^ Bearing in mind that building new houses is a significant way to drive the economy, therefore maintaining our relatively affluent society for our children and grandchildren to live in...

I certainly do not advocate that everyone has to build a Mcmansion to attain this. Everybody should live within their means, whatever it is. But if a person was to build a larger house with a larger roof to enable a larger solar panel system to be fitted to it for example, and that system exported electricity most of the time, doesn't the whole world benefit?

We are looking at blocks around 700sqm and they are the large blocks that are being subdivided! And by the way yes we are going to build a large 4br house on it and I'm still hoping for more than a handkerchief of lawn.

when I was growing up in Brisbane, the standard suburban block was 800-900sqm. Now they are being subdivided into 2 lots (400-450sqm) and anything over 500sqm is considered large.

Then is that why we should be sharing houses, even after we grow up? I know there are certainly adults that should learn how to share. The push to 'spread your wings' is what is driving demand for more space and housing - leading to all those things in the rest of your post.

The default shouldn't be to move out, it should be to stay in. Moving out as you say just consumes more resources and I'm sure an extra ensuite in and effort to keep a house together is going to consume much less resources than building a whole new house to put it in.

Well maybe we just have an exceptionally close family and also want that for our kids. Our inlaws have just built a house directly in front of us, my parents live around the corner as does my sister. I lived at home until I was 25 and my husband was 30.

We both travelled extensively and I was able to buy a house, he land and then build.

Without the support of our families we wouldn't be in the position we are now. If we can do the same for our kids so be it.

(and ps I was one of 3 girls living in a 9sq home with my parents. It taught me not a lot more then how squishy it is to share bedrooms and 1 bathroom).

Very well said.

To the people who choose to build and live in McMansions....

Reminds me of a song.....Can Get Lonely in My Mansion :
Goes a bit like this........

This is my home,
Probably cost more than all of ancient Rome.
(Still I’m alone.)
No one to float
With me in my pool or my lake, or my moat.

Some abodes, they make people coo,
Make them buzz. Some Xanadu,
Mine Xanadoesn’t intrigue the town.
No one will ride on my merry-go-round.
(No one.)

They run away.
It never ends.
And all I have
Are gargoyle friends.

So beautifully carved
Out of volcanic stone.
(Still I’m alone.)
All they can do
Is fountain the wine from the winemaking room.

I presume that everyone’s mad.
Just tonight, the gala I had
Was a delight, but nobody came.
It must be their fault, who else can I blame?
(No one.)

They run away.
It never ends.
And all I have
Are gargoyle friends.

The things I build
Do not impress
The outside world.
It hurts me, yes.

It can get lonely… (Lonely in my mansion.)
Yes, it can get lonely in my mansion.
They run away,
It never ends.

It can get lonely… (Lonely in my mansion.)
Yes, it can get lonely in my mansion.
When all I have
Are gargoyle friends.
Do-de-do-de-do-deh-deh, do-de-do-de-do-deh!
Do-de-do-de-do-deh-deh, do-de-do-de-do-deh!
Shut up.
Fine.

This is my home,
Probably cost more than all of ancient Rome.
(Still I’m alone.)
No one to float
With me in my pool or my lake, or my moat.

Some abodes, they make people coo,
Make them buzz. Some Xanadu,
Mine Xanadoesn’t intrigue the town.
No one will ride on my merry-go-round.
(No one.)

They run away.
It never ends.
And all I have
Are gargoyle friends.

So beautifully carved
Out of volcanic stone.
(Still I’m alone.)
All they can do
Is fountain the wine from the winemaking room.

I presume that everyone’s mad.
Just tonight, the gala I had
Was a delight, but nobody came.
It must be their fault, who else can I blame?
(No one.)

They run away.
It never ends.
And all I have
Are gargoyle friends.

The things I build
Do not impress
The outside world.
It hurts me, yes.

It can get lonely… (Lonely in my mansion.)
Yes, it can get lonely in my mansion.
They run away,
It never ends.

It can get lonely… (Lonely in my mansion.)
Yes, it can get lonely in my mansion.
When all I have
Are gargoyle friends.


Pat.

You only live once, so let's indulge for today, and leave the worrying to our grandchildren. They will fix up our mistakes. They will adapt through Darwinian selection and technological advancement...if there is still a planet left to be saved.

I can just picture the 'tree huggers' and 'save the whales' groups cringing their teeth.

I can just picture the 'tree huggers' and 'save the whales' groups cringing their teeth.[/quote]

Isn't that a mixed metaphor, like "it's not rocket surgery?"

And I like gargoyles. They help provide safe passage between the realms (for those who travel to such places). Not me, my name is not Shirley MacLaine.

In a perfect world it would be great if people could ascertain their budget, then, within that budget
(whatever it may be) build a house:
of a size that allows a design individual to the block (for maximum energy efficiency)
in a suburb close to their work or school or with access to good public transport (to minimize use of cars)
with as many locally and sustainably produced materials as possible.

Generally, this would require a smaller house than what you would get with a generic build as the design fees are higher, as are the costs for materials from local and sustainable sources.

Not only good for the environment, but also good for the economy, as you are supporting local product

It is the cost of land that is the problem, not the material cost of the dwelling itself. Because of the constant stream of people heading to the CBD for their jobs, if you want your own house then you are forced to pay a million bucks to buy a house close to and with good links to the city, or something for less than half of that near the fringe, with all the associated social and environmental pitfalls. Most people have no choice.

Decentralisation is the answer, even if it is only within the metro area. Main suburbs like (in the Melbourne area) Box Hill or Ringwood should be developed with mega-high rises, both residential and commercial, to help spread the load. Populist Greenies such as the sometimes resident Geoffrey Rush should have no say in the proposed developments of genteel suburbs either, just because it might impinge ever so slightly on the view from ye olde 1/4 acre block establishments close to the city that no-one can afford anyway. An 8-storey high rise on top of a heritage listed railway station 10 k's from the city? Yep, go for it, say I.

McMansions happen because it is more affordable for people to build their creature comforts within the walls of their new homes on the fringe of suburbia, compared to the comfort of having enviable amenities on hand from living in close-in suburbs.

Like the development of the car park at Caulfield racecourse into high rise
Yes, decent urban planning in Australia would be a good start. High density living based around well planned, shared outdoor / recreation areas, close to transport and amenities.

Yes, definitely high density mega high rise is more eco friendly like those in NY, Tokyo, HK, Shanghai, and Singapore.... NIMBY - just not in my backyard thanks.

And the problem continues...

I like the idea of having a larger house with enough space around you so your not tripping over each other but some of these excessively larger houses are just ridiculous.
What kid needs their very own ensuite (with 2 vanity basins) hanging off their overly inflated double garage sized bedroom? What a way to teach greed and selfishness to your children. No excuses. Even if youv'e got the money to do so. Go and help someone that lives in a box or someone that's dying unnecessarily cos they need money for medical assistance etc....

Im 36 and have lived in small crappy houses all my life. Being in this situation has never prompted me to want to live in an over sized mansion. I just want to be comfortable and this will be good enough for my family too. If the kids have to argue about using the bathroom then so be it. Its good for them!!

Why do people have to be so judgmental?
Personally I don't want five bathrooms in my house, but we have neighbors who built one of thoe houses because they have three daughters and they want them to live at home as adults. With housing becoming less and less affordable, this could be considered good forward planning as it will function well as a multigenerational home.

The problem is that people go and build a McMansion in a suburb 10km from the city, where high density properties are needed, and then use this selfishness to justify their wants over the needs of the many.

It's all good if people want large homes, but they can do that further from the central business districts. High density housing is required as you get closer to major capital cities. If you choose to have a low-density dwelling close to the CBD, then you need to put up with what's good for the masses. Go nuts building your massive properties in Cranbourne, Keilor etc. You don't see them popping up in Collingwood and Brunswick for good reason.

I wish there were better integration of different housing types in the same suburb. So rather than simply a suburb of 3-4 bedrooms houses only, there should be a mix of mid-level apartments (1,2,3 & 4 bed), a variety of townhouses and freestanding houses & lots of parks. Because what has effectively happened in Sydney is that people are growing old in empty 4 bedroom houses but they won't move because it is next to impossible to find a smaller residence in the same suburb. I have seen this many times with my parent's friends and my IL's social circle. They have houses that are now too big for them (empty nesters), but they are not going to downsize because it would mean leaving the suburb that they have lived in for the past 30+ years. And you can't blame them. As a result, it is hard for new families to get into the suburb, so they look further out, still building a 3-5 bedroom homes.

You'll also find that there a number of older suburbs quite close to the CBD's that will fight tooth & nail to stop apartment buildings & subdivision from occurring in their suburb, regardless of what is best for "the masses". Where I used to live (in Malvern East, Vic), there were very few rentals. Nearly all were on large house blocks (close to a quarter acre) & owner-occupied. The median house price for the area remained high, largely because of these factors. Its an unfortunate fact that very few people want to live next to an apartment block (particularly if mainly rental ), so as a consequence, the area around it devalues when this happens. I'm not being prejudiced, I'm simply stating a fact. I think it is inevitable that these suburbs will eventually submit to high density housing, & become a thing of the past, but at the same time, I understand the occupiers of these suburb's reluctance to embrace it with open arms.

What, they still cant share a bathroom? Its a small price to pay for mooching of your parents dont you think?
How is that helping them learn to achieve anything on their own and appreciate the reward of their own efforts?
Also, kids living at home as adults has a bit if a "loser" vibe to it. How embarrassing for the kids as young adults.

Children are so babied and week and reliant on their mummies and daddies these days....

Kez...chicken. There can be areas of all types of housing within one suburb. People's reluctance to have high density housing near them is based on the assumption that they are mostly rentals and therefore attract a certain type of resident.
This is not the case. There is a new higher density housing complex smack bang in the middle of malvern, right on indulgence street (High St). From the board it is aimed at older (retiree) residents and they are not cheap.
I doubt they will be attracting any 'rabble' but allow long term residents of Malvern to stay in their suburb when they need to downsize, or have less property maintenance.

Kjag, it is not judgemental. Again, if all the matwerials for the construction of the house you refer to come from the site, and all energy it will consume is produced on site, and all toxins produced are offset....no problem.
But if not, it IS a community issue. No man is an island.
While children may stay at home in a separate self conatined units (ie 3 apartments over 3 levels containing 3 generations, such as in Europe), it is probably wishful thinking of parents to think all grown up children will want to stay in a house shared with their parents.