Browse Forums General Discussion 1 May 20, 2008 9:53 am Hi,
I've decided to sell my home in Melbourne which i've owned for 3 years, however the catch is that I got a local carpenter to do a loft conversion which included installing a staircase and 3 skylights. I didn't get planning or building permits at the time and now understand these are required so I'm now considering my options, here's what I can see: 1. Get the plans drawn up now and apply for the permits. I've been told this could take 3+months and cost $15,000+. 2. Don't get permits but inform interested buyers of the situation (althought this could be difficult at auction). I understand that with this option the buyer could pull out at any time prior to settlement, I also imagine they could sue me later, although a conveyancer told me that wasn't the case (which I find hard to believe?). 3. Don't get the permits, and don't mention anything to the buyer. Same problems as described in no.2, I imagine. 4. Get plans drawn up for some other proposed (fictional) new work, which includes a reference to the loft. This is suggested by the carpenter and apparently allows us to claim it was there before we bought the place. I'd like to go with option 1, but am practically broke at the moment (hence selling the house). So I'm considering option 2. It's worth mentioning that who ever buys the house will almost certainly need to emabark on some major renovations as the kitchen is in a very poor state and replacement will mean significant changes to the back half of the house. So my questions: Would you buy a house with under these terms? Have you encountered these circumstances before? Any other options or advice? Thanks, B Re: Buying house with un-permitted renovation? 2May 20, 2008 10:50 am bl0w Any other options or advice? Thanks, B I think I would be very very careful about posting this sort of information on a public forum......... Simon Building an architect designed home out of Insulated Concrete Forms on acreage in semi-rural SE Melbourne. Developer approval obtained, engineering complete, getting quotes Re: Buying house with un-permitted renovation? 3May 20, 2008 10:57 am The Dynamic Duo bl0w Any other options or advice? Thanks, B I think I would be very very careful about posting this sort of information on a public forum......... Simon Yeah...I think you've neatly summarised a brief for a solicitor.... mmm....donuts Homer Simpson 1956- Links: Site Costs Ready Reckoner | H1 Addiction Medical Advice | Château TDL: The Backyard Re: Buying house with un-permitted renovation? 4May 20, 2008 12:46 pm What you've described happens all the time and while the legal complexities are problematic, my advice is that you sell the house as is - complete with illegal building works and be up front about it (as you have to on your section 32) - or not at all.
You will take a selling price hit for the illegal building work - but you just need to get over it. That is, if you don't like the price you can get then don't sell. Unfortunately you are paying the price now for trying to save money earlier on. Many agents simply ignore this stuff, hence they are happy to list your property and they always play dumb when an educated buyer starts asking the right questions. Believe me, I see it all the time. Bottom line, if you must sell then sell as is - if you can't sell then PM me and I might have some other options for you. Builders are people too.... Re: Buying house with un-permitted renovation? 5May 20, 2008 12:48 pm You wouldn't need a permit for a skylight.
Stairs on the other hand I'm not sure.....you haven't changed the roofline or anything and haven't removed any walls etc. But you have added weight into the roof space, that may not have been designed for it in the first place. Therefore permit may be required. Oh...permits do not cost 15k to get. Couple of hundred to apply and a cost based on what the works are worth. Draftsman..allow up to a grand but shouldn't be anything near that. If structural, may need computations which equals some money. Personally, apply for a permit, tell them a chippie did the work, and as long as it's not *******, you should be ok. Worst case, remove the staircase and fill the hole. Good luck. Re: Buying house with un-permitted renovation? 6May 20, 2008 1:06 pm Al, I think you are half right but really, if they need planning and building permits then this is a nightmare as it is very difficult to 'unscramble the egg'.
Not only do all the drawings need to be done but various 'expert' reports will need to be submitted to verify the work as is eg: engineer and building surveyor at a minimum and this can all be very costly, especially if you have to dismantle anything so they can see what you've done! Added to which, if anything needs to change (for example if the floor joists are undersize) then you will need to pay to fix all of that, as well as get it certified again most likely. The drawings and documentation required for planning permits these days are horrendous - not to mention the delays. Depending where you are it could easily take 6 months and that is even if there are no objections. If it were just a simple building permit then I would agree with you wholeheartedly but not with planning as well. Too hard for a vendor to deal with but a buyer, once they are aware of the illegal works can purchase at their risk. In any event bl0w, perhaps get a few quotes for all these plans, permits, reports and documentation before a decision is made as it could easily be a very expensive and frustrating exercise. My gut feeling is that direction rather than simple and easy. Builders are people too.... Re: Buying house with un-permitted renovation? 7May 20, 2008 1:43 pm First step is I would call up council or building legislation people in your state and pretend you are looking to buy a house which may have illegal building and find out what your rights are as a builder, so you will know what may come back to you from a buyer later.
If that makes sense? Re: Buying house with un-permitted renovation? 9May 20, 2008 9:13 pm i would do an internet search because i dont know the answer. local councils have their policy on website. failing that, ring and ask. many people find themselves in situations as either buyers, sellers or renovators where something has happened in a home that they didnt know wasnt permitted. on another note, ive seen tonnes of listings for real estate where they just state the condition of the home,and people buy it anyway. ie: termites, built in under not legal height. maybe get legal advice? Re: Buying house with un-permitted renovation? 10May 21, 2008 4:29 pm I can't believe the chippy went ahead and did it without an engineers. If the loft collapses he is in such deep trouble.
I don't know about plans/permits or council requirements as such however it is noted that it wasn't designed by an engineer. It is important to get the permits and relevant paperwork from the engineers. Yes the roof line was not moved but the house was not engineered for a loft, thus without the engineers you would be unsure if it is indeed load bearing, and sufficiently so. If I were to buy this house from you and the loft collapsed, simply put, I would sue on negligence. Re: Buying house with un-permitted renovation? 11Jun 04, 2008 11:43 am Quote: Wait 4 more years until you sell it. If the council doesn't pick it up in seven years, it can stay. There’s a point Al, but how do you prove how long it’s been there? When I bought my place, the section32 had a plan of the land, boundaries easements etc. but nothing about what was built on it. When I got some drainage plans from the council, it showed an outline of the house, but no carport or veranda, even though both look like they have been there 30years. Re: Buying house with un-permitted renovation? 12Dec 14, 2020 6:30 pm Have you already found a moving company? You should think of this in advance not to have problems during the process. Check out some options here californiamoversusa.com, I used their services several times, can recommend them for sure. Yeah I don't know why I came to a forum. Place is full of wierdos/pedos thought internet may help but I suppose I'll try my luck with someone in person. Cheers. I tried… 0 6438 Hello Josh, This is Irving from PRIMA, we are a manufacturer of the staircase, railings, kitchen cabinets, windows, doors from China. If you have requirement to purchase… 0 5456 Coming back to your old stomping grounds, huh? Renovations on a budget can be quite the journey. It's like giving your house a new lease on life. The twist of not knowing… 1 3475 |