Browse Forums General Discussion 1 Jul 17, 2014 5:08 pm What happens if a Builder does work on a renovation that is not on the domestic building contract/specifications (plans) or a variation order and is not work you asked them to do - and there are problems?
Also, can you take a builder to VCAT for breaching the Consumer Law legislation? Any advice appreciated. TIA. Re: Builders and work done not on contract - advice needed 2Jul 17, 2014 8:32 pm I wish I could help you kats_meow - what a mess! Have you tried contacting Boutique Lawyers on the forum here: http://www.homeone.com.au/member/boutiquelawyers Was the work carried out after January 1 2011? If it was, then in my humble opinion the consumer guarantees which were introduced into Australian Consumer Law at that point would apply here. In particular the consumer guarantee of due care and skill - Consumer Affairs Victoria has this on their website: Suppliers guarantee their services will be provided with due care and skill. This means they must: use an acceptable level of skill or technical knowledge when providing the services, and take all necessary care to avoid loss or damage when providing the services. For example: A consumer hires a painter to paint her house. Before starting the job, the painter does not remove all of the old, flaking paint. Six months later, the new paint starts to flake. The painter has not met the ‘due care and skill’ guarantee, as he did not use a level of skill that would be expected of a reasonable painter. While painting the consumer’s house, the painter knocks over a can of paint, which spills over her newly paved driveway. The painter has not met the guarantee and must fix the damage. But you really need some proper legal advice. Re: Builders and work done not on contract - advice needed 3Jul 17, 2014 8:58 pm Have you checked the builders registration? 3in1 Supadiverta. Rainwater Harvesting Best Practice using syphonic drainage. Cleaner Neater Smarter Cheaper Supa Gutter Pumper. A low cost syphonic eaves gutter overflow solution. Re: Builders and work done not on contract - advice needed 5Jul 18, 2014 8:00 am Hi kats_meow, I'm no lawyer so you really need some legal advice. All I can tell you is what I find on government websites. We are in approximately the same situation with somebody we hired. The "contract" was agreed on in 2010 but the service was provided in 2011 so this is something I need to chase up as well when I get a chance. What consumer affairs says is that goods and services bought prior to 1 January 2011 come under the previous consumer protection law called the Trade Practices Act. This still talks about "due care and skill" but if exactly the same rights applied it would be hard to see why they would need to bring a new law! I might send a PM to Boutique lawyers myself to see if they can clear this one up for us. Re: Builders and work done not on contract - advice needed 6Jul 18, 2014 11:15 am According to the ACCC legislation from prior to 2011 - Trade Practices Act - can be used when it comes to the contract as signed in 2010 and the ACL pertains to any work done on the renovation from the beginning of 2011. I find it interesting that at VCAT Trade Practices and ACL legislation is not used? Can anyone provide light on that? Re: Builders and work done not on contract - advice needed 8Jul 18, 2014 7:17 pm kats_meow What happens if a Builder does work on a renovation that is not on the domestic building contract/specifications (plans) or a variation order and is not work you asked them to do - and the work done is unprofessional and not workmanlike? That is, the work has created defects on the property. The work was done without the owner's consent and done without their knowledge. I understand that to take it to VCAT (Victoria consumer tribunal) you can only refer to the contract and defective/incomplete work so how do you go about getting the issue remedied? Work includes a door entry which is now on an angle (door will not shut) and flooring and skirting removed and then replaced with defective work and inferior products. When asked to remedy the work the Builder has refused. Also, can you take a builder to VCAT for breaching the Consumer Law legislation? Ie deceptive/misleading representations, unsatisfactory work, defective work, harassment (ie menacing clients to pay progress payments before work done and to pay tradespeople in cash even though their work was covered in the contract) etc???? Any advice appreciated. TIA. You wrote "I understand that to take it to VCAT (Victoria consumer tribunal) you can only refer to the contract and defective/incomplete work so how do you go about getting the issue remedied? " Wrong! If builder does not follow, contract, plans and specification it is a defect and you can take it to VCAT Foremost Building Expert in Australia,assisting with building problems/disputes, building stage inspections,pre-contract review advice for peace of mind 200 blogs http://www.buildingexpert.net.au/blog Re: Builders and work done not on contract - advice needed 9Jul 19, 2014 8:11 am That is why i was wondering if consumer law would help as consumers should be able to get a refund or compensation for services provided that do not fit what they wanted in the end result.
Re: Builders and work done not on contract - advice needed 10Jul 19, 2014 5:34 pm kats_meow But say a floor is done so that it is not level - and obviously not level (ie furniture in the room has to be propped up, decor shakes when people are in the room). You take that issue to VCAT and it will be evidenced that the levels are within "tolerances" and "standards" and therefore not a defect. You won't get compensation for that. The builder says it was like that before they worked on it and it is the fault of previous restumping etc, no-one can "prove" that that weren't problems before hand, although the client knows there were no problems with the original floor (ie no leveling issues). Now they are left with an unlevel floor that is not considered a defect, they won't get compensation for it because tolerances and standards say the Builder is allowed to build an unlevel floor by so many cms. And this work was done without the consent of the client - no variation or in the contract or plans - they were not informed of the work. Then how can you claim it under building and contract regulations? That is why i was wondering if consumer law would help as consumers should be able to get a refund or compensation for services provided that do not fit what they wanted in the end result. I am a declared enemy of Guide to Standards and Tolerances because it is just a Builder's Bible "Book of Excuses" for poor workmanship. There is enough protection for the homeowner in DBCA1995 and if you have a genuine case you should be successful in VCAT. However you will ned someone with expertise to assess the defects prepare reports and give expert evidence and it comes down to quality of the evidence. From what you have written you had no one with expertise to look after you during the build. Have you got a dilapidation report? Foremost Building Expert in Australia,assisting with building problems/disputes, building stage inspections,pre-contract review advice for peace of mind 200 blogs http://www.buildingexpert.net.au/blog Re: Builders and work done not on contract - advice needed 11Jul 20, 2014 9:37 am To give a clear answer, I need to know what work was contracted, what extra was done and not on contract, age of the house and type of house, ie, brick and tile or stump and stud wall. A contracting company can not be held responsible for defects that are not related to work that they have done or were contracted for. If your house has shifted due to a problem that is not related to the work completed, but, does directly effect the work completed, the builder is not responsible. I believe that there is more to the problem than you are telling us. To give you a definitive answer to your question, you must provide more details, provide the whole story, not just part... steve@everlastpatios.com.au www.everlastpatios.com.au Re: Builders and work done not on contract - advice needed 12Jul 20, 2014 11:50 am Steve - House is Edwardian. Previous to work by the Builder there were no problems with the floors - reasonably level, no defective floors, restumping done at regular intervals. Now each floor that the Builder has worked on is uneven (ie furniture has to be propped up to be level, fireplaces had to be redone as they became crooked after the work) and there is evidence that the Builder tried to cover up problems with the floor. Floors not touche dby Builder are fine. Sub floor work done by the Builder has been found to be defective. Doors do not close and some door jams are built on weird angles. The builder was not contracted to do some of the flooring work - however they removed flooring without variations and then lots of money asked for to repair the work done. Contracted work to repair sub floor problems was paid for but not done or not done well. House has timber floors and is weatherboard. Contract was to add an extension and work on some current rooms whcih had a change of purpose (ie replace ceilings, plastering, close/replace doorways etc). floors are not level in the old part of the house (where worked on by Builder) and floors are unlevel in the new part of the house. One floor paid to Builder to do was completely removed and now has about 5cm difference on one side so floor is now a ramp. Also work was done on rotting frames which would have been obvious to Builder (client not aware of this at the time until independent building inspection). Plastering is also on weird angles, badly repaired gap work, excess plaster used to try and hide problems. Skirting was cut by Builder to make floors look level ie skirting cut thin for areas where the floor was too high- but didn't work. Because of threats by the Builder, don't want to get into too much detail on the Internet so sorry if the story isn't too detailed. Building Expert, have building inspection reports and will ask legal team about need for dilapidation report. Also, no VCAT Facebook page? Re: Builders and work done not on contract - advice needed 13Jul 20, 2014 12:25 pm kats_meow Building Expert, have building inspection reports and will ask legal team about need for dilapidation report. Also, no VCAT Facebook page? If you already have building reports then your consultant should be able to guide you in all the matters you have posted here, in relation to contract, tolerances,builder's threats etc. Dilapidation report is usually done before work starts. It records condition and state of your home before work begins so as to minimise likelihood of dispute. I used to do them when I was building but now do dilapidation reports for builders/developers that don't want to be blamed for existing cracks to neighbouring properties. Have you or your builder had one done? You wrote" Also, no VCAT Facebook page?" what do you mean by that? Foremost Building Expert in Australia,assisting with building problems/disputes, building stage inspections,pre-contract review advice for peace of mind 200 blogs http://www.buildingexpert.net.au/blog Re: Builders and work done not on contract - advice needed 14Jul 21, 2014 8:36 am BuildingExp, the facebook remark was in response to another poster - sorry. The building inspectors haven't been so great. I do recommend now to people thinking of renovating etc to get a condition report, or as you put it a dilapidation report so thanks for that terminology. It was not done prior to the build although the builder made written promises to advice of any problems on site ie floors, walls etc. Prior inspection (before work commenced) reports did not go into that level of detail. 1) I had requested R6 ceiling insualtion batts, however I noticed that on some areas there are huge gaps which will allow hot air to sweep in, and also noticed black/grey… 0 3604 I work with owner, he/she is my man on the ground and I instruct them when to visit the site and take photos and I have other tools in the bag. 4 15284 I am in the same situation, would you be able to give some insights in to this? I am in SA 8 17063 |