Browse Forums General Discussion 1 Feb 02, 2011 11:34 am hi, we were going to do a home renovation late last year with one of the loacl builders (who is also our next door neighbour). we received the contracts and before signing them, we decided not to do the extension, as we didnt think it was worth the money. We let the builder know straight away and gave them back the x 3 copies of UNSIGNED contracts they had given to us. We have just received a Bill from the builder for quite a large sum. i have been told that because we had not signed the contracts, therefore we are not liable for any fees relating to the extension. and because the contracts were returned to the builder we dont hold any information on the contract. I have contacted Master Builder Association of Victoria, unfortunately they have not been very helpful. does anybody know if we should have to pay this large invoice, for something that never took place and was unsigned. Thanks Re: return of unsigned contracts 3Feb 02, 2011 11:47 am I would think that if no contract has been signed then no money would have to be paid. Has any money been paid - if so, perhaps it woudl be understood that this woudl go towrds preparing contracts. In any case, if there were any costs up to this stage they shoudl have been clearly stated (and in writing). I doubt you have any legal or moral obligation to pay anything. Demolition August 2009, Construction Started September 2009, Completed December 2010 Re: return of unsigned contracts 4Feb 02, 2011 12:53 pm Call VCAT and speak to them. What kind of amount or % was the $ figure of the bill of the original contract? Some companies may charge for time and effort in creating the plans etc. 'A bottle of wine contains more philosophy than all the books in the world.' Louis Pasteur Vegie garden: viewtopic.php?f=19&t=27637&start=0 My Backyard Adventure Re: return of unsigned contracts 5Feb 02, 2011 1:09 pm As Lisanne said, you have probably been charged for plans to be drawn and other fees associated with time and admin etc.. which you are liable for and should have been notified of. Its one of the first questions we asked when getting extension quotes. We made it clear we would be spending any money until we were satisfied that each builder could do what we wanted and to our budget. It made it quite hard to get solid info but didn't cost us anything in the end. Things that a builder can charge you for even if you don't have a signed contract are: Planning permits if required to draft building plans. plans soil tests/reports surveys of boundaries and the site. They would obviously need some proof that they acquires these things in order to prepare the contracts or have some communication to say that you authorized them. Re: return of unsigned contracts 6Feb 03, 2011 7:03 am If you didn't realize you would be charged for these and they never told you, then you may have a case for not paying, or paying a reduced amount. In any other business you would be informed up front if you were going to be charged for a quote. Just because there's no signed contract doesn't mean you aren't liable for anything though. For example, you can't eat at a restaurant and then say you won't pay the bill because there's no signed contract. Metricon Riva 33 - http://herlihy-riva.blogspot.com Site start 15/03/2010 - Handover 23/12/2010 9 months and 8 days (284 calendar days) from site start to handover Re: return of unsigned contracts 7Feb 03, 2011 8:35 am I agree, you need to be told about any charges in advance. (Just like prices on a menu). Also, if anything like a soil test was doen and you are charges, then you shoudld get the test report. Demolition August 2009, Construction Started September 2009, Completed December 2010 Re: return of unsigned contracts 8Feb 03, 2011 9:54 am wow, i didnt excpect to get so many replys.....thanks all for your advice. no we werent aware that we would be charged anything if we did not end up going ahead. from my point of view, they hadn't really done alot....they had donre the quote (which the first quote was on a post it not, than we asked for it to be on letterhead, as it had to go to the bank etc) than we received the contracts. No soil tests were done, we paid all for all the plans to be drawn up for the renovation, it had not gone to permit stage yet, so there was nothing drawn up for that. my husband is going to call the builder today and question the invoice. im happy to pay some sort of fee, maybe half of what they are asking. let's see what happens! thanks everyone!! these forums are great!!! Re: return of unsigned contracts 9Feb 03, 2011 11:50 am Don't pay half of what they are asking! If all they've done is put together a quote, even if it took 80 hours, there should be no cost to you. Unless you were specifically told up-front in-writing that there would be a cost and you agreed to that cost in-writing. Businesses submit quotes in the hope of winning business. It's part of the cost of running a business. I would never pay for a quote as it defeats the purpose for getting quotes (at least three). Demolition August 2009, Construction Started September 2009, Completed December 2010 Re: return of unsigned contracts 10Feb 03, 2011 12:49 pm ^^ I agree with Casa. It's awfully nice of you to offer to pay half, but I really don't think you should have to without having agreed to it in writng first! that is the purpose OF a contract, and you didn't sign one. "Your emotions are the slaves to your thoughts, and you are the slave to your emotions." — Elizabeth Gilbert Living in our new house. Currently scaping the land. Re: return of unsigned contracts 11Feb 03, 2011 4:11 pm Have they given you a break down or itemised invoice? They can't just send you a bill saying "You owe us $$$" and not even say what it's for. From what you've said it doesn't seem like you owe anything or if you do it'd be nominal, DEFINITELY question it and don't pay anything just for the sake of it! viewtopic.php?f=31&t=37229 - our Iris 4! Re: return of unsigned contracts 12Feb 04, 2011 7:54 am By the way, if I want X dollars form you and know you're a softy that will pay some of it, even if you shouldn't pay anything, this is what I would do: Ask for 2X. Demolition August 2009, Construction Started September 2009, Completed December 2010 Re: return of unsigned contracts 13Feb 04, 2011 10:44 am I too think that he should itemise what is he charging you for. Then, and only then, you can figure what's fair and what's not. Being so nonchalant as he was ("quote" on a post-it ?!?! ), he should have also disclosed, at least verbally, that he would charge you in case you change your mind. Normally, quotes themselves are free (or should be ). We had some good and some bad experience with this. One landscaper laser measured our levels around the house in order to calculate the work and materials - and his quote was for free. A floor installer, on the other hand, wanted to charge $100 for coming over and quoting (but it would go towards the cost of the job if we went ahead). A few other businesses also have this catch - the "quote" is "free" as long as you go ahead with them - else, they will charge for it (which beats the purpose of getting quotes ... wonder if this is where Oz is heading, or is this a thing of the past still lingering around? ). My signature is distracting people from my wise posts ... Re: return of unsigned contracts 14Feb 04, 2011 12:13 pm I've always liked the quote fee that gets taken off the cost of the job if you go ahead. I should start a business in which I quote twice as much as it really costs and collect $100 per quote. No need to spend too much time or think about it - just roughly double what it should be. And, should I win the job, just subcontract it out. On a more serious note, our entire economy relies on competition. Without it goods and services become more expensive as inefficiencies and greed kick in. The reason you can walk into Bunnings and buy a good $20 drill is because the businesses involved and the entire supply chain are highly competitive. They have taken efficiencies to the maximum (and continue to improve) and cut margins to the minimum required to stay in business. This is great. So what's our part in ensuring efficient business? Get 3 quotes. These quotes need to be at no cost and obligation free. If anyone tries to charge for a quote or puts obligations on you for getting a quote, move on; there are plenty of other businesses with better deals. Oops, time to get off my soap box. Demolition August 2009, Construction Started September 2009, Completed December 2010 Any advice on a builder in NSW who is demanding an extra 22000k after the house is completed and contract paid in full .Standard HIA contract. Never received a variation.… 0 20782 MBA and HIA both have sub contract agreements, check them out 2 7501 Industry type domestic contracts are prepared by industry bodies for the benefit of the builders. This means that if you are the owner watch out. One of the points is… 0 3342 |