Browse Forums General Discussion 1 Apr 20, 2019 12:28 am 6 years on and still no result. I purchased a newly built home in 2012. 3 months later reported problems with doors unable to close and others jamming. Builder stated it was due to change in weather conditions. Ongoing problem with all doors in house now not square and sliding doors jamming and unable to use. That was the least of my problems! Defects inside: wall and ceiling cracks, gaps to skirting, cornice cracks, leaking roof, external sliding door and windows not weatherproof and cracks in floor tiles. These defects are in every room of the house. Defects outside: Articulation joints opening up, cracking to brickwork, gap between window and sliding door frame (40mm), gaps between window and brickwork (20mm), gaps between paving and brickwork along edge of home, gap between deck structure and brickwork. Builder rectified pavement by digging up and replacing in 2014, but problem has reoccurred. Builder also notified his insurance company and Loss adjuster and engineer provided report. Inconsistencies in report with timelines etc. Conclusion, builder not liable. This engineer also claimed there were trees lining alongside my garage in the neighbors property that would cause settlement. No trees are there. His testing of floor levels was with a golf ball and spirit level. I have sought legal advice, private engineer and CCTV inspection of pipes. Findings: 152mm difference in floor levels diagonally. 154mm along brick work. Ineffective drainage, cracked storm water pipes, wrong classification of soil (before build: E), engineer has said P due to large tree removed when site cleared. Slab heave in this area. Geotechnical report did not state there was a large tree in initial site investigation. So footing system not designed for site conditions (AS 2870). CCTV found cracked pipes in different areas of block. Engineer has recommended demolition and rebuild due to the extensive defects and footing system always going to be out of level. We all have a dream of owning our own home and in the end we live with the stress and emotional turmoil fighting for justice. Insurance companies will make up anything so they don’t have to pay and the government systems that are set up to support us don’t. Only way forward is to go down the legal road paying $1000’s with the risk of losing our home due to legal costs. Alternatively, live in a house that is collapsing. Re: Another defective house story 2Apr 20, 2019 9:44 am Welcome to the forum Unfortunately, the regulations are set up to protect Builders during and after failure. Chances are you will bankrupt the builder who has no money and also get stuck with your legal costs OT, It's too late identifying engineering problems after Occupancy Certificates have been issued similar cases have already played out in the Courts No doubt, there will be more postings from others with similar problems Interesting most all problems occur in Victoria? Designer,Engineer (Civil,Const & Envir),Builder,Concrete & Masonry Contract.Struct Repairs Re: Another defective house story 3Apr 20, 2019 10:29 am Thanks StructuralBIMGuy, It’s been an interesting read on these forums. The current system is wrong. There are meant to be standards and building codes to be followed and as we know these go by the wayside. Builders are the ones pocketing the big bucks by developing properties but the “average” home owner has to spend their well earned money to pay for legal advice to get justice. I purchased the house through real estate agent 3 months after the Occupancy Permit was issued unaware of the problems that would occur months and years down the track. As my private engineer has found, the 3 parties are at fault. Shouldn’t the insurance companies be the ones who cover the legal fees if they are fighting this out? The building industry needs an overhaul to not only protect the builder but to also protect innocent home owners. Re: Another defective house story 4Apr 20, 2019 2:18 pm I guess the first and uttermost thing that building industry needs is the decent INSURANCE which covers all the structural issues (as well as possibly even cosmetic/interior issues) for the lifetime of the house as long as the owners are committed to pay the premiums. During the first 7+ years the structural premiums will be paid by the builder and then they become owner's liability. We pay premiums to protect our houses from the fire and theft, how come this is different? Such insurance company will be hiring professional building inspectors and structural engineers to evaluate the quality of the build and engineering design for the specific site and soil, so the better is house, the less premiums you would pay. After then those premiums will be published online for free (without addresses and customer names, but with house builders' names and grouped by suburbs), so everyone can figure out what is their house is really worth and who is building better quality homes. Sounds like a good idea for a start up? Re: Another defective house story 5Apr 20, 2019 2:21 pm Harts 6 years on and still no result. I purchased a newly built home in 2012. 3 months later reported problems with doors unable to close and others jamming. Builder stated it was due to change in weather conditions. Ongoing problem with all doors in house now not square and sliding doors jamming and unable to use. That was the least of my problems! Defects inside: wall and ceiling cracks, gaps to skirting, cornice cracks, leaking roof, external sliding door and windows not weatherproof and cracks in floor tiles. These defects are in every room of the house. Defects outside: Articulation joints opening up, cracking to brickwork, gap between window and sliding door frame (40mm), gaps between window and brickwork (20mm), gaps between paving and brickwork along edge of home, gap between deck structure and brickwork. Builder rectified pavement by digging up and replacing in 2014, but problem has reoccurred. Builder also notified his insurance company and Loss adjuster and engineer provided report. Inconsistencies in report with timelines etc. Conclusion, builder not liable. This engineer also claimed there were trees lining alongside my garage in the neighbors property that would cause settlement. No trees are there. His testing of floor levels was with a golf ball and spirit level. I have sought legal advice, private engineer and CCTV inspection of pipes. Findings: 152mm difference in floor levels diagonally. 154mm along brick work. Ineffective drainage, cracked storm water pipes, wrong classification of soil (before build: E), engineer has said P due to large tree removed when site cleared. Slab heave in this area. Geotechnical report did not state there was a large tree in initial site investigation. So footing system not designed for site conditions (AS 2870). CCTV found cracked pipes in different areas of block. Engineer has recommended demolition and rebuild due to the extensive defects and footing system always going to be out of level. We all have a dream of owning our own home and in the end we live with the stress and emotional turmoil fighting for justice. Insurance companies will make up anything so they don’t have to pay and the government systems that are set up to support us don’t. Only way forward is to go down the legal road paying $1000’s with the risk of losing our home due to legal costs. Alternatively, live in a house that is collapsing. Harts, sorry for your issues, heaves always suck For the sake of educating people on that forum, will you by any chance be able to provide your original engineering drawings for the slab and footings as well as geotech report? Re: Another defective house story 6Apr 20, 2019 4:41 pm So much to learn,it's almost non stop,I found that the cheap flimsy wooden internal cavity slider that's inside the walls is something no one would ever think or care about untill their cavity doors won't open or run off track, always a problem,I like steel internal cavity's as doors always work well all year round, best of luck , unfortunately you have many problems ,but as you have kindly said,lets document better ways to help others . Re: Another defective house story 7Apr 21, 2019 8:05 pm Alex79 Unsure what the answer is but there does need to be something to protect those who opt to build or purchase a newly built house. To help others, I have uploaded original engineer's slab/footing design and main pages from Geotechnical report as unable to upload document. In Geotechnical report it did not report on the recently removed large tree in vicinity of bedroom 2 and family room. Also a shed was removed from the property. Like ⋅ Add a comment ⋅ Pin to Ideaboard ⋅ Like ⋅ Add a comment ⋅ Pin to Ideaboard ⋅ Like ⋅ Add a comment ⋅ Pin to Ideaboard ⋅ Like ⋅ Add a comment ⋅ Pin to Ideaboard ⋅ Like ⋅ Add a comment ⋅ Pin to Ideaboard ⋅ Like ⋅ Add a comment ⋅ Pin to Ideaboard ⋅ Like ⋅ Add a comment ⋅ Pin to Ideaboard ⋅ Like ⋅ Add a comment ⋅ Pin to Ideaboard ⋅ Like ⋅ Add a comment ⋅ Pin to Ideaboard ⋅ Re: Another defective house story 9Apr 22, 2019 10:19 am Insider, unfortunately yes. House built in 2012, suburb Belmont. The only way forward is VCAT. Each ‘expert’ will try to discredit the other ‘experts’ and in the end put the blame on me somehow. How is this fair? All I did was purchase a house to live in. Obviously I purchased a lemon. It would be a lot easier process if they just own up that they made a mistake. But we all know that that’s not going to happen. Re: Another defective house story 10Apr 22, 2019 12:06 pm Could I please have some advice regarding the following. I have had a report for sewage and stormwater drainage. Findings for sewer: they could not inspect the main run due to a 45 degree junction lead off the shaft. The drain along the left side is ponding a very large amount of water and also found a suspect joint after the lead junction at the I.s. Does this not comply with AS 2870? Stormwater: 3 x breaks/defects at rear of house below concrete path. These breaks appear to have been faulty sealed with black silicone. Obviously they damaged pipe when installing and then used silicon to patch. Also use of a plumb quick joint. Does the use of plumb quick joint not comply with AS 2870? Pictures of findings on Sewer drain and Stormwater Sewer drain Like ⋅ Add a comment ⋅ Pin to Ideaboard ⋅ Stormwater drain 1Like ⋅ Add a comment ⋅ Pin to Ideaboard ⋅ Stormwater drain 2Like ⋅ Add a comment ⋅ Pin to Ideaboard ⋅ Re: Another defective house story 11Apr 23, 2019 1:03 pm The disadvantage of buying a finished house is that there is no evidence of poor drainage during construction. On the plus there are VCAT decisions against the builders and orders to knock down and rebuild. Yes experts are expensive but lawyers will take 5-10 times more of your money. However it seems you do have some good evidence there, good luck. There are no easy solutions and no pretty stories here. Foremost Building Expert in Australia,assisting with building problems/disputes, building stage inspections,pre-contract review advice for peace of mind 200 blogs http://www.buildingexpert.net.au/blog Re: Another defective house story 13Apr 23, 2019 6:59 pm Thanks Building-expert. Unfortunately I don’t have this information but I have seen photos of other houses the Builder has built and surprise, surprise, no temporary downpipes once roof installed. I have no idea what a quick plumb joint is but is it not part of the AS? From the report I gather it shouldn’t have been used? Now the Engineer’s lawyer has arranged an inspection this week with a building/slab design expert. I maybe cynical, but is it another inspection to see where they can put the blame on me? Re: Another defective house story 14Apr 23, 2019 7:05 pm Do you have anyone working for you or are you relying on builders engineer? Foremost Building Expert in Australia,assisting with building problems/disputes, building stage inspections,pre-contract review advice for peace of mind 200 blogs http://www.buildingexpert.net.au/blog Re: Another defective house story 15Apr 23, 2019 7:36 pm Quick plumb referring to no-glue needed storm-water piping joints where the pipe simply pushes into the fitting until it makes a positive seal. Will likely be a Water Marked joining product and thus OK to code. These joins can be disassembled at any-time and that might be why the survey particularly identifies the joint as a push type.
Re: Another defective house story 16Apr 23, 2019 9:01 pm Harts Alex79 Unsure what the answer is but there does need to be something to protect those who opt to build or purchase a newly built house. To help others, I have uploaded original engineer's slab/footing design and main pages from Geotechnical report as unable to upload document. In Geotechnical report it did not report on the recently removed large tree in vicinity of bedroom 2 and family room. Also a shed was removed from the property. Like ⋅ Add a comment ⋅ Pin to Ideaboard ⋅ Like ⋅ Add a comment ⋅ Pin to Ideaboard ⋅ Like ⋅ Add a comment ⋅ Pin to Ideaboard ⋅ Like ⋅ Add a comment ⋅ Pin to Ideaboard ⋅ Like ⋅ Add a comment ⋅ Pin to Ideaboard ⋅ Like ⋅ Add a comment ⋅ Pin to Ideaboard ⋅ Like ⋅ Add a comment ⋅ Pin to Ideaboard ⋅ Like ⋅ Add a comment ⋅ Pin to Ideaboard ⋅ Like ⋅ Add a comment ⋅ Pin to Ideaboard ⋅ Would be very interested to actually find out your contract date. AS2870 was updated/revised/amended in January 2011. It would be an interesting point to see if your soil report was done either after or before the acceptance into Standards Australia as your soil report attached still references AS2870-1996. Regards Geo1 Re: Another defective house story 17Apr 23, 2019 11:40 pm building-expert - The builder contacted his insurer in mid June '17 regarding making a claim for structural damage to my home. Insurer appointed Loss Adjuster who inspected property in Oct '17 who then appointed Engineer for inspection and report. Inconsistencies throughout report, dates wrong and also stated trees down east side of my property on neighbours side causing settlement. No trees down the east side of property. After I received report I sought legal advice. I have had an Engineer inspect and provide report and sought CCTV of drainage. kks - Thank you for clarifying what a quick plumb is. Geo 1 - I have checked the Geotechnical report and on-site classification took place on 19/01/2011. I just checked that AS2870-2011was released for publication on 17/01/2011. I purchased unit in June 2012. The Builder subdivided and built unit. Going back over documentation, Building Permit was issued on 22/09/2011. Dates on Structural Engineering plans Dates structural engineeringLike ⋅ Add a comment ⋅ Pin to Ideaboard ⋅ Re: Another defective house story 18Apr 24, 2019 12:11 am As I suspected you have not engaged your own expert, instead relying on other parties whose aim is to prevent liability. The simple fact is that your home under warranty has failed and should be either repaired or replaced under warranty. Unless you have done something to contribute to the problem the liability is builder's. Six years is a long time to waste. Foremost Building Expert in Australia,assisting with building problems/disputes, building stage inspections,pre-contract review advice for peace of mind 200 blogs http://www.buildingexpert.net.au/blog Re: Another defective house story 19Apr 24, 2019 2:03 am Costs so far $12,000 getting an independent engineer to inspect and report. CCTV inspection and report. Legal advice. Emergency repairs to my home eg leaking ceiling caused ceiling damage, leaking pipes, leaking water pipe to home due to rubbing on brickwork, Carpenter to shave off external doors so I can lock them and be secure etc etc. Last year the builder was told by his insurer not to come and rectify any ongoing problems I was having.
In 2015 builder replaced north end of house perimeter concrete due to path moving away from brickwork (see pic). It’s apart again (see pic). For pictures I have removed the drainage sock. More water will get in down side of brickwork = more heave = more damage. This is where the system is wrong. Where does one find the money to seek justice at VCAT? It’s not just the financial burden over the years, it’s also the emotional stress and health issues that it all causes. Hi, We have a single story MacDonald Jones house, on a waffle pod slab with steel frame. Are we able to build a second story extension? Other info is we are 900mm from… 0 8374 We bought land in Tallawong Schofields NSW size 30m X 12.5m and planning to get double story house build around 350 sqm. We are thinking about having premium inclusions… 0 4074 Hi, Apologies - I know there is plenty out there on this but struggling to put together the puzzle. We're planning our garage/external laundry to master bedroom and… 0 10925 |