Browse Forums Heating, Cooling & Insulation 1 Jan 13, 2010 9:17 am I posted this under new buildings also. We took possession of the house 24th of December and we have had a few problems over the christmas period but the one that bugs us the most is that the upstairs of our two storey house gets quite hot inside. The house is in Sydney. We have a low pitched roof, 20 degrees, roof tiles are concrete dark gray, good quality sarking throughout and R3 Batts in the ceiling. So what did we do wrong? I expected that it would be a lot cooler inside, in fact as you go down the stairs to the ground floor it is like walking into a fridge it is that noticeable. What experiences have others had, what have you done to achieve a cooler upstairs. Do roof ventilators help? we didn't need them for BASIX. thanks Dan Re: hot house 2Jan 13, 2010 9:25 am Air circulation and venting are very important, Just how much is the question If it is cool downstairs then more hot air has to be released from upstairs. Where you are coming from is where you are going to... Re: hot house 3Jan 13, 2010 12:34 pm we arent in the same situation as you, we have a new single story house with good insulation, but the house is terribly hot. i think for us its because the house faces south, is lowset and there is a neighbour a few metres away, there's just no air or breeze getting in so we swelter... in the late afternoons its terrible, the outside temp is sometimes 5 to 10 degree's different than inside, which might be fine in winter, but not in summer. you walk out onto the patio and its like walking into aircon compared to inside. we came from an east facing high set house and the new place is terrible, makes me sad and i dont think there's a thing we can do other than turn on the aircon and chew through the power..... ive started trying to put our ceiling fans on reverse to suck in the air but thats just annoying. doesnt help that at night we cant open our sliding door onto the patio cause the frikin dog snores too loud to have it open! Blog - http://snakedr.blogspot.com/ Build Thread - viewtopic.php?f=31&t=12084&p=307406#p307406 Status - PCI 15/10. Things nearly done. Re: hot house 4Jan 13, 2010 12:41 pm Well your solution is to shut the house up tight as a drum from early morning - before sun up, preventing any sunlight entering the house. Reverse for evening after sundown open all blinds curtains vents etc...( not any west windows ) When you get to the arvo use the patio to allow cool air in. Where you are coming from is where you are going to... Re: hot house 5Jan 13, 2010 1:01 pm do you mean with the aircon on or off? if we have the aircon on, then turn it off while the house is locked up it turns into a sauna pretty quicksmart with no ventilation so couldnt leave it like that for long at all, 20 minutes was the longest we left it on the weekend when i tried just having the aircon on to cool the house then leaving it locked in Blog - http://snakedr.blogspot.com/ Build Thread - viewtopic.php?f=31&t=12084&p=307406#p307406 Status - PCI 15/10. Things nearly done. Re: hot house 6Jan 13, 2010 2:36 pm I am currently renting in a 4-bedroom townhouse. My housemate and I both stay in the upper storey. In summer the rooms sometimes stay uncomfortably warm even at night. We have north facing windows. Drawing shut the curtains (thick drapes) offers teeny weeny bit of relief. I couldn't stay in my room in the afternnoon from 3-ish onwards if the day temp is going to be higher than 25 deg cel. However, downstairs is so much cooler. A friend told me external awnings do wonders. They help to minimise radiant heat/direct sun light. As my new house is getting built now, I just have to bare with the upstairs summer heat for the last time. But you will be comforted during winter...it would be oh-so-lovely and warm upstairs but downstairs cold - with just minimal heating on. If you turn on the heater full blast in winter, downstairs would be warm and upstairs boiling! Hot air rises, cold air sinks. Re: hot house 7Jan 13, 2010 2:52 pm we have 2 massive west facing windows, but they get shaded out by our 6ft fence on top of a retaining wall about 5pm, plus have a shadecloth awning on one of the windows so its not getting full sun by any means, and sun isnt our issue, i think its that the house is holding heat and fresh air just isnt getting inside to cool it down... Blog - http://snakedr.blogspot.com/ Build Thread - viewtopic.php?f=31&t=12084&p=307406#p307406 Status - PCI 15/10. Things nearly done. Re: hot house 8Jan 13, 2010 3:11 pm Do you have insulation in the walls? Stefan Building the M3tr!con Liberty 42 at Stonecutters Ridge. The New Build Blog - "Life, In Progress." Stonecutters Ridge Community Website | My photos Re: hot house 9Jan 13, 2010 3:15 pm not on the outside no, only on a lot of the internal walls mind you it hasn't even been hot here, just a bit sticky, but inside is staying consistently close to 30' for most of the evening even though its down towards 20' outside. maybe we're a candidate for a few whirlybirds? I know for the most part in most cases they dont work, but maybe we are a case where they would be of assistance. Blog - http://snakedr.blogspot.com/ Build Thread - viewtopic.php?f=31&t=12084&p=307406#p307406 Status - PCI 15/10. Things nearly done. Re: hot house 10Jan 13, 2010 3:38 pm billdsl not on the outside no, only on a lot of the internal walls mind you it hasn't even been hot here, just a bit sticky, but inside is staying consistently close to 30' for most of the evening even though its down towards 20' outside. maybe we're a candidate for a few whirlybirds? I know for the most part in most cases they dont work, but maybe we are a case where they would be of assistance. I've noticed a big difference with wall insulation as well - especially on northern facing walls. Keeps the inside much cooler. Whirlybirds made a difference for us in our old place as well. You could definitely tell a difference. Stefan Building the M3tr!con Liberty 42 at Stonecutters Ridge. The New Build Blog - "Life, In Progress." Stonecutters Ridge Community Website | My photos Re: hot house 11Jan 13, 2010 3:55 pm deletedpenguin Whirlybirds made a difference for us in our old place as well. You could definitely tell a difference. Ive never heard anything positive said about whirly's, your the first one! I might have a chat to my contact and see if I can give them a shot. Something is definitely not right Blog - http://snakedr.blogspot.com/ Build Thread - viewtopic.php?f=31&t=12084&p=307406#p307406 Status - PCI 15/10. Things nearly done. Re: hot house 12Jan 13, 2010 4:25 pm I've always thought that to be an unavoidable norm of double storey houses, to be honest. It doesn't help that that floor is likely to be mostly carpeted. Though its nice that the living areas (downstairs) generally are much cooler than single storey houses. We have eaves, it does help but upstairs still remains very hot - I've heard people who have evap coolers just for upstairs say it works wonders. Re: hot house 13Jan 13, 2010 4:59 pm danc12 I posted this under new buildings also. We took possession of the house 24th of December and we have had a few problems over the christmas period but the one that bugs us the most is that the upstairs of our two storey house gets quite hot inside. The house is in Sydney. We have a low pitched roof, 20 degrees, roof tiles are concrete dark gray, good quality sarking throughout and R3 Batts in the ceiling. So what did we do wrong? I expected that it would be a lot cooler inside, in fact as you go down the stairs to the ground floor it is like walking into a fridge it is that noticeable. What experiences have others had, what have you done to achieve a cooler upstairs. Do roof ventilators help? we didn't need them for BASIX. thanks Dan Hi Dan, I share your pain, I thought we'd be OK without any air-conditioning but last November we near fried. It seems to me our bricks (solid sandstock) and insulation (R R3.0 ceailing R2.5 walls and soundscreen in mid-floor) are keeping most of the heat out but the windows are letting a lot of heat in. Bit like a car left in the sun. A divert here, my car is white, the interior will get very hot in the sun but interestingly the boot is quite cool, no windows. At least keep your blinds down but consider awnings and outdoor blinds, screen and even trees. Have a look here: http://www.innovativeopenings.com/ it's US based but provides good ideas. These external blinds prevent heat from getting in and prevention is better than cure. Heavy window tint should help, bit like sun glasses. The type of internal blinds also makes a big differences. At work, west facing windows, I have pretty reflective grey vertical blinds, shiny but not "lost in space" shiny - the other offices have similar coloured blinds but made from some sort of cloth - mine reflect the heat noticeably better. 2. I'm looking into whirlybirds but I'm getting mixed messages, apparently they don't make a big difference, frankly I don't know about that. I'm still researching. I know it gets mighty hot in the roof cavity. 3. Then of course there's air-conditioning. We recently installed an Actron 19kW ESP Plus system which definitely brings in some chill but I'd recommend doing as much passive cooling as possible. We only need it on very hot days and even then only for half an hour or so. If you have a lot of north or west facing windows then they definitely need attention. Then consider the external and internal blind situation. Hope that helps, good luck Re: hot house 14Jan 13, 2010 6:16 pm Dan, You're lucky that the downstairs feels cool. You can utilise this coolness. What you need is to get some air flow out of the house in the top storey to allow some of the cool air from downstairs to get upstairs. Try opening some windows slightly that are well away from the stairs and see if you get good airflow. Don't open the windows too much. All you want is to get a slow steady stream of air up the stairs. Also, try to find out where the heat is getting in. Do you have many west facing windows? If so, consider external shades or shutters. Things like whirlybirds don't do much. Also, what type of construction do you have - full brick, brick veneer or otherwise? Each has their method of keeping things as cool as possible. Two things that work particularly well with full brick are: 1) Shut the house up during the day (hence the only open the top windows a little) 2) Open the house up in the late afternoon/evening as soon as it's cooler outside. Be careful; don't go by feel as moving air will feel cooler than the still air in the house. Use a thermometer. Cheers, Casa P.S. You just scrapped in for getting in before Christmas! Demolition August 2009, Construction Started September 2009, Completed December 2010 Re: hot house 15Jan 13, 2010 7:18 pm You might find some of the comments and links in this thread useful. viewtopic.php?f=20&t=26439 Re: hot house 16Jan 13, 2010 9:41 pm I'm in the same boat as you. Downstairs wonderful, upstairs, hot as hades. This week's 43 deg temps in Melbourne rendered the upper area uninhabitable. While researching a possible solution to the problem I came across a publication by the Victorian government that has some interesting comparisons regarding the effectiveness of various window treatments. http://www.sustainability.vic.gov.au/re ... ection.pdf Re: hot house 19Jan 14, 2010 8:09 pm Thanks for all the responses. The main message I get is that the jury is out on whirly birds. The ohter day we put in an aerial and I got up in the roof with the installation guy, holy cow was it hot, I can see that by pushing cooler air up there would lessen the heat load on the air con for sure, The ducts that they use have to be only R1 I am sure and if the temp is up around 40 to 45 that's got to really knock the cool air around so that would lessen any ability to get the upstairs under control. Our other big problem at this stage is that having only moved in and our finances at this stage being a wee bit tight, we haven't got any window coverings so we don't have the ability to lock some of that heat out. I am thinking timber shutters that should provide a good insulator during the day, we have big windows. Will try some experiments, the good news is that for teh moment the hot weather has gone away. Thanks Dan Re: hot house 20Jan 14, 2010 8:22 pm I suppose I should clarify that whirlybirds won't help during the day - they're intended to let hot air escape from the roof cavity at night. They won't help cool things down during the day, but it helps things cool down at night. Stefan Building the M3tr!con Liberty 42 at Stonecutters Ridge. The New Build Blog - "Life, In Progress." Stonecutters Ridge Community Website | My photos Depends how much direct sun it gets. Is there any shading (eaves or trees)? If the sun hits a window directly it doesn't matter too much if it's double or single… 1 12645 the sun master is the solar heating to "warm" the water in the tank the S26 is your hot water system which will heat the water (25 degrees?) so with both turned on you… 2 12308 I want to build a decking to the drawn shape outlined in black. The problem is how close can I build to the gas hot water unit? Will I be able to build around it and be… 0 20219 |