do all of these according to your personal economic situation - but there is no doubt - it's windows number 1 :!:

So who are you Comfort Smart...???

I ask because Comfort Smart is the registered business name of...

pause....



A&L Windows

http://www.alwindows.com.au/energyrating.htm

Name COMFORT SMART
Date Business Commenced Jan 6 2003
Renewal Date Jan 15 2009
Business Status REGISTERED

Registered Office
Address (Current): 20 APOLLO DR
HALLAM
VIC 3803

Start Date: Jan 15 2003

Corporations(s) Carrying on Business (Current)


A & L WINDOWS PTY LTD
Registration Number: 064 692 888
Type: OWNER
Class:
Address: 20 APOLLO DR
HALLAM
VIC 3803


Not so Smart

Casa

As long as you understand Ed Perry who initiates a number of posts on the site appears to be the 20% owner of EcoClassic (info from ASIC)

I am not trying to push any barrow only ensure consumer awareness

I am renovating (adding a second story) and tried the Comfort Smart site.

A&L advised me it was closed 2 years ago due to a conflict of interest in providing windows and then rating them.

EcoClassic and EcoClimate appear to be doing the same thing.

Good luck and hope you have success for your project.

Now I'm confused. There appears to be two types of companies - retailers and raters? There are four players:

EcoClassic
EcoClimate
A&L
Comfort Smart

Can someone clearly explain the relationship between these. Also Ed Perry and Comfort Smart, please inform me if you are in anyway associated with any of the four organisations. Involved equates to any ownership or know personally anyone involved in any of these organisations.

People come to this forum for peer advice and don't expect to have business people to promote their goods without being totally transparent and open.