Browse Forums General Discussion 1 Jan 18, 2010 8:00 pm This is probably a really stupid question but can someone explain to me what engineering is? Our builder has told us that the engineering report for our block was completed last week yet they only received the results of our soil test today. Does this make any sense? I thought that the engineering stage of the build determines what is required to be done in order to construct a structurally sound building. I assumed this might include the design and type of slab as well as determine the need for any piering etc. Surely this could not be done without the soil test, or could it? Re: what is engineering? 2Jan 18, 2010 8:07 pm Good question But I think we need an engineer to answer this question. calling tdl Where you are coming from is where you are going to... Re: what is engineering? 3Jan 18, 2010 8:38 pm I have the same understanding as you. I rang an engineer today and he asked me what type of house Im building so I explained it to him, and then he asked if we had our soil report and what the classification was and he instantly told me that we couldnt have stumps because of our site class. Im dropping our plans off to him tomorrow, and he said he needs our soil report too..... Custom European Cabinets - Melbourne Kitchen Specialist PM for business details as website currently being updated! Our Crazy Owner Builder Journey! Re: what is engineering? 4Jan 18, 2010 9:03 pm The engineer will take the results of the soil test and look at the design of the house and say what kind of footings your house will require (stumps/slab and what kind, piering etc) and will probably have some kind of say in regards to the structure of the frame and roof beams as well I presume 'A bottle of wine contains more philosophy than all the books in the world.' Louis Pasteur Vegie garden: viewtopic.php?f=19&t=27637&start=0 My Backyard Adventure Re: what is engineering? 5Jan 18, 2010 9:53 pm Having engineering in our family on both sides, I can tell you that Engineers are a bunch of blokes and sometimes girls who stand around in groups wearing hard hats and nice shirts at the same time. They do lots of pointing and hold onto cardboard tubes. They then retreat to dark places in boxes nearby to draw pictures and make scratchings on paper that mean something. There are other engineers that sit in look outs very high up in buildings looking out at all the other engineering projects they have built or wish they had. One thing is common with Engineers, they like Mechano and are generally good at making things from it. Some like to use string in ways never thought possible to hold complex structures together somehow. Others are good with Lego. Very interesting bunch those Engineers Re: what is engineering? 6Jan 18, 2010 9:53 pm ^^ Pretty much what Lisanne said...at a minimum they will design the slab/foundations et al...at the most they may have to do comps on any specials. ritab25 Our builder has told us that the engineering report for our block was completed last week yet they only received the results of our soil test today. Does this make any sense? Yeah...it is kinda @rse about...unless they already knew what the results would be. Depending on the tester they can give a preliminary indication. Other than that engineers just play on calculators and rearrange pens in their pocket protectors... mmm....donuts Homer Simpson 1956- Links: Site Costs Ready Reckoner | H1 Addiction Medical Advice | Château TDL: The Backyard Re: what is engineering? 7Jan 18, 2010 10:11 pm Fu Manchu Having engineering in our family on both sides, I can tell you that Engineers are a bunch of blokes and sometimes girls who stand around in groups wearing hard hats and nice shirts at the same time. They do lots of pointing and hold onto cardboard tubes. They then retreat to dark places in boxes nearby to draw pictures and make scratchings on paper that mean something. There are other engineers that sit in look outs very high up in buildings looking out at all the other engineering projects they have built or wish they had. One thing is common with Engineers, they like Mechano and are generally good at making things from it. Some like to use string in ways never thought possible to hold complex structures together somehow. Others are good with Lego. Very interesting bunch those Engineers You forgot the beer!! Or is that a Melb Uni engineer student specific thing that they could be found at the pub most days?!?! 'A bottle of wine contains more philosophy than all the books in the world.' Louis Pasteur Vegie garden: viewtopic.php?f=19&t=27637&start=0 My Backyard Adventure Re: what is engineering? 8Jan 18, 2010 10:23 pm I should probably take a step back and explain a little about the background of the situation. Our builder commisioned a soil test and we were informed that the soil test report had come in. When I queried them as to when the test was performed I was told it was the same day the report was generated (??nobody in the building world works that fast!!). So off to the block I went to find no sign of bore holes whatsoever....hard to believe on a flat, naked block that had apparently just been tested, especially when I could stand on my block and pick out other blocks which had been recently tested by eye. I know it was not done in the week prior either as we or our future neighbours were up there on most days checking our blocks. Since the soil test...from now on known as phantom soil test added considerable cost to our site cost we queried this again with the builder. The arrangement which was made was that they would solicit another soil test from a totally different company. If results were the same as previous test we would pay for the new test, if it was different then the builder would bear the cost. I should also add that there is another couple building just up the road from us with the same builder, who also had a phantom soil test and made the same arrangement. I think that complaints from 2 clients definately helped our case. We both suggested to the builder that they send out a representative to see for themselves that no soil test was done in the first instance....well that didnt happen! We were also told that if we were able to provide a current compaction report then this might help reduce any cost. So as of last week we got the new compaction report only to be told that it was irrelevant (??) and that everything had been accounted for and the engineering was complete. Fast forward to today and the next soil test comes back...completely different from the previous one. The phantom test stated we had fill to 1m. The new test says we have fill to only 10cm! Phantom test had us with P class soil, new test has us at H. Am I correct in assuming that the engineering which was completed last week is most likely incorrect(especially if based on phantom soil test and needs to be redone? Just as an interesting aside, our real soil test was done on the 18th december and I am still able to point out the site of the bore holes a month later. Re: what is engineering? 9Jan 18, 2010 10:34 pm ritab25 Just as an interesting aside, our real soil test was done on the 18th december and I am still able to point out the site of the bore holes a month later. I don't know much about the other stuff, but in the report they should have a map of your block which shows where on the block the soil tests were done, you can ask to see that - I got given a copy of mine. 'A bottle of wine contains more philosophy than all the books in the world.' Louis Pasteur Vegie garden: viewtopic.php?f=19&t=27637&start=0 My Backyard Adventure Re: what is engineering? 10Jan 18, 2010 10:42 pm also an aside - How much did they sting you for belting a penetrometer into the ground 8 times? ( a few more) Where you are coming from is where you are going to... Re: what is engineering? 11Jan 19, 2010 7:19 am lisanne ritab25 Just as an interesting aside, our real soil test was done on the 18th december and I am still able to point out the site of the bore holes a month later. I don't know much about the other stuff, but in the report they should have a map of your block which shows where on the block the soil tests were done, you can ask to see that - I got given a copy of mine. I do have this for the soil test that was not done. They even managed to generate a report on the results they got but I can state with 100% certainty that this test was never done. I also have the same info for the new soil test and sure enough there is still 1 month later evidence of where the bore holes were drilled. Onc I am not paying for the new soil test. Since the results varied so much from the one that was supposedly done before this they now have to bear the cost of the retest, that was the arrangement we made with them. I am now interested to see if there is any follow up to this. Re: what is engineering? 12Jan 19, 2010 7:35 am lisanne You forgot the beer!! Or is that a Melb Uni engineer student specific thing that they could be found at the pub most days?!?! That is specific to civil engineers...I went to RMIT and the students would spend so much money at the pub across the road the uni bought it. mmm....donuts Homer Simpson 1956- Links: Site Costs Ready Reckoner | H1 Addiction Medical Advice | Château TDL: The Backyard Re: what is engineering? 13Jan 19, 2010 7:40 am ritab25 I should probably take a step back and explain a little about the background of the situation. Our builder commisioned a soil test and we were informed that the soil test report had come in. When I queried them as to when the test was performed I was told it was the same day the report was generated (??nobody in the building world works that fast!!). Not inconceivable....slab designs are pretty much cookie cutters now...once you know the class they would already have standard drawings particularly for a standard house. ritab25 So off to the block I went to find no sign of bore holes whatsoever....hard to believe on a flat, naked block that had apparently just been tested, especially when I could stand on my block and pick out other blocks which had been recently tested by eye. Boreholes should be backfilled...but there should be some indication. As for the rest of the tale of woe it seems you've caught out the builder...lesson...be very watchful through the rest of the build. mmm....donuts Homer Simpson 1956- Links: Site Costs Ready Reckoner | H1 Addiction Medical Advice | Château TDL: The Backyard Re: what is engineering? 14Jan 19, 2010 7:42 am Oh and don't sully "engineers" with the poor practices of builders...we may be geeky but we have feelings... mmm....donuts Homer Simpson 1956- Links: Site Costs Ready Reckoner | H1 Addiction Medical Advice | Château TDL: The Backyard Re: what is engineering? 15Jan 19, 2010 7:50 am to_do_list Oh and don't sully "engineers" with the poor practices of builders...we may be geeky but with have feelings... I dont blame the engineers at all, after all they can only work with the information that they are given. Im a career geek too, just with test tubes instead of calculators Re: what is engineering? 16Jan 19, 2010 9:42 am to_do_list lisanne You forgot the beer!! Or is that a Melb Uni engineer student specific thing that they could be found at the pub most days?!?! That is specific to civil engineers...I went to RMIT and the students would spend so much money at the pub across the road the uni bought it. Ahhh I remember it well (fellow RMIT student) 'A bottle of wine contains more philosophy than all the books in the world.' Louis Pasteur Vegie garden: viewtopic.php?f=19&t=27637&start=0 My Backyard Adventure Re: what is engineering? 17Jan 19, 2010 10:09 am lisanne to_do_list lisanne You forgot the beer!! Or is that a Melb Uni engineer student specific thing that they could be found at the pub most days?!?! That is specific to civil engineers...I went to RMIT and the students would spend so much money at the pub across the road the uni bought it. Ahhh I remember it well (fellow RMIT student) Ah-hah....knew there was a quality of character about you... mmm....donuts Homer Simpson 1956- Links: Site Costs Ready Reckoner | H1 Addiction Medical Advice | Château TDL: The Backyard Re: what is engineering? 18Jan 19, 2010 2:28 pm Fu Manchu Having engineering in our family on both sides, I can tell you that Engineers are a bunch of blokes and sometimes girls who stand around in groups wearing hard hats and nice shirts at the same time. They do lots of pointing and hold onto cardboard tubes. They then retreat to dark places in boxes nearby to draw pictures and make scratchings on paper that mean something. There are other engineers that sit in look outs very high up in buildings looking out at all the other engineering projects they have built or wish they had. One thing is common with Engineers, they like Mechano and are generally good at making things from it. Some like to use string in ways never thought possible to hold complex structures together somehow. Others are good with Lego. Very interesting bunch those Engineers I'm glad you put that last bit in, as the rest was starting to get me going. But I am the type of engineer that spends all day at a computer, or was as I was headhunted into another department. One other thing that you may find could be classified in the engineering is also the site survey. Oh, and the beer wasn't isolated to Melb Uni either Some people don't have time to do the job right the first time, but seem to have plenty of time to fix their mistakes. Build Thread Re: what is engineering? 19Jan 19, 2010 3:08 pm www.themaxbuild.blogspot.com forum.homeone.com.au/viewtopic.php?f=31&t=20717&start=300 www.leahspaperpassion.blogspot.com Re: what is engineering? 20Jan 19, 2010 3:24 pm We are not amused.... mmm....donuts Homer Simpson 1956- Links: Site Costs Ready Reckoner | H1 Addiction Medical Advice | Château TDL: The Backyard Assuming you've modelled the TB8, TB10, TB12, TB2 & J1 joists/LVLs there, it appears as per drawing to me. There maybe should be an additional J1 between TB10 and T12 if… 3 31852 Thanks for all replies. I just noticed now the pictures I added to post right on top of page were wrong. I attached pictures showing "current" and my "suggested" floor… 9 14652 |