Browse Forums Outdoor Living 1 Sep 23, 2010 9:56 pm Hi all Another flooring option for our pergola is paving. However, we dismissed it early on because of the loose sand. Recently, we've heard that there is apparently some kind of hard set sand mix which doesn't even require a concrete slab subfloor. The pavers can still be laid into a sand bed, but supposedly the "grout" can be firm like real grout or mortar. Does this sound familiar to anyone? My signature is distracting people from my wise posts ... Re: Mortar/Grout for Pavers 2Sep 27, 2010 6:24 am Few products out there, Pavlok is one. Is a flexible sand which sets when hosed. Wouldn't compare to grout. If you like pavers why don't you lay on mortar, then grout with sand/cement? Landscape Design & Construction http://cherub.squarespace.com/ Re: Mortar/Grout for Pavers 3Sep 27, 2010 7:06 am Thanks, Cherub. The situation is a bit complicated since our backyard is sloping and the pergola would need to look something like this (except that there should be a strip of grass/garden bed between the ret. wall and the edge of the pergola slab): Like ⋅ Add a comment ⋅ Pin to Ideaboard ⋅ So, we are trying to find a solution other than slab (which has to be built with piers and deep enough to get to the natural ground), but similar to slab (as in something that we can put tiles on). We think slab is the most complicated option (access issues etc.). We've been told that a proper slab is our best solution (although it will apparently crack and some cracks may show thr'u tiling!?!?). Timber deck is the least preferred option for us. Also not sure what "connection" is there between the slab and the ret. wall ... or none. Should the ret. wall be built on a proper cement bed, or sand only? My signature is distracting people from my wise posts ... Re: Mortar/Grout for Pavers 4Sep 28, 2010 6:22 am Compressed sheeting over timber or steel sub frame would probably be a cheaper option than slab you are proposing. Careful consideration would go into designing of structure to reduce impact of control joints. You would need to source your tiles first then design for spacing of joints Landscape Design & Construction http://cherub.squarespace.com/ Re: Mortar/Grout for Pavers 5Sep 28, 2010 8:02 am What about compacting the area first? Is it needed in this case? The soil up to the (future) retaining wall is just fill which was pushed over by the builder during initial site excavation. Other than the guy driving the machine over it a few times, it hasn't been compacted (as in following the procedure from the proper definition of compaction). My signature is distracting people from my wise posts ... Re: Mortar/Grout for Pavers 6Sep 28, 2010 4:49 pm Could span from house to retaining wall, what is the span? Landscape Design & Construction http://cherub.squarespace.com/ Re: Mortar/Grout for Pavers 7Sep 28, 2010 7:35 pm Not sure what do you mean ... the slab/deck would be around 4.5 m wide, and then we'd have a strip of soil (maybe 0.8m) and then the retaining wall .... My signature is distracting people from my wise posts ... Re: Mortar/Grout for Pavers 8Sep 28, 2010 10:23 pm So, you are going to put in the retaing wall to make it all level right? What will you make the retaining wall out of? If it were me and I did not want to have a slab, I would make the retaining wall out of split face besser block (guess what we did in the front yard????:)), then fill in to make level below the top of the retaining wall, compact, install pavers, and use concrete and sand to fill and set between pavers. But, if I went to all the trouble to build the retaining wall as above, I would probably pour a thin slab and lay pavers on top of that. What are the access issues you have? Depending on how much you want to spend, there are definitely ways to get concrete to remote places;) Greg Re: Mortar/Grout for Pavers 9Sep 29, 2010 7:22 am Hi Greg, nice to "see" you ... have you finished and moved in yet? OK, yes, very similar as per the sketch (minus the colours, plus a patch of grass between pergola floor and retaining wall). The wall is actaully required and would contain the fill, even if we don't build any pergola. It's only about 600-800 high. The fill is almost level up to the edge of the fill, so we'd just smooth it. gpierce If it were me and I did not want to have a slab, I would make the retaining wall out of split face besser block (guess what we did in the front yard????:)), then fill in to make level below the top of the retaining wall, compact, install pavers, and use concrete and sand to fill and set between pavers. Yes, that's exactly the plan, including the blocks . Strangely, pros are trying to talk us into using bricks and rendering them, they are against the blocks (still don't understand why, I thought that blocks are better for any future movement). Did they concrete the footing for your wall, or just lay it into sand? And how did you compact the soil? None of the pro's we talked to so far wants to compact it. We'd prefer not to have any loose sand at all in that area, so that's the reason we think that tiling (over a slab) is the best option. How is your concrete and sand holding in terms of being taken out and carried around. Can you send me any pics (maybe a PM)? The access is limited to a drive-through garage . So, there is access, but I'm a bit concerned about various heavy machinery being driven through it . My signature is distracting people from my wise posts ... Re: Mortar/Grout for Pavers 10Sep 30, 2010 6:51 am Option 1 Drop the garden strip between the slab and wall, tie the slab into the retaining wall ( besser blocks core filled with concrete). Compaction of fill required, would use plate compacter lifts of 150 mm. You could build planter box on top of slab if you wanted. Option 2 Drop the garden strip, Build subfloor from either steel or treated pine between house and wall. Lay compressed sheeting and tile Backfilling wall not important as floor will span between house and wall. Wall would support floor so again besser blocks core filled with concrete. Landscape Design & Construction http://cherub.squarespace.com/ Re: Mortar/Grout for Pavers 11Sep 30, 2010 7:33 am Thanks, cherub! You've really summarised it well (our 2 options). One guy is saying that tiling would crack on any kind of sheeting, so he suggests slab (our soil is highly reactive clay). Even with the slab, it could crack/move but apparently not as much as joists and bearers Dunno ... When you say "tie into the wall" - what does that mean?? We were also thinking about not having the garden strip, but some guys said it doesn't matter. Still not convinced. Maybe it's more complex without the garden strip (if we do piers and concrete slab). My signature is distracting people from my wise posts ... Re: Mortar/Grout for Pavers 12Oct 01, 2010 5:18 am With sheeting floor, you must plan your joints in relation to tiles, (this allows for control joints). It takes more setout and you need to know your tiles before start of works. With the tie into wall slab, you would leave reinforcing bars from the retaining wall and 'tie' to reinforcing from the slab. Without seeing the site first hand both options would work, once you have a solid footing for your retaining wall. Landscape Design & Construction http://cherub.squarespace.com/ Re: Mortar/Grout for Pavers 13Feb 14, 2011 10:28 pm Thanks, cherub. I wrote exactly the opposite from what I was thinking ... I meant that it's more complex with the garden strip Anyway, the DH is not dropping it My signature is distracting people from my wise posts ... Appreciate that Chippy. I won’t do sand under pavers and will connect all up under pavers, however I was going to do: 1) Roadbase compacted with manual hand tamper 2)… 10 18529 Those span tables can be pushed a little for a low deck if you dont mind a little flex. Last deck I did, I pushed it a little and it was still rock solid - no noticeable… 6 13704 |