Browse Forums General Discussion Re: sea level in Victoria 3Nov 30, 2009 10:03 pm Thanks for reply. The articel that you posted is talking about Sydney, my one about Melbourne. Now, I'm not sure if I should build on my land - I would like to inherit it to my kids. Or just don't care about it? live goes on? Re: sea level in Victoria 4Dec 01, 2009 12:18 pm The answer to your question is no more difficult than putting on a pair of pants. Renovation Thread: viewtopic.php?f=31&t=38489 Re: sea level in Victoria 5Dec 01, 2009 2:26 pm Interesting question. I was down at Queenscliff on the weekend at a mate's place. He lives in a renovated fishermans cottage down near the Ferry dock. They have had water at the door of their back shen a few times in the last 2 years due to king tides. He is about 1 metre above sea level (high tide) and feels that the value of his property has dropped about 30%. (the house at the very end of his street sold for just over $1,100,000 about 2 years ago. About 2 months ago it sold for about $750,000). I argued with him saying the average punter is not really thinking about these things yet but the commissioned research IS getting more and more airplay. I do think it will increasingly become a factor for properties in those areas that have been designated likely to be threatened by king tides and severe weather in the future. Re: sea level in Victoria 6Dec 01, 2009 11:12 pm The Australian is Murdoch and prone to "Americanized" opinion. The stats they are using are from the last 100 years. Yes the numbers they quote are correct, the average is 17mm over the entire 100 years. But that like America quote "convenient" numbers that buisiness wants to hear. America for instance will take temp readings from the ground in several places and this shows cooling over the last 10 years. What they didn't do was account for the cooling. Its getting warmer so the colder air from Canada is gaining strength, this air current flows from Seattle to Florida. It brings Ice storms in winter and Tornadoes in summer. The cooling America is getting is because of the air stream getting stronger because its attempting to counter balance the heating along the tropics. The Air in the tropics rises, something must replace it. Use your best instincts. I can only give you the logic... Ice is melting - go figure it out.. The ice in Antarctica is 4kl high. That is if you were to walk out your back door in the middle of Antarctica you would be looking up 4 kl of ice wall to see the sky. And this is melting.... America will get more far destructive Tornadoes even further north than usual. The Ice storms will double in intensity, frequency and duration. Anyone living on a river flat in Central USA is going to see several floods of 4 meters of more in their lifetime. Eventually these floods will render the river flats useless and sterile so no more Corn. Most of Florida will disappear and Hurricanes will shatter the South East coastline. The tropics around the islands from Panama to Florida and Miami will cook reaching temps exceeding 35 degrees. Nothing can live in water that hot..well jelly fish can... Once the water gets that hot most of the islands themselves will become toxic and uninhabitable. Cuba is doomed. Fungi will flourish as too will Algae, most of it toxic. Red Marine Algae is toxic to breath and deadly to all sea life. Blooms are already beginning to flourish in both American waters and African waters with blooms off Queensland and Victoria east coast. It sucks the remaining oxygen from the water rendering it toxic to sea life, it produces an alkaloid toxin that affects the nervous system, kind of like Blue green algae in fresh water. Cyano bacteria eats CO2 and metabolizes Oxygen, its how we got here in fact... Re: sea level in Victoria 7Dec 02, 2009 7:29 am "The sky is falling !" No wait, I mean: "The sea is rising !" Or maybe both. And it might get a lot hotter too. But first it might get a bit colder. Or maybe really cold. But probably quite hot. Well, most places will be hot. Some might be colder, or wetter, and some might be hotter and wetter, or hotter and drier. And some might be hotter and drier and then later in the year colder and wetter, or maybe vice versa. And that's for 100% certain. Do the hard jobs first. The easy jobs will take care of themselves. - Dale Carnegie Re: sea level in Victoria 8Dec 03, 2009 1:10 am Its just not going to be nice. My fear is not water, energy or food. My fear is people, politicians and storms that turn houses into matchsticks. Primarily people, most will have their wits and deal with it, others will do stupid things. Governments are going to be the same, some on the level others completely stupid. Labors ETS = Stupid. Why ban coal if people are still using it? Why not just change the supply? Too hard? If you need a tax to raise the money to alter the power grid to work entirely from renewables (can be done) then why not just do that? Why penalise people for breathing, eating and keeping food cold? If you tax people then how do they save to buy the solar kit that will save us all from this impending mess we may very well be facing? A single hot water system runing on solar primarily is enough of a start yet is it mandatory? No, it isn't! Politicians are fools! They see the target like meat hanging from the rope and away they go to get it. They never see the trap, just the meat... problem - reaction - solution = excuse to tax people! Re: sea level in Victoria 9Dec 03, 2009 1:30 am I am building in Cairns and the elevation (AMSL) of my land is 22 metres. I looked at some land that was 7 metres above mean sea level and decided for higher ground. Some land for sale is even under 5 metres. I would suggest a 10 metre point is quite safe. Do your research before you buy. Use a GPS with elevation/altitude mode or use Google earth to detrmin the elevation AMSL If you dont have google earth download it http://earth.google.com/#utm_campaign=e ... tion%20map Re: sea level in Victoria 10Dec 03, 2009 2:03 am Being new here I don't want to upset apple carts unnecessarily; but... this one is rife for trouble. Consider: There are rivers and streams and other water courses in Victoria (and Australia) which have had established paths, estimated maximum flows and similar; backed up by data from more than 100 years. Sometimes those paths change as part of a natural progression in the water course's life. In some of those areas, building activity is restricted, and in some cases prohibited, because of flood potential. Municipalities can be held, in some form, responsible for people tripping over footpaths. I find it hard to believe that a government body would expose itself to a risk such as allowing an individual or organisation to invest in and improve property in an area "known" to be subject to king tides, flooding and/or inundation. Yes, circumstances can and will change; but unless you're a fan of Nostradamus and/or the 21/12/10 theories; it's calculated risk. The best test I believe is to call an insurance company. If they won't insure the property (and/or improvements to the property), maybe there's something in it. Them asking for "additional premiums" because it's seaside property probably isn't enough to worry about; there's water involved. Insurers are the first to react to increased risk - it's their job. If they're not worried and are happy to take your cash; be at peace - at least the investment is insured? - Land registered 27/11/09, settlement 22/01/10 - Currently doing the rounds of display homes. Re: sea level in Victoria 11Dec 03, 2009 7:42 am Quote: Being new here I don't want to upset apple carts unnecessarily; but... this one is rife for trouble. Consider: There are rivers and streams and other water courses in Victoria (and Australia) which have had established paths, estimated maximum flows and similar; backed up by data from more than 100 years. Sometimes those paths change as part of a natural progression in the water course's life. In some of those areas, building activity is restricted, and in some cases prohibited, because of flood potential. Municipalities can be held, in some form, responsible for people tripping over footpaths. I find it hard to believe that a government body would expose itself to a risk such as allowing an individual or organisation to invest in and improve property in an area "known" to be subject to king tides, flooding and/or inundation. Yes, circumstances can and will change; but unless you're a fan of Nostradamus and/or the 21/12/10 theories; it's calculated risk. The best test I believe is to call an insurance company. If they won't insure the property (and/or improvements to the property), maybe there's something in it. Them asking for "additional premiums" because it's seaside property probably isn't enough to worry about; there's water involved. Insurers are the first to react to increased risk - it's their job. If they're not worried and are happy to take your cash; be at peace - at least the investment is insured? I am in the insurance game and I can tell you - climate change is the NUMBER 1 concern of insurers everywhere. In Australia insurers generally do not provide flood cover full stop. Severe storm damage is getting harder to buy. But these matters really miss the point. Even if climate change never delivers the sort of results experts are predicting, about 50% of the population THINK it will. That is 50% of the property buyers market will have concerns about purchasing a property in an area designated as prone to tidal flooding. Now you do not need to do the maths to work out that if you take away 50% of the market then prices and resale values will be affected. Re: sea level in Victoria 12Dec 06, 2009 7:05 am Melrich [ I am in the insurance game and I can tell you - climate change is the NUMBER 1 concern of insurers everywhere. In Australia insurers generally do not provide flood cover full stop. Just changed my house insurance over to Westpac since they offer varying levels of insurance AND cover for flood. And I am glad I did since Melb got hit by a freaky storm around 2 weeks ago and two rooms in my place got flooded! Already had assessor out & damage is covered. My only expense is $500 excess Re: sea level in Victoria 13Dec 12, 2009 11:10 pm Not sure what an ice burg off the West coast will do but temp gradients in water that are extreme make for some interesting weather. The Northern hemisphere will again cop the brunt of this but east coast Aus is not immune. Global warming will increase these gradients in some places, not others. This will affect tidal surges. Re: sea level in Victoria 14Dec 13, 2009 11:49 am The climate has always changed and sea levels have risen for a long long time. It was only 13,000 years ago that Tasmania was physically joined to the mainland, so look at how much sea levels have already risen in that relatively short amount of time. If sea levels continue to rise and it becomes a problem, then we have to adapt to it, that's all. It's no big deal. Geoff - Decophile. Re: sea level in Victoria 15Dec 13, 2009 2:46 pm This is true but there are many factors as to why. Pole progression or the movement of the planets axis has progressed steadily since forever. Canada/ Alaska used to be nearer to the pole than it is now not more than 12,000 years ago. Add an ice age and that land mass has held a great deal of water not unlike what Antarctica is presently doing. 4kl deep ice makes for quite a volume of water, even today in Canada there are massive scars where ice sheets simply let go and slid and that was only 8000 years ago. The other factor is the Earth itself has steadily gained mass since it was first accumulated 6 billion years ago. Its nearly 3 times the size it was when the sun first went critical and has doubled since life began. This accumulation of mass is visible on all planets. The Earth receives about 44 tonnes of matter every month or so (shooting stars) of which ice and water make up 30%. The planet is gaining a sea level rise of 1mm annually which is offset by the accumulation of other mass, metals and silicates. The water volume ratio is increasing steadily though as heavier materials compact down and compress. The biggest impact of the last 100,000 years has been ice ages. Even Bendigo has has several glaciers and in wetter times the entire state of Victoria is actually rolling hills surrounded by permanent lakes. Lake Eppalock has deep scars in rocks formed by glaciers and Bendigo sits at the head of one of many carved valleys. Most of Bendigo district is gravel and those granite rocks around Lake Eppalock don't even belong there. There is a valley to the east where giant granite boulders scoured the underlying rock and both are still visible. The Granite came from Stawell - Ararat tracking NE. Even the Grampians have sheets of rock that were gouged by glaciers. Expand that knowledge to include South Africa and Chile. Include Northern USA, great lakes, rocky mountains and even as far south as Cali and you have 1/100th of the ocean sitting on land mass. The theory is when the southern Canadian ice sheets gave way, those including Yellowstone and Montana scours, New York scours the volume of fresh water entering the ocean shut down the ocean currents and that caused the last ice age. The cold decade in Europe 100 years or so ago was produced most likely by volcanic soot from a SE Asian volcano, a super volcano or similar. Re: sea level in Victoria 17Dec 14, 2009 8:44 am Melrich Quote: It's no big deal. It is when you live close to sea level. Yes I imagine it would be. What an interesting topic. www.themaxbuild.blogspot.com forum.homeone.com.au/viewtopic.php?f=31&t=20717&start=300 www.leahspaperpassion.blogspot.com Re: sea level in Victoria 18Dec 14, 2009 11:13 am Melrich Quote: It's no big deal. It is when you live close to sea level. People have ALWAYS lived close to sea level. A couple of hundred years ago when settlement began around coastal Australia, there is absolutely no doubt that the people establishing buildings there thought that the sea level at the time was a constant. If the science was there at the time to warn them to build on slightly higher ground it would still only be a matter of time until the same issues occurred. In other words, it is our generation that has suddenly become 'potentially' caught out. I'm of the opinion that many people think that rising sea levels is a phenomenon that has only occurred since they were born. Geoff - Decophile. Re: sea level in Victoria 19Dec 14, 2009 7:57 pm This is crazy!!! Point Cook being swallowed up the sea? haha give me a break. Alamanda one of the closest estates in Point Cook to the ocean and it at its lowest point is 6.5m above sea level. How on earth is a 1.5m rise in sea levels going to do anything but increase the value of these properties? Seems like a media beatup to me. 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