Browse Forums General Discussion Re: Guide To Standards and Tolerances 21Mar 17, 2014 4:13 pm The latest Choice mag has some very interesting information regarding Builders Warranty Insurance. http://www.choice.com.au/reviews-and-tests/money/insurance/personal/home-warranty-insurance.aspx This might need pay per view for non Choice Members. One fact 2010-2011 homeowners paid $87.8 million, but only $108,000 was paid out. The Building Compliance Reform Association site http://www.bcra.asn.au Re: Guide To Standards and Tolerances 23Mar 17, 2014 9:31 pm tezzab The latest Choice mag has some very interesting information regarding Builders Warranty Insurance. One fact 2010-2011 homeowners paid $87.8 million, but only $108,000 was paid out. Where did the rest go? 3in1 Supadiverta. Rainwater Harvesting Best Practice using syphonic drainage. Cleaner Neater Smarter Cheaper Supa Gutter Pumper. A low cost syphonic eaves gutter overflow solution. Re: Guide To Standards and Tolerances 24Mar 17, 2014 9:53 pm the article didn't seem to extend that far into investigative journalistic practice As an Insurance Company is involved, I'd really not want to presume or insinuate anything, at this time. I hope others may elaborate though. got me thinking though, Speeding/ sorry Safety Camera fines go to Consolidated Revenue, not to making Safer Roads It may even partly fund VBA or HIA ?? Re: Guide To Standards and Tolerances 25Mar 18, 2014 4:52 am The text below is taken from the Victorian Managed Insurance Authority (VMIA) website. http://www.vmia.vic.gov.au/ "Since 31 May 2010, the Victorian Managed Insurance Authority (VMIA) has offered domestic building insurance in Victoria, at the direction of the Victorian Government." The Victorian Managed Insurance Authority (VMIA) is a Public Financial Corporation (Government agency) established on 1 October 1996 as the ‘captive insurer’ for the State of Victoria. A statutory body, whose operations are governed by the Victorian Managed Insurance Authority Act 1996, VMIA reports to The Hon Robert Clark, Minister for Finance, Attorney-General and and Minister for Industrial Relations in the Victorian Government. Busy boy! "captive insurer". Hmmm! 3in1 Supadiverta. Rainwater Harvesting Best Practice using syphonic drainage. Cleaner Neater Smarter Cheaper Supa Gutter Pumper. A low cost syphonic eaves gutter overflow solution. Re: Guide To Standards and Tolerances 26Mar 18, 2014 8:55 am That's classic isn't it. I read that article and another part states " Over the same timeframe, about 250,000 Victorians suffered damage at the hands of Victorian home builders." Yet they only paid out $108,000 ! That just shows how ludicrous the situation is with the building industry in Australia. Stewie Re: Guide To Standards and Tolerances 27Mar 18, 2014 9:15 am 66 cents each buys half a donut. 250,000 Victorians sounds a lot though; what time frame was it? They state 1 year, that can't be right. 3in1 Supadiverta. Rainwater Harvesting Best Practice using syphonic drainage. Cleaner Neater Smarter Cheaper Supa Gutter Pumper. A low cost syphonic eaves gutter overflow solution. Re: Guide To Standards and Tolerances 28Mar 18, 2014 10:21 am SaveH2O I mentioned contract in reference to you posting "If Standards were not mentioned in legislation, they they would have no standing, as they would not be enforceable." My post in reply was to convey that an un-mandated Standard can be used and is enforceable if written into a contract.... What i meant by enforceable was regulatory enforcement. Standards written into a contract condition are not enforced by regulatory authorities. Contract law is not about enforcement, its about ensuring each party gets what they were promised, or compensation in leiu. In this context, a Standard mentioned in a contract clause is just a promise that something will be built to that Standard. Re: Guide To Standards and Tolerances 29Mar 18, 2014 11:43 am SaveH20, that would be for all complaints I'm sure ranging a from a scratch on an architrave to serious structural problems on multi million dollar homes and everything in between. I'd love to see a breakdown though of all 250,000. Stewie Re: Guide To Standards and Tolerances 30Mar 18, 2014 2:39 pm Stewie D that would be for all complaints I'm sure ranging a from a scratch on an architrave to serious structural problems The total of individual item complaints rather than 250,000 persons per year in Victoria makes more sense. How many houses do they build in Victoria every year, 60,000 - 70,000? 3in1 Supadiverta. Rainwater Harvesting Best Practice using syphonic drainage. Cleaner Neater Smarter Cheaper Supa Gutter Pumper. A low cost syphonic eaves gutter overflow solution. Re: Guide To Standards and Tolerances 31Mar 18, 2014 3:14 pm qebtel What i meant by enforceable was regulatory enforcement. Standards written into a contract condition are not enforced by regulatory authorities. Contract law is not about enforcement, its about ensuring each party gets what they were promised, or compensation in leiu. In this context, a Standard mentioned in a contract clause is just a promise that something will be built to that Standard. The use of standards is by choice unless they have been mandated by Government or included in a contract. An Australian Standard or an amendment to an Australian Standard has no legal effect in terms of the BCA unless that specific Standard or amendment is referenced by the BCA. The BCA is the primary document. If the contract references Australian Standards as DTS, those Standards can be called up but the BCA has hierarchy. The Standard Building Regulations 1993, Division 3 - BCA, Subsection 10 state: "for any subject matter within BCA, any provision of an Australian Standard that also deals with the subject matter applies only so far as it expressly adopted by the BCA". The above can be confirmed by referencing Clause A1.4 of the BCA. If any of the above has been recently superseded, can somebody please post the applicable current regulations. 3in1 Supadiverta. Rainwater Harvesting Best Practice using syphonic drainage. Cleaner Neater Smarter Cheaper Supa Gutter Pumper. A low cost syphonic eaves gutter overflow solution. Re: Guide To Standards and Tolerances 32Mar 18, 2014 6:32 pm You could add NCC to the hierarchy, http://www.abcb.gov.au/en/about-the-national-construction-code/the-ncc-performance-based-code http://www.abcb.gov.au/en/about-the-national-construction-code/the-building-code-of-australia/hierarchy-of-the-performance-based-bca http://www.abcb.gov.au/en/about-the-national-construction-code/the-plumbing-code-of-australia/hierarchy-of-the-performance-based-pca not that I've read it. Re: Guide To Standards and Tolerances 33Mar 18, 2014 7:10 pm tezzab You could add NCC to the hierarchy, Correct. Australian Standards only figure in hierarchy if they have been brought into the contract or referenced as DTS. The order of hierarchy is: Building Act. Building Regulations. NCC. Australian Standards. qebtel Contract law is not about enforcement, its about ensuring each party gets what they were promised, or compensation in leiu. In this context, a Standard mentioned in a contract clause is just a promise that something will be built to that Standard. Because an Australian Standard has been referenced in a contract does not mean that a house will be built to that Standard. 3in1 Supadiverta. Rainwater Harvesting Best Practice using syphonic drainage. Cleaner Neater Smarter Cheaper Supa Gutter Pumper. A low cost syphonic eaves gutter overflow solution. Re: Guide To Standards and Tolerances 34Mar 18, 2014 10:19 pm [/quote] Because an Australian Standard has been referenced in a contract does not mean that a house will be built to that Standard.[/quote] I have a different interpretation DBCA1995 section8 Implied Warranties: (c) The builder warrants that the work will be carried out in accordance with, and will comply with, all laws and legal requirements including, without limiting the generality of this warranty, the Building Act 1993 and the regulations made under that Act 5; In my view that is explicit promise that it will be done, so if the standard is referenced it must be built to at least that standard or it's a breach of warranty and a defect. Foremost Building Expert in Australia,assisting with building problems/disputes, building stage inspections,pre-contract review advice for peace of mind 200 blogs http://www.buildingexpert.net.au/blog Re: Guide To Standards and Tolerances 35Mar 18, 2014 10:54 pm The BCA is the primary document, protected by hierarchy. The Australian Standards (AS) are referenced as Deemed To Satisfy (DTS). As such, they can either be never, selectively or fully called up during the building process. Either way, the house is required to be built to the mandated BCA requirements. Building a house to a required 'standard' is a different terminology to building it to an Australian Standard. Many Australian Standards differ substantially to the BCA but the AS are still DTS. Note my use of a capital S in Standard to identify Standard as a proper noun. Note for others reading this thread: The National Construction Code (NCC) brings together the Building Code of Australia (BCA) volumes 1 & 2 and the Plumbing Code of Australia (PCA) volume 3. 3in1 Supadiverta. Rainwater Harvesting Best Practice using syphonic drainage. Cleaner Neater Smarter Cheaper Supa Gutter Pumper. A low cost syphonic eaves gutter overflow solution. Re: Guide To Standards and Tolerances 36Mar 19, 2014 6:27 am You are correct because more than one way to comply with building control is possible: 1 DTS 2 Higher standard 3 Alternative solution 4 Appeal to BAB 5 Exemption via schedule 8 of Building Regulations However I meant that (in the absence of 2-5 above) if DTS calls up AS then it must be built to at least that AS standard Foremost Building Expert in Australia,assisting with building problems/disputes, building stage inspections,pre-contract review advice for peace of mind 200 blogs http://www.buildingexpert.net.au/blog Re: Guide To Standards and Tolerances 37Mar 19, 2014 9:05 am That is correct. Of interest, a murky area is the BCA's 'performance requirement' (section 2 of the BCA). The NSW High Front Guttering Advisory Committee Report that was presented to Parliament about 3 years ago immediately comes to mind. This Committee was set up (with reluctance) following the fiasco where manufacturers were supplying high fronted guttering with a non compliant clip system that allowed the gutter to overflow back into the wall cavity. Huge numbers of houses were fitted with this system. I posted several news items about this earlier in the thread. The guttering clip system was not restricted to NSW. During the inquiry, several NSW Department of Fair Trading inspectors were instructed to randomly choose and inspect display homes for roof drainage compliance. Of the 35 display homes selected, 34 were found to be not compliant with AS/NZS 3500.3:2003 Stormwater Drainage. AS/NZS 3500.3:2003 is a BCA DTS referenced document. However, most of the houses were nevertheless found to be compliant with the BCA's 'Performance Requirement'! I quote from the inquiry report. EXECUTIVE SUMMARY - page 4. In undertaking the brief, the review focused primarily on compliance with BCA performance requirements (in Section 2 of the BCA) – being the only mandatory requirements in the BCA. For high fronted guttering the main requirement of interest is to keep water out of the building based on a 100 year Annual Recurrent Interval (ARI) rain event. Such performance requirements aim to be non-prescriptive – they tell designers and installers the outcome that must be achieved but avoid prescribing how to actually achieve it. Information and advice on options for achieving the performance requirements is reserved for the “Building Solutions” level of the BCA’s compliance hierarchy. This level contains a variety of Deemed to Satisfy solutions where individuals can choose which they prefer to use on a project by project basis. Such solutions include the BCA’s own “Acceptable Construction Practice” (in section 3 of the BCA) and Australian Standards AS3500.3/3500.5. These options provide a more prescriptive level of detail about how to construct guttering in a way that can meet BCA performance requirements. Operation Flow- A NSW Fair Trading Study of the Building Code of Compliance on Display Homes Pages 17-18. NSW Fair Trading Inspectors through Operation Flow appraised a range of display homes in mid-2010 throughout NSW (35 in total), concerning their compliance with BCA performance requirements and AS3500 requirements. The main focus was on the number of downpipes and for evidence of overflow measures. Visual inspections of eaves linings and, where it was possible, internal walls and ceilings were conducted for signs of damage through water ingress into the building as a result of overflow. NSW Fair Trading wrote to builders seeking advice on how they conformed to AS3500 requirements (Note: albeit that this is only one means of meeting BCA performance requirements). Not all had responded at the time of completing this report. Inspectors, through their calculations, advised of widespread under-design of downpipes to meet the AS3500 20 year ARI requirements in the homes appraised. For a small number of homes they also noted signs of water damage to eaves linings, but the causes were not precisely quantified. Inspectors advised that all homes except for one were not compliant with AS3500 in regard to the adequate provision of downpipes, but then made the additional observations that the majority were compliant with BCA performance requirements i.e. as a result of lack of evidence of water damage from gutter overflow. And further down page 18... The audit report also found that AS3500.3 provides more rather than less downpipes and guttering than the BCA’s own “Acceptable Construction Practice” for the 20 year ARI. It would seem that the latter, in general, provides a more lenient basis for meeting BCA performance requirements. http://www.fairtrading.nsw.gov.au/pdfs/ ... report.pdf 3in1 Supadiverta. Rainwater Harvesting Best Practice using syphonic drainage. Cleaner Neater Smarter Cheaper Supa Gutter Pumper. A low cost syphonic eaves gutter overflow solution. Building Standards; Getting It Right! Don't think they are designed for double brick. WA has a particular way of building and unfortunately that's the way a large amount of sills are finished. 3 7014 I believe this is correct. From the picture you can see the power was put in last so the electrician knew where the water was. Really it's a common sense issue more… 4 5162 2 8649 |