Browse Forums Kitchen Corner 1 Nov 15, 2009 7:47 am Hi, This might turn into a bit of a rant, so I apologize in advance. I got a new kitchen put in at the start of this month. It looks great, and I'm happy with the design and the colours. Antique white cupboards, Quicksand benchtop, silver kickers. The splashback is 600x300 Antique White tiles. Nothing too adventurous I know, but the house is fairly plain too. But at the final inspection of it this week (where the guy came out to see if there were any issues and we pay the last $500 ) I felt like I was getting poor customer service with any problems I raised. For example, on one of the end panels of my pantry, there was chipping along the length by the front edging strip. After saying it wasn't really noticable from a distance (it's beside me when I'm standing at the cooktop) he said they could just touch it up with paint. Which he has since done - it's better but not perfect. I brought up the fact that there was paint on one of the shelves in the corner cupboard (again, they had chipped it cutting the corner section but had bogged it up with paint before assembling it), and it stood out from the rest of the shelf. He looked at it and said "oh that happens on most of the corner cuts" and then he said "they've used 2-pack paint there, that will last longer than the cupboard will"... Like I should be grateful they used such an expensive paint to cover up their bad work The wall where a light switch was has been badly plastered/filled, and will need more fill to complete it. This is a switch they had to move because they measured the room wrong, not because we asked for it to happen. I thought they would clean it up for us, he told my husband to "get some filler then give it a bit of a sand". And where the grout has cracked beside the cupboard, to "grab some grout from the leftovers, make a paste, and just run your finger along it". We're supposed to fix their work??!! But the main thing that I'm upset about, is where the cupbaords and kickers meet the floor. This is a custom made kitchen, from what we believed was a good company. But it's not been levelled to meet the floor. It's just been set up for the bench to be flat. I have end panels appearing to float in the air, and gaps of up to 1cm under the kickboards in places. Shouldn't they have scribed this or whatever it's called to get it to look level? It looks more like a flat pack job that I could've done myself It's a 70's house, with wooden floorboards and a layer of masonite over them. We had old lino down before, we ripped that off, and planned to replace it with new vinyl. When we asked about the gaps, he said the way we could fix that was to get another layer of masonite put down before the new vinyl, to cover up the gap. Is this normal? Am I expecting too much? I will try and post photo's later. Thanks for reading my rant Re: New kitchen problems - am I expecting too much? 2Nov 15, 2009 7:56 am I for one don't think you are expecting too much. If it were me, I would be doing a very loud song and dance, probably disco and make them fix everything. It's not your job...as you said. Don't let them push you around as much as they try. Re: New kitchen problems - am I expecting too much? 3Nov 15, 2009 6:12 pm abandc2003 But the main thing that I'm upset about, is where the cupbaords and kickers meet the floor. This is a custom made kitchen, from what we believed was a good company. But it's not been levelled to meet the floor. It's just been set up for the bench to be flat. I have end panels appearing to float in the air, and gaps of up to 1cm under the kickboards in places. Shouldn't they have scribed this or whatever it's called to get it to look level? It looks more like a flat pack job that I could've done myself This is because of your floor, not the actual kitchen. Your floor isnt level which means the perfectly straight cut timber cannot sit on it flat (like you ideally would like it to). You cabinet maker woud have tried to compensate for this by buzzing the top of the kickers so that your bench is actually level, but as for the part which touches the floor... besides you actually fixing your floor there is not much the cabinet maker can do - he cant cut wood in 'waves' to match the level of your floor IYKWIM? My husband has said in the past that there has only ever been a handful of houses which have been near on perfect level, with most older houses being a nightmare to work with! Custom European Cabinets - Melbourne Kitchen Specialist PM for business details as website currently being updated! Our Crazy Owner Builder Journey! Re: New kitchen problems - am I expecting too much? 4Nov 15, 2009 7:10 pm If that was me I would make them put a new cupboard door in to replace the chipped one. If its normal for corner cupboards shelf to be like that they should have informed you before hand. I would make them re fix everything that is wrong. Because you will sit there and look at the mistakes everyday.You paid money and they are meant to provide a service! Building a new home.. paranoid about colour selections.. - Slab Poured December 2009 - painted, tiled,plumbing installed,shower installed,kitchen installed... Next stage for painting touch up, portico and gate, carpets!... so excited! Re: New kitchen problems - am I expecting too much? 5Nov 15, 2009 8:10 pm chipped cupboards unacceptable! have them replaced Gaps under the kickboards unacceptable. BUT depending on the price of the job you get what you paid for. I for one would have made sure it was mentioned before the job started as my dad used to install kitchens and he would not rest untill it was perfect. I had my bathroom people on edge when I gave them a list of acceptable and not acceptable with pictures from bathrooms as example. They did very well and I probably paid extra for it but I do not care for that. Result is worth it. Bottom line is you only owe them 500 good luck getting them to fix it. It will cost them more to fix. Jack Re: New kitchen problems - am I expecting too much? 6Nov 15, 2009 8:20 pm I'm in the midst of trying to upload some photos, so bear with me! SuH and angie_tak - thanks for the support - it's nice to know it's not just me being too picky Bam - I kind of understand what you're saying, but the kickboards are just screwed on after the fact, they don't change the bench height. The installer used little pieces of wood "chocks"? to make the cupboards and bench be level. But I don't see why the kickboard along the floor can't be cut "in waves" as you say? They do it for benches when the walls aren't straight or when the corners are not 90 degrees. What's the difference with the floor? My in-laws had theirs done a couple of years back (not the same company), and the height of the bench to floor differs along the length of the room. About 1cm difference, and the kickboards are cut to suit. They didn't even realise at the time - it's only now that we asked about it they checked their own kitchen! It was done for them as a matter of course. I've decided I'm going to put my concerns in writing, with a list of things I want fixed, and another list of things that I'm not pleased about that the company should be aware of. I just can't face them in person, or on the phone. Here's a link to my photos (I think!) Sorry about the quality of them - phone pics.. our camera died the day before the kitchen was installed http://s271.photobucket.com/albums/jj14 ... en%20pics/ Sorry for the long rant - I was just so looking forward to this kitchen, and I had big expectations and now I feel like an idiot. Re: New kitchen problems - am I expecting too much? 7Nov 15, 2009 8:25 pm jacobvz chipped cupboards unacceptable! have them replaced Gaps under the kickboards unacceptable. BUT depending on the price of the job you get what you paid for. I for one would have made sure it was mentioned before the job started as my dad used to install kitchens and he would not rest untill it was perfect. I had my bathroom people on edge when I gave them a list of acceptable and not acceptable with pictures from bathrooms as example. They did very well and I probably paid extra for it but I do not care for that. Result is worth it. Bottom line is you only owe them 500 good luck getting them to fix it. It will cost them more to fix. Jack Thanks Jack, I know - they're unlikely to fix anything now - as for cost, about $13k ex appliances. And I didn't know our floor wasn't level - and so didn't know I had to ask for it!! I stupidly "assumed" - they custom make kitchens - it will fit Naive I know Re: New kitchen problems - am I expecting too much? 8Nov 15, 2009 8:46 pm abandc2003 Bam - I kind of understand what you're saying, but the kickboards are just screwed on after the fact, they don't change the bench height. The installer used little pieces of wood "chocks"? to make the cupboards and bench be level. But I don't see why the kickboard along the floor can't be cut "in waves" as you say? They do it for benches when the walls aren't straight or when the corners are not 90 degrees. What's the difference with the floor? Sorry, I didnt mean "kickers" as such (Im just the wife, my knowledge is limited ) This is my understanding.. Is your kitchen on legs or is it solid? What I mean was that they would either adjust the height of the legs, or buzz the solid kicker to make the kitchen level if your floor in unlevel. This can be done with the kicker too, depending on how extreme your floor is (and probably needs to be done is your kitchen needed to be adjusted to be leve). But if your floor is "wavey" than its hard - Benches are a lot easier - you can see what needs to be done, and then if the cut in untidy (as its done with a jigsaw or similiar) it gets covered with whatever adhesive is used for your splashback and is unnoticeable. You want the finish on the floor to be perfect, which is why drop saws, panel saws etc are used - which can only cut straight lines, not wavy. Im not saying it cant be fixed, it depends on the quality and pride in their work (and using chocks to level the kitchen doesnt say much from what I know ). If they've taken the 'easier' way out, then they can probably do a better job in minimising, if not eliminating, the gap. BUT you need to keep in mind, that it does largely depend on how unlevel your floor is too. You cant tell just by looking at a photo. And what I mentioned above about levelling the kitchen, is the exact reason why your inlaws bench height varies And my husband doesnt use grout for anything.... he uses gap filler I think (dont quote me, but its definately not grout)??? Adding more grout woud just make it bulkier me thinks? Can you get the grout out (chip it away? But get them to do it incase the cupboard gets damaged!) and put gap filler instead? The floating cupboard - this is an end panel, yes? If so, then they've simply ordered the piece too short - They can fix this easily And with the painted bit - is it just a shelf? I so, easily fixed too - get them to recut a shelf Custom European Cabinets - Melbourne Kitchen Specialist PM for business details as website currently being updated! Our Crazy Owner Builder Journey! Re: New kitchen problems - am I expecting too much? 9Nov 15, 2009 8:49 pm abandc2003 as for cost, about $13k ex appliances. : That better be some big or complicated kitchen! Most of the ones on our site (excluding timber) wouldnt have cost that much Dont be afraid to ask what you paid for Custom European Cabinets - Melbourne Kitchen Specialist PM for business details as website currently being updated! Our Crazy Owner Builder Journey! Re: New kitchen problems - am I expecting too much? 10Nov 15, 2009 11:54 pm Hi Bam - thanks for all your explanations I'll try and answer your q's The cupboards all have solid side pieces, to the floor. They're all joined together with screws side by side. No adjustable feet except under the corner cupboard. End panels are screwed on each end (just read that bit again - made me laugh - where else would they put them ). Bench top screwed into place on top... And kickboards swung into place from the bottom (into a little groove bit in the cupboard base bit) and screwed into place. (Tehnical jargon there!) The only cutting that got done here, was the bench (one piece was intentionly oversize) and his little chock things to even up the levels of the cupboards. He started at one end, got each cupboard level before adding the next one along etc. The bench itself just got placed on top AFAIK. This is why I thought the kickboards would be cut to cover the gaps, and also the end panels. The picture of the floating cupboard (an end panel) is how all my end panels are. I don't know if it's grout or filler - it was made using a fine powder in a bag.. and that is the join between the top of the tiles and the overhead cupboard. I can check the bag in the morning. As for the painted piece, that's the outside of my pantry cupboard. I guess it's an end panel type piece, it's the side with the vertical join along the front edge strip. But it's the side of the pantry that joins onto my cooktop bench, splashback and overhead cupboards. So it has a tile grout section along it. Does that make sense? It's a LOT better than it was now that it's had some paint. Oh - and just to clarify - my inlaws bench is level, just the floor isn't And as for cost, I should've added that included electrician, plumber, tiles and tiler, and the rangehood they supplied. I think before trades it was 8.5k? I'd have to check. I'll post some more pics tomorrow (oops - today!!) to help explain what I'm rambling about Thanks again Bron Re: New kitchen problems - am I expecting too much? 11Nov 16, 2009 6:37 am Heres a couple of piccies (sorry about quality) the kitchen Like ⋅ Add a comment ⋅ Pin to Ideaboard ⋅ these one shows the way it was put together (solid base edges etc) the oven and cooktop Like ⋅ Add a comment ⋅ Pin to Ideaboard ⋅ the sink side Like ⋅ Add a comment ⋅ Pin to Ideaboard ⋅ the pantry (this is the vertical strip that was chipped - closest to the benchtop) Like ⋅ Add a comment ⋅ Pin to Ideaboard ⋅ Cheers Bron Re: New kitchen problems - am I expecting too much? 12Nov 16, 2009 7:55 pm Me personally i would be getting them back to replace the pantry chipped panel and the shelf as well. Definately not acceptable. You paid to have the job done properly and thats what you should be getting. I use to be married to the most anal retentive cabinet maker on the face of the earth and no way in hell would he have left your kitchen like that. Mind you the cabinet work he does costs what the average person would pay to build a house. Never could understand how you could spend 200k on cabinet work in a house. They definately should have used silicone (no more gaps) and replaced the grout. As for the kick boards i really dont know. I would have thought they could have sanded the board back to get a better finish. Whether that is possible i dont know. Keep in mind for me if its not perfect it would drive me nuts. I have been known to grab a screw driver and adjust kitchen doors. Cant stand anything not exactly right. Bloody ex husbands lol Bams wife is probably the same. lol I pity the poor cabinet maker we get in next year to do our kitchen lol Anyone know a really good cabinet maker in Perth? Caz Re: New kitchen problems - am I expecting too much? 13Nov 16, 2009 8:44 pm No you are not epecting too much. I had a few issues with my granite which the guy did come back to fix. Had to compromise and move a cupboard slightly and now you really cant even notice the gap that was left there. I undertsand walls and floors are never flat but they were there installing it for u and should have planed down the kicker to sit flush on the floor. A gap left up the top underneath the cupboards will not be as noticible as the gap near the floor. We had to plane our kick base to lay flush over the floor boards, ours actually sat on the base, not on legs but i'm thinking the principle is the same. Ours was a custom made flat pack but we had to still plane it to sit flush. With the end panel not touching the floor, that will not be a big job. They just need to unscrew that panel and cut/plane a larger panel to fit. I really hope they sort this out for you and understand how dissappointing it is when people you are paying give you the brush off when its bascic common sense stuff. C'mon, anyone would expect the cupboard to touch the floor. Like you said, its a custom kitchen, not a flat pack. Re: New kitchen problems - am I expecting too much? 14Nov 17, 2009 7:45 am Thanks so much shackonthehill and Mango. It's really nice to hear that I'm not being overly fussy. We have written a letter to the managers of the company, posting it today.. My DH and I drew straws as to which of us would be taking their call (we're both dreading having to speak to them!) - looks like I shall have to put on my brave voice I'll post again when I know the outcome - fingers and toes crossed Thanks everyone Bron. Re: New kitchen problems - am I expecting too much? 15Nov 18, 2009 10:32 pm Hi abandc2003, Your kitchen problems sound very similar to mine, I can relate totally and I agree that you should get a perfect kitchen when you are paying a lot of money for a custom made kitchen not a flat pack one! Our kickers sit flush with the floor but there is a gap left at the top. The kickers were cut to fit a perfectly level floor but my floor was not perfectly level. I don't understand why the cabinetmaker just assumes all floors will be level? Why don’t they cut it slightly bigger and then cut it too fit? Surely that isn't too hard! Not all floors will be level and they should make things accordingly. I requested new kickers to fit perfectly but was told that "it is normal to leave a gap and that I must have had an uneven floor and you are not going to get down on your hands and knees to look at it!" I have looked at all my family and friends kitchens, some new or fairly new and none have a gap! Anyway, bottom line is he won't fix it. I will be asking again. We also had 2-pac panels that needed repainting, as there were chips and unacceptable paintwork. Lots of other things happened too, but will take too long to explain. A bit of good old-fashioned customer service would be nice I just think if they say they are a perfectionist, it should be perfect! I just want it finished! Re: New kitchen problems - am I expecting too much? 16Nov 19, 2009 2:13 pm It really, reallly annoys me when things are not done properly. I do not care how much we pay for things, it is our money, we work hard for it and no matter whether expensive or cheap, just do the job correctly. I imagine that the tradies would never except anything but perfect in their own homes!!! Sorry for the rant, but I just get sick of hearing how so many of us are treated!!!!!!! I am not a brick expert, but rendering would be 1 option, it would be costly to do the entire house though.... 2 6683 Hi all, has anyone been ask to do the weeds in their property while in the middle of build? We are under the impression that they are in control of the site while they… 0 2782 Have had a few issues with out recently done bathroom floor. Probably around 18 months old First there has been been a crack running through a grout line which I put… 0 2182 |