Browse Forums General Discussion 1 Jan 06, 2016 7:21 pm I've always found the idea of paying a deposit before knowing the final price of a build a bit weird, know what I mean? The price could still rise significantly without making it worth pulling out and losing the deposit, so you kind of have to expect it will, right? Has anyone ever experienced the final fixed price dropping after paying the deposit?? It is easy for the builder to just add some extra costing, say for footings or because of the way the drain is or whatever? Is there anything to regulate/limit that extra costing or they can name their price? Do they have to prove that cost? What says it has to be a reasonable cost? I mean how much would the average Joe accept as an increase to the contract price before it was too much and they'd be prepared to lose their 3-5k depost? 5k?, 10K?, 15K?? Re: deposits and building contracts 2Jan 07, 2016 1:45 pm I paid $1800 odd dollars, but this was to receive a fixed price tender.... For this, I got hours upon hours of time from my SC and head office (inc draftsman) who drafted a number of sets of plans, a soil test and other site examinations, and custom plans. I wasn't obligated to pay anything else until I signed a contract. I got as much included in the tender (in terms of upgrades you would ordinarily do at the colour appointment) and make PAs for tile and electrical upgrades (after some research on what the standard inclusions got me vs what I wanted). My advice is spec your house up as much as possible in the tender, before you lock in to a contract, because you can always cross items out but adding them can leave you in for a rude shock post contract! M Y C U S T O M C O R A L B R O N T E 43 ...............Kitchen! 16 Nov 2016 https://forum.homeone.com.au/viewtopic.php?f=31&t=79581 Re: deposits and building contracts 3Jan 07, 2016 2:05 pm I think it is perfectly reasonable. If you put yourself in the builder's shoes, how would you provide a client with a fixed price without knowing what the house will look like, what foundation the site's on etc? This is what the $1800 pays for - working drawings, soil classification tests, etc. Re: deposits and building contracts 4Jan 07, 2016 2:50 pm A tender price isn't a contract document..it is an estimate based on what information is available (known). And If you don't have the engineering info available then it can be easy additional money for the Builder/Contractor. Do your home work, ask questions & have the engineering /construction option explain by an ENGINEER. Clients trust engineers so it is easier for some builders to tell them the Engineer has made changes and they'll happily pay extra to the builder. Most Engineers don't question some Builders Motives of going in cheap and then later gouging extra engineering costs...Homeowners need to keep their wits about them.my2c Designer,Engineer (Civil,Const & Envir),Builder,Concrete & Masonry Contract.Struct Repairs Re: deposits and building contracts 5Jan 07, 2016 4:17 pm My block came with a 15 page soil report, so a builder should be able to get the footing price pretty close to the mark surely? What could cause a blow out beyond the original estimate in that case? a big rock? Re: deposits and building contracts 6Jan 07, 2016 4:22 pm I'd wager the amount of time they spend up front with you going through designs, getting them drawn up, going back and fourth with changes, going through the restrictions and covenants for your particular block etc wouldn't even be covered by the deposit. So you could argue that the home builder is punting just as much as you are. Re: deposits and building contracts 7Jan 07, 2016 10:00 pm lowexpectations My block came with a 15 page soil report, so a builder should be able to get the footing price pretty close to the mark surely? You would think so? My engineering drawings (upfront) are very easy to understand and be able to extrapolate exact costs On difficult/complex builds you should demand the same service. lowexpectations What could cause a blow out beyond the original estimate in that case? a big rock? Read/Search some of the posts up on H1 and draw your own conclusions Designer,Engineer (Civil,Const & Envir),Builder,Concrete & Masonry Contract.Struct Repairs Re: deposits and building contracts 8Jan 08, 2016 10:08 am Huggy_B So you could argue that the home builder is punting just as much as you are. The odds are stacked in favor of the builder once you (clients) start the process with a deposit. That is why the services the salesman/major builder offers are initially free..free sketch, free quote, anything free has no value ->worthless literally? Nor do the clients trust the salesman/builders enough to give you money in the first instance->perception->trust? I wish I had a dollar for every time i've heard a client say to the builder " the salesman/designer,said, I could do this..." Builder says " no, what would the Salesman/designer know he is not the expert" Nor is the builder when it comes to engineering....Go Figure Ask/Get for a complete service up Front and make informed decisions..those extra charge/Cost$ are best in your pocket Designer,Engineer (Civil,Const & Envir),Builder,Concrete & Masonry Contract.Struct Repairs Re: deposits and building contracts 9Jan 08, 2016 10:29 am I have full drawings that came with the land. It was a sub division so the original owner needed to submit plans to the council. The original plan therefor has some sort of partial approval for that design, but it expired a year or so ago. It would need council approval but I've spoken to them and they say it will be straight forward. I have a letter approving the use of the plans from the original designer. Levels are completely flat. All changes i'm making are superficial. So they have the soil report, they have a partially approved plan, they have full working drawings. I suppose i could get the levels done again (2 years later). Re: deposits and building contracts 10Jan 08, 2016 10:44 am LOL,I doubt the levels have changed in 2 years.. and its about extra fees, charges & price hikes (money for jam). Designer,Engineer (Civil,Const & Envir),Builder,Concrete & Masonry Contract.Struct Repairs Re: deposits and building contracts 11Jan 08, 2016 1:03 pm they dumped a bit of soil from the other side of the subdivision, just a couple of inches of soil from a pool they put it. My block needed it apparently. Re: deposits and building contracts 12Jan 08, 2016 6:23 pm lowexpectations It is easy for the builder to just add some extra costing, say for footings or because of the way the drain is or whatever? IT isnt easy if you run up a contract with clauses to prevent that. If they dont like your amendments to the standard contract, you can always decline it. there is no such thing as a standard contract, its just an industry term for "contract we present to a client which they invariable sign without querying too much". lowexpectations Is there anything to regulate/limit that extra costing or they can name their price? lowexpectations Do they have to prove that cost? What says it has to be a reasonable cost? Yes, and fair trading laws say it must. If anyone treats you unfairly it can be addressed via a tort in civil court. Contracts may not be unfair to the extent that they contravene any protection afforded by state / federal laws. lowexpectations I mean how much would the average Joe accept as an increase to the contract price before it was too much and they'd be prepared to lose their 3-5k depost? 5k?, 10K?, 15K?? Who knows , but this should be nutted out and provided for in a contact before signing it. Since the land is flat ,and you've got full soil reports, and the design sorted out, overall cost should be straightforward as far as the actual build goes, all things be equal of course. I'm in full agreement with StructuralBIMGuy's posts above also. Re: deposits and building contracts 13Jan 09, 2016 12:17 am Good point regarding deviations from the 'standard' contract. I don't know why I never thought of that. Thanks. I called VBA today and they said it was a Consumer Affairs issue, the old handball. Seems like the government organisations don't want to do their job at the moment. 2 5734 Industry type domestic contracts are prepared by industry bodies for the benefit of the builders. This means that if you are the owner watch out. One of the points is… 0 2008 MBA and HIA both have sub contract agreements, check them out 2 6021 |