Browse Forums General Discussion Re: Apathy/Miserliness in Design 61Jun 24, 2008 10:53 pm ah well,
my boss the director of the company, bought a new BMW the other week and has repeatedly tried to engage me in conversation about how expensive his car is, and what a good deal he got cause of his wealth, and how it should not have been available for months blah blah blah... i repeatedly brushed him off, but upon the 7th or 8th time he wanted a "chat" about his 100k plus car I gave him a big sigh, turned back to my PC and said "great....if thats what makes you happy then its a good purchase" shocked silence from our director subject has not been brought up since then another director is a wine affectionado, and has at times stressed about his wine purchases, I told him "people like you keep the wine and restaurant industry afloat" just my thoughts on this thread Jo Re: Apathy/Miserliness in Design 62Jun 24, 2008 11:11 pm rellie I've learnt one this one thing from this thread and a few others, this forum is great as long as everybody nods their heads in agreement, watch out if you have an unpopular opinion. Fiona, Whilst I completely disagree with your sentiment, I think this one got a bit out of control... But everyone knows I am anti anything that is PC! 2 words for you: DON'T LEAVE! We'd miss you Re: Apathy/Miserliness in Design 63Jun 25, 2008 12:26 am I don't feel apathy for poor people, I've been poor in my life and did something about it. Those who don't do anything about it are destined to stay poor. If that upsets anyone read rich dad poor dad to get an overall perspective.
I have battled with life and won. One of the fruits of victory is to be able to spend $1300 on a decorative cornice (the Jazz) get a 900mm shower and spa bath (hope that water shortage ends in my lifetime) On the note of mc-mansions I don't really like them but i know other people do. I hate wasted space and have build a house that has everything i need including areas for our daughter, as kids now stay at home longer. I personally don't like the expansive bedrooms in a lot of homes as i don't feel cosy in them but this is the sort of house my sister built because she likes it. We all do and like what makes us happy. A toyota aurion is a better car to drive than a bmw but a beemer or mercedes is a status symbol that is a marker of achievement in life. I don't begrudge or have a problem with anyone buying one and using it for this purpose. The current "financial crisis" is part of a cycle that happens every 10 years so over the space of my home loan it will probably happen twice again and i'll allow for it. Its just unlucky that it happened at the same time as a fuel crisis (last major one of those was in the 70's) These things happen people just need to ride them out and they'll end. A good farmer always keeps stores to allow for a bad year. It should be the same for finances. Hey, will post pics of the house when its finished and discuss the design ideas then. Building NB Hampton 19e finishing at end july 08 Re: Apathy/Miserliness in Design 64Jun 25, 2008 12:39 am Quote: I don't feel apathy for poor people, I've been poor in my life and did something about it. Those who don't do anything about it are destined to stay poor. If that upsets anyone read rich dad poor dad to get an overall perspective. I take it you mean "sympathy" not apathy. Huge sweeping statement. Quadraplegics on disability pension - just do something about your own poverty! Disadvantaged populations the world over - you only have yourselves to blame! Come on - its not that simple!!!! Re: Apathy/Miserliness in Design 65Jun 25, 2008 1:58 am ouch what a thread .
I go away for a day and what happens ... anarchy . But seriously NZ Fiona has a point ... many of us are purchasing McMansions in one form or another. Sometimes I feel guilty about the amount of time and effort I am putting into designing the perfect bedroom for my DD when in fact I know (every day it is in my face in fact) that some kids are living brutal lives ... in our country not o/s. On the other hand I am hoping that I can give my DD the best I can including caring attributes and good values. God I hope she doesn't become a social worker. I digress..... . Will this thread change my spending ... nope. Will it make me think twice before I buy the next purchase .... nope. Will I work harder at work to lift the capacity of disadvantaged families ... nope I am already committed. But thanks Fiona for bring this to our attention. It generated a lot of debate and was worth reading. At the very least it raises the dichotomy between those who have hope and those who do not. Re: Apathy/Miserliness in Design 66Jun 25, 2008 8:39 am floorit Newbies hehe who knew that this thread would take on a life of its own... Are you serious? Pretty obvious a post like hers was going to get thrown back in her face. err yes i'm serious....you often see on this forum some threads that don't get that much attention, and some that do... i think with this one, Fiona's post was taken wayyy out of context and starting getting personal too, which was a bit nasty... we're all adults, no need to get bash someone down just because they have an opinion....so i would rather you not ask me if "i'm serious" about something that i write....are u serious??? hahahahahahhahaha Re: Apathy/Miserliness in Design 67Jun 25, 2008 8:59 am Helyn I take it you mean "sympathy" not apathy. Huge sweeping statement. Quadraplegics on disability pension - just do something about your own poverty! Disadvantaged populations the world over - you only have yourselves to blame! Come on - its not that simple!!!! Seeing people like Steven Hawkings, Steady Eddy, Christopher Reeves and a whole host of other people with 'disability' do what sometimes we can not definately indicates that we all have some measure of control over our destiny. Coming from an extremely poor background myself from a third world country I know how blessed I have been by coming over here and making something of myself. But equally I have seen others been just as blessed waste it all away. It's sometimes just too easy to blame your situation. Re: Apathy/Miserliness in Design 68Jun 25, 2008 9:27 am Yes, I take your point, joeybgh, but at the same time its sometimes too easy to absolve ourselves of a social concience but saying other people could just take control of themselves.
Like with most complex issues there is no simple answer. If only world poverty was that easily solved. Re: Apathy/Miserliness in Design 69Jun 25, 2008 9:41 am **Phoenix** I was going to post this earlier in the day but delayed my response, so now in retrospect, i think i should have posted what i originally wrote, which was: ... I think we just need to respect that we all have different priorities and ideals in life and of course with the houses we choose ... I posted something similar to this early on ... Duminda Different strokes for different folks ... it all depends on what each person wants out of life, and what their dreams and hopes are. Some want a nice house, others want to live in a nice suburb and some others couldn't care less about either ... their dream might be to buy a boat, travel the world, work less or even do charity work. All deserve the same respect IMO. ... didn't do much to stop what followed. Re: Apathy/Miserliness in Design 70Jun 25, 2008 10:09 am What exactly followed? I don't understand the problem. I honestly don't. A post was put up. People reacted. Rightly in my OPINION. I'm still entitled to that right? Or is that only for other people?
If there was to be no discussion. WHY POST ON A FORUM????? I'll comment on what I believe in. I'll comment about what I think. So should everyone else if they so desire. I'm sorry, but people can't keep defending Fiona's right to her opinion and not defend the rights of those that then offered opinions in response. Which way is it people? Are we ALL entitled to opinions or are NONE of us entitled? There's only two choices. If we're all entitled, what's the problem? You don't want to stir debate? Fine, don't put up a provocative post! If we're not entitled, shut the forum down now. Get out your dictionaries and look up forum. Pretty much what happened here yesterday in my OPINION!! You're damned right I still have one!! Jo I leave you to fend for yourself, figure things out yourself. Terrence Malick Re: Apathy/Miserliness in Design 71Jun 25, 2008 11:09 am This thread is a hard one. But i am inclined to agree with Jo. Fiona posted a topic which was very controversial, whether she realised it was or not is another thing. When I initially read the post, it sounded like she was attacking most of us who were building and posting on here about our selections. Fiona probably didnt mean what it sounded like, but it's hard to tell when it's all written as you do not get a tone as you would if you were to speak to people in person.
Therefore, if she is able to express her opinion, I would like to think that we can all express ours. Obviously some of us didnt like her opinion, just like she didnt like some of ours. This has been an interesting thread, I have followed it very closely. This is a forum, we are all here to help and challenge one another, and i think the thread has done that, to some respect. Re: Apathy/Miserliness in Design 72Jun 25, 2008 12:02 pm I think the tone of Fiona's original post has been misread! I didn't find what she said to be provocative or contraversial at all! I actually didn't think anyone would disagree that western society often lives wastefully and to excess and I didn't think there would be anyone who hasn't felt guilty about the priveledged position most of us find ourselves in compared to many. She didn't say we are all evil and thoughtless nor did she say we didn't have a right to pursue our individual hapiness (whatever that may be) Like everyone here I have also worked hard for what I have and have worked hard to hopefully be in a position to provide my children everything they will need - that most certainly doesn't mean I have a right to be wasteful (and yes I understand this is a subjective term but Fiona, like all of us has decided where she draws the line in terms of excess - it may be different to where you have drawn yours but whoopee) as in my opinion that would be disrespectful to those who regardless of how hard they work will never be in the position I am. Re: Apathy/Miserliness in Design 73Jun 25, 2008 12:53 pm I’m not impressed!
I’m going to take a good look through this post tonight, and see where it lost its momentum! How many people……including myself, have come on the forum and made comments that didn’t relate to squat! Who cares what the next person thinks or says….its their thoughts, not yours, so don’t be so defensive……it’s called a public forum! Internal and External Building and Colour Consultant Online - Worldwide http://www.denovoconcepts.com Re: Apathy/Miserliness in Design 74Jun 25, 2008 2:35 pm I can see alot of truth in different people's arguments.
I agree that there is no need for personal attacks on Fiona or anyone else. I agree that this is a public forum and people should have the right to an opinion, I also then agree with Jo when she said, that if this is the case then people also have the right to disagree with the original posters opinion. I think Fiona meant to make a statement about how SHE feels, but by using phrases like 'we' she has mistakingly included all of us in the way she thinks about spending money, it's no biggie though As I said before, I do feel sorry for people in poor financial situations, but I can honestly say I am not 'charitable' enough to give up on my dream of having a big beautiful home for my family to live in. Does this make me a bad person? No, and I don't think that is what Fiona was trying to say either.... My karma ran over your dogma Re: Apathy/Miserliness in Design 75Jun 25, 2008 3:01 pm joles What exactly followed? To clarify ... I was referring to the attacks and the harshness, NOT the opinions themselves or the debate. Re: Apathy/Miserliness in Design 76Jun 25, 2008 3:28 pm I'm sorry I still can't see the attacks. For people to point out what they percieve as hypocrisy is not an attack. There was nothing that I thought was personal. There were examples used to demonstrate a point, but I don't believe they were personal.
Before I get jumped on, I said percieved hypocrisy. I accept Fiona's explaination of what she was trying to say, but I have read and reread her initial post and it still comes across as an attack on those of us building. That may have not have been the intent but that was the outcome. So maybe the big lesson here is hit the preview button and reread what we've written before we post? I always do that. I'm prepared for the consequences of anything I have written and more than willing to discuss any issue anyone has with me. But I believe Fiona has to accept that the wording of her initial post was what began the discussion. At the end of the day we are all adults and I would have thought and hoped that a bit of debate, even heated debate, would be embraced and appreciated for what it is. Healthy. Jo I leave you to fend for yourself, figure things out yourself. Terrence Malick Re: Apathy/Miserliness in Design 77Jun 25, 2008 3:45 pm Well Fiona was told to get down off her soapbox, told her post was pointless twice (with rolling eye emoticon) and then when she got angry shown a picture of a box of tissues. I agree a forum is a place for people to air their opinions but even the unpopular opinions deserve to be treated and responded to respectfully. Re: Apathy/Miserliness in Design 78Jun 25, 2008 3:49 pm I have ONLY just read the whole thread, when it was first put up, it didn’t interest me so I didn’t read it. It has since been brought to my attention from another moderator!
In reading Fiona’s first post, I must say, my mouth dropped…..but then I laughed! At no point did I feel I needed to justify myself, my spending and how I live to her at all! And at no point did she expect me to! And I still don’t feel I need to tell you all what I do with my money….. Yes her post could have been worded slightly better, but I knew what she was trying to say. Look at it from my point of view; she really slapped what I do in the face!!!!! My chosen profession that I have worked hard for, for 13 years!!!! Did I care…….nope! Is it a full moon????? Internal and External Building and Colour Consultant Online - Worldwide http://www.denovoconcepts.com Re: Apathy/Miserliness in Design 79Jun 25, 2008 3:55 pm Ok, the soapbox one fine. There was a lot of people wondering what the point was of the post because as I said it came across as an attack. People will respond strongly when they feel attacked.
In regards to Al's tissues, perhaps if Fiona had come on and responded more rationally to the conversation that was going on it wouldn't have happened. Possibly accepted some responsibility? It is not very adult to offer a box of tissues, but by the same token it is not very adult to storm off because people didn't agree with your comments. I agree with you about being respectful but the initial post did not come across as having much respect for any of us. We completely disagree on this Sharee but I'm really glad we can have an open conversation about our disagreement. Feels pretty good to me. I leave you to fend for yourself, figure things out yourself. Terrence Malick Re: Apathy/Miserliness in Design 80Jun 25, 2008 4:01 pm joles We completely disagree on this Sharee but I'm really glad we can have an open conversation about our disagreement. Feels pretty good to me. That we do totally agree on Obviously tone can't be conveyed on a forum, so maybe everyone needs to give others the benefit of the doubt (on both sides) and allow them to explain themselves before getting offended? Once you know the basics, the rest is easy. Read my post in the thread linked below. viewtopic.php?p=1919271#p1919271 2 19522 Although I am a big opponent of using waffle pod slabs over H2/P soils under any circumstances, in your case I would certainly opt in to keep piers under central… 1 2433 Landscape Design Parramatta We have been doing a large amount of landscape design work in Sydney… 0 3 |